Anyone in the commercial property leasing biz? I'm having a bit of a tough time finding something that fits my needs, and I can't wrap my mind around how Loopnet.com and the like exist.

If you're not familiar with Loopnet, they specialize in commercial properties for sale and lease around the country. Many (if not all) of the commercial properties around Raleigh are listed there. Seems like a great resource, right? Well, not only do you have to register (free, give your email) just to look, you have to pay hundreds of dollars to see the vast majority of what is listed. Just to look. And you have to pay to list.

Now, for whatever reason, this flies in the face of every other website that lists things for sale. Everywhere else it's free to look. Even match.com has free weekends.

Also, I've seen a few properties that may work, and I've reached out to some brokers, but getting more than one word answers from the brokers over the internet is very rare.

Anyone in the business care to help me understand why there is not a free marketplace to showcase properties for sale....I thought the idea was to get the product out there in front of as many eyes as possible to get it sold/leased. But maybe I've missed something obvious.

2/26/2015 8:05:38 PM

PM sent

2/26/2015 9:04:57 PM

I, too, am interested in this.

2/26/2015 9:28:29 PM

I think there are commercial brokers on here. I do not deal with commercial.

To answer your question though, the commercial real estate community has zero interest in handing over all of their data to companies like Zillow, Trulia, Redfin, HomeFinder, etc so they can not only profit from the data, but also charge the agents for getting inquiries on their own listings.

In residential all the info is free to the consumer, the agents are the ones paying to maintain the big websites by paying for advertising and leads. The consumer pays nothing and gets all the data. Loopnet is aggregating data just like Zillow and Trulia, but you as the customer have to pay to see it. My advice would be find a commercial agent that has access to the data and get a good relationship going with them.

Listing data for commercial properties is not as centralized as residential either. Pretty much any residential home listed for sale goes on the local MLS and is syndicated all over the web, not so with commercial property.

There is actually serious push-back going on right now against Zillow in residential. The largest real estate firm in the Carolinas, Allen Tate, has cut their data feed off to Zillow in the Charlotte market. (which they dominate) It costs money and resources to provide this data, Zillow figured out how to present it well and profit, but they cut the actual furnishers of the info out of the deal.

2/27/2015 12:01:08 AM

I'm a commercial broker...at the very least, I can run a search for you. If you need representation and aren't looking for 500 SF, then I'd be happy to assist you as well.

2/27/2015 12:45:15 AM

^^ But it isn't just Zillow anymore. There are about three other websites that I use other than/in addition to Zillow when I'm searching for homes...with each having advantages over the other (I personally prefer realtor.com). So is that guy going after all of those websites?

In regards to commercial real estate, would I be wrong in saying that I feel like commercial property holders want to keep their information private? I've only had a few dozen experiences with commercial property on the legal side, but from what I've seen, commercial leases are all over the place. It's not like residential where you can compare and contrast all of the neighboring properties and the prices don't differ much. I've seen large difference in prices for stuff on the same block. I know there are lots of variables, but I know I've pissed off a couple building owners in lease negotiations when I've stated, "look man, I know 123 Sesame St is leasing for $30sq/ft...so we need to get a lot closer to that to get this deal done." I don't think they want a zillow-like website.

2/27/2015 9:58:58 AM

Well I've never been a fan or Zillow and Trulia. Too many scams, houses listed for sale that aren't really, and vice versa. I'll ride by a house with a realtors sign out front, go to Zillow and its not there. If that site can make money, I'm in the wrong business. Realtor.com is slightly better, and I believe will win out.

And as far as Zillow/Trulia goes, how does it cost Allen Tate money to list on Zillow? I thought the idea of Zillow was to just pull the MLS listings, that are already out there for free, and sell ads? Posting on Zillow requires extra time and money?

I'm not asking for a Zillow like site for commercial properties, but why is Loopnet a pay to search model? No one else selling anything online does that. Commercial brokers are handing over they data, its just being handing it over to a website that charges people to look AND to list. The data is out there, so what is the difference? I thought the name of the game was to get as many eyes on the prize as possible and get it moved. As soon as I pay the fee, I see all the properties and can get all the pricing data I want. Without paying I wouldn't even know the property was available, much less what it costs.

I'm just looking for a small place to lease, possibly buy in the future, that has certain few things as far as zoning and the like. For a side gig, so I reach out to the internet, like you do, and am instantly taken back to 1983 when you had to know the right people and say the right things to get in the club.

Appreciate the replies. I wouldn't think I'd need representation, I'm just looking something small. I found a few places on the internet and reached out to the brokers. They told me what they had wouldn't work, so I asked if they knew of anything else. Got zero replies. This happened with 3 different companies.

I understand there isn't a central 'MLS' listing system for commerical. My first question is why not, and my second question is how is there not a site that charges $5-$10 a listing just to get it out there to the masses? Just lists, offers nothing else, but gets eyes on it. Craigslist should get in that game.

[Edited on February 27, 2015 at 11:50 AM. Reason : sdfg]

[Edited on February 27, 2015 at 11:53 AM. Reason : ghj]

2/27/2015 11:48:19 AM

Zillow is free to list FSBO and For Rent by Owner - I have used it for both successfully. They also charge for agents to list themselves so that when you "find out more info" it directs one of those premier agents to you, assuming that you are asking the question because you don't have an agent already. They Also make money on the ads.

Loopnet is a racket. I have tried to list a property for free on there once.

They make their money by charging investors/comm real estate buyers money to become premium. Then, they also try to push sales on the opposite side by making you pay for a premium listing, saying "you missed out on x number of people trying to look at your listing but couldn't because you did not pay to be a premium listing". There will always be people trying to search for free and post for free, and because of that, they try to upsell BOTH sides of the customer base.

2/27/2015 12:50:21 PM

everyone i know uses loopnet

2/27/2015 1:00:47 PM

^well yea, that's the best out there, short of driving around and looking.

Just can't get past the idea that the companies and brokers limit the number of people that view their properties by using Loopnet. The internet exists to get as many eyes on the item as possible as to move it as quickly as possible. And that idea hasn't caught on it the big business that is corporate real estate?

2/27/2015 2:41:37 PM

its a good point. If someone with money and connections came in and built a more usable, cleaner, better-for-the-agent system that could get more eyes on a property, I think it would make loopnet QUICKLY change their tune.

I wonder though ... in the world of commercial real estate, is the pay-to-view system ultimately a built in filter for less serious buyers who would just waste an agents time or a sellers time, or on the free listing side, a serious buyers time. Like the complaint with Zillow - free listings can lead to lack of management of said listing, since there is no incentive to take the listing down.

2/27/2015 2:57:49 PM

if you are actually in commercial real estate the cost for loopnet is negligible

for the consumers, the industry has no incentive to make it easier for people to not use brokers. if anything comes along it will need to be by an industry outsider.

2/27/2015 4:49:49 PM

^

2/27/2015 6:06:55 PM

yea. I think something could be done to either work with (or try to out do) Loopnet that would get the properties out there for free. Maybe I'll look into that.

The reason I'm on the subject is because I'm looking a smaller property for lease for a side gig and don't think I want to pay for a broker due to start up costs and what not. From what I've seen, there isn't much that fits the bill, but I'm sure its out there. I'm not too set on location, but again, I can't see everything. From my little bit of conversations with brokers, I may need certain zoning, but didn't ever get a response.

Who pays the broker fees? (dumb question I know.)

2/27/2015 6:32:44 PM

When I was finding our office I didn't pay the real estate agent anything just to look

2/27/2015 8:17:40 PM

CoStar bought loopnet a year or two ago which didn't help the situation.

Also I'm not sure how it works in NC but in New York most large commercial buildings pay the fee to the broker you're working with. The building will have a comany handling leasing (Newmark, ABS, Two Trees, Cushman).

Most smaller properties in the outer boroughs will not pay and the client is stuck paying all or part. You have to deal directly with the building owner as the client rep. If you're a renter you can go directly to the owners with and deal with no brokers if you have the patients and time and know who to call.



[Edited on February 28, 2015 at 8:17 AM. Reason : Edit]

2/28/2015 8:06:27 AM

PM me your phone numbers and I'll call you Monday/Tuesday and answer any questions you have. I pay $720 annually for Loopnet and our company pays $50K+ for Costar, in addition to several other search portals. Not nearly as centralized as residential MLS

Regarding fees, if it is a listed property, owner pays owner rep, who in turn pays tenant rep.

2/28/2015 11:08:49 PM