I am looking for any suggestions or recommendations on how to go about finding someone who can help my wife and I put together a financial plan and a household budget. We do not have a lot of savings and the focus I am looking for is more on budgetting and less on how to diversify or build a portfolio.

I am looking more for someone who can act as a neutral mediator with our finances. My wife and I have very different financial "personalities", and I am trying to find a neutral party to help us work through our differences and give her a better understanding of our financial goals. It is causing us a lot of problems, and all the financial planners look like they want to sell me something, or are more focused on how to invest.

Any recommendations would be much appreciated!

10/24/2011 11:50:50 AM

I'll help

10/24/2011 11:52:38 AM

if you or anyone else is qualified and seriously offering help, feel free to PM me your credentials and i'll consider it

10/24/2011 11:55:22 AM

What are the issues?

She's a spender, you're a saver?
You're a spender, she's a saver?

10/24/2011 11:58:38 AM

I keep seeing "midget" in the thread title.

10/24/2011 11:59:40 AM

^^^ you don't need someone with "credentials" to help set of a budget (other than making sure that person isn't someone who racks up a lot of debt ). You really need someone who lives a similar lifestyle to you or what you want to live. Honestly a lot of financial planners are less qualified than a good portion of every day people you could talk to about simple budgeting. That's basically because you're right, their job is to try and sell you something or have you invest through them, not set your budget up.

Setting up a budget is easy enough for plenty of people that you should be able to find multiple couples who are good with their money to help you. At the very least, PLEASE do not pay someone to help you with a budget. I would be glad to help as I'm sure plenty of other people on here would be too. The only problem there is that everyone has their own philosophy on how much to spend versus how much to Scrooge McDuck it so it's probably in your benefit to talk to more than one person or couple and weigh the differing opinions.

[Edited on October 24, 2011 at 12:21 PM. Reason : ]

10/24/2011 12:20:46 PM

She's a spender, I'm a saver. We had shared accounst and are now splitting up our finances in hopes that it'll help her get a better understanding of our finances. Typically I have been the one who takes care of the bills, her debts, everything. The situation is pretty complex and personal, the details of which I don't want to go into on here.

10/24/2011 12:22:18 PM

10/24/2011 12:24:02 PM

^^^ the issues isn't that I don't know how to set a budget. The issue is that she has no grasp of a budget and has basically spent away our savings from the last 4 years over the last 3 months. She has all these desires to save for really nice things and to acheive a certain lifestyle, but no concept of how to get there, and it creates a really bad dynamic in our relationship by me having to be the "parent" with our money all the time. The function I am looking for is more of mediation and someone with credentials, more so that SHE feels confident in their assessment, and doesn't just think its me being unreasonable or "Scrooge McDuck" as you say. And we are already seeing a marriage counselor. This was a suggestion of theirs.

[Edited on October 24, 2011 at 12:27 PM. Reason : carrot]

10/24/2011 12:26:26 PM

Sounds like she has "stuffitis".

Really though -- good luck getting this sorted out. It is sad and unfortunate that she won't listen to anyone unless they have "credentials". If she knew how easy it is to get financial planning credentials, she might re-consider that.

[Edited on October 24, 2011 at 12:30 PM. Reason : ]

10/24/2011 12:29:30 PM

Quote :

"The issue is that she has no grasp of a budget and has basically spent away our savings from the last 4 years over the last 3 months"

Holy shit...wtf did she buy?? Any of it returnable? This is kinda inexcusable. Maybe you guys needs to see a marriage counselor in addition to an accountant.

10/24/2011 12:33:10 PM

Create separate bank accounts. This way you'll both know exactly how much money you have at all times.

Create an income report. "What is the minimum amount of money you both bring in per month?" What is the average income per month" What is the maximum amount of money you both bring in per month?"

Create an expense report. "How much money are you both spending each month"

Make a list of needs:

Food:
Electricity:
Car Payment:
Rent/Mortgage:
Cable/Internet:
etc...

Make a list of wants:

go to the movies:
eating out:
partying:
Cable TV:
Netflix:

etc...
"Things you want, but don't need"


Using the minimum amount of income figure you derived, subtract the mandatory bills (mortgage, water, electricity). Use the highest bills you can find for each.

The amount of money left, you can decide how much money you can to spend per month on Food and Clothes and Toiletries, etc...

What's left is play money. You can use it to save for retirement, pay unexpected bills like speeding tickets, or use some of it to have fun. For god sake, don't use ALL of it. You need some for emergencies.

10/24/2011 12:35:50 PM

^^already are. see above. like i said, its pretty complex. more looking for if anyone has had these kinds of issues and who they talked to and how they worked it out.

^i understand how to calculate disposable income, but thanks. the issue is that there's no discipline to keeping to that budget.

[Edited on October 24, 2011 at 12:38 PM. Reason : a]

10/24/2011 12:35:57 PM

The Town of Cary offers a "Budgeting 101" class. It's offered by the Department of Parks, Rec, and Cultural Resources. It's $13 for residents and $18 for non-residents. Since it's being offered by the town I can't imagine they'd be trying to sell you anything. It's a one hour class taught by a CPA. I'd give the department a call and see if they plan on holding it again in the spring (fall class already happened). Their number is 469-4061.

Quote :

"I keep seeing "midget" in the thread title."

Me too

[Edited on October 24, 2011 at 12:44 PM. Reason : a]

10/24/2011 12:38:53 PM

How does your wife react when you approach her about her spending problems?

Does she agree?
Does she deny?
Does she refuse to acknowledge?
Does she actively pursue a solution from you?

10/24/2011 12:45:03 PM

She refuses to acknowledge it, or she'll say that I spend just as much, which is massively untrue and I have the spreadsheets to prove it. But she won't listen to me which is why I was looking for a 3rd party. The best way I can describe it is that its like trying to explain to a dog how to operate the DVR.

10/24/2011 12:50:21 PM

damn, I have no advice but I hope you guys can work things out.


oh and she sounds like nancy cooper

10/24/2011 12:53:17 PM

10/24/2011 12:56:46 PM

Have you tried a budgeting site that breaks down expenditures for you? Mint.com is very helpful when it comes to setting budgets per category. And if you blow the budget in one category, it's very easy to recognize.

Since it's synched to your online banking, it recognizes spending fluctuations with great accuracy.

[Edited on October 24, 2011 at 1:05 PM. Reason : .]

10/24/2011 1:02:26 PM

go ahead and cut your losses and ditch that bitch

10/24/2011 1:02:32 PM

Quote :

"oh and she sounds like nancy cooper"

I was thinking the same thing. Don't let her go out jogging any time soon!

Seriously though, if you're already paying for marriage counseling, has this not been hashed out there? I would imagine your therapist could look at these spreadsheets and say what's up. If not, that class in Cary might be what you're looking for.

10/24/2011 1:04:02 PM

sorry I meant the whole over-spending, won't listen to budgets, husband is always wrong about money etc.

My mom learned the hard way. She never listened to my dad about her spending or having a budget. Everything was put on credit. Eventually they had to file for bankruptcy and it was a big cluster-fuck.

Have you tried http://www.askholly.com/ She's in the Raleigh area, looks like she might be a good place to start, someone objective to look at your income and your spending and figure out where to go from there

10/24/2011 1:05:49 PM

From what I have seen, it's pretty common for married couples to have different financial "personalities" as you called them. The problem here sounds like she doesn't have enough self-awareness to realize that's a weakness of hers and respect you enough to allow you to reign her in a bit. I'd guess that it doesn't matter what kind of budget planner or credentials someone has if she isn't willing to see that first.

Deal with the immaturity first (marriage counseling sounds like a good first step that you are taking), then the symptom of finance issues will resolve itself.

10/24/2011 1:07:34 PM

I have the same problem with the mother of children.

She'll never learn. I have been working with her for the last eight years to try to learn how to spend money efficiently. It's not possible. I'll tell you why.

1) She is lacking the math skills and doing math all the time makes her head hurt (which is required in budgeting - more brainwork... all the time)

2) She doesn't want to make sacrifices (ie. wear something from the thrift store instead of buying brand new)

3) She doesn't want to be bound by a spending limit. If you only have $50 to spend per week, you've gotta use coupons and eat things on special. What she'll want to do: Eat out all the time.

I bet you she often throws away leftovers of a meal.


If the country had it's common sense back, I would say you'll have to force her to do this using your brute power as a man. However, in this country, whenever you use the word "force" you are walking the line of "abuse" :rollsmyeyes:

If this country wasn't so backwards, the solution would be simple. You'd just simply take her paycheck and all the money and take 100% control over the finances. You give her $50 a week to spend on whatever she wants, and everything will be awesome!

Alas, like I said, if you force her to do anything, she could cry to the authorities. The country is messed up.

I'm afraid there is nothing you can do except

1) Try to convince her using words (which is guaranteed to fail)
2) Try to convince her using incentives (which she already spent)

A budget class won't work unless she WANTS to learn how to budget. If she doesn't want to learn, she'll daydream about shopping in the class. It's not like she's being graded.

My best suggestion is to bypass her. Don't waste your time, patience, and diplomacy on her.

Have two bank accounts: One secret and Keep the other one a JOINT bank account. Pull money out of the joint account and say you spent it (when you really didn't) and put it into the secret account. Whatever you do:DO NOT LET HER KNOW ABOUT THE SECRET ACCOUNT!!!!

10/24/2011 1:09:15 PM

My husband and I have a joint bank account where both of our paychecks are deposited into. From that, all of our bills are paid (cell phones, utilities, mortgage etc) and we get a weekly "allowance" deposited into our seperate bank accounts. From that, we use it to buy gas, lunches, clothes, whatever we want to spend our "allowance" on. That may be a good idea for you as your wife seems to be buying stuff using money that needs to be set aside for bills, savings etc. That way, she'll have some $$$ every week in her personal bank account but she's not bankrupting you both.

10/24/2011 1:10:56 PM

thank you minkagrl, i hadn't run across that website. that's the kind of stuff i'm looking for. her fees look pretty steep, and our estate isn't very large, but its worth considering. and thank you to everyone else with the practical advice.

and Fhqwhgads, we are trying to move more towards that model so we'll see how it works. this is going to be a lengthy process that isn't going to happen overnight, and honestly i am not feeling very hopeful at this time, but we'll see how it goes

10/24/2011 1:15:06 PM

Sounds like she's got champagne tastes on a beer budget

But seriously, I really hope things work out for you guys. I know how stressful money situations can be. I'm an avid couponer and couponing has changed my life. I would spend $50-100 every week on on groceries in college and now I can get the exact same products for free. You and her should take a couponing class

10/24/2011 1:17:50 PM

my husband & i have a joint account from which bills and other joint items (groceries, restaurants, movie theater, etc) are paid. we both deposit the same amount automatically each month into that account. whatever's left stays in individual accounts. we have joint savings for money from the wedding & stuff, but nothing is deposited there on a regular basis. we have our own savings & checking accounts. there's no need for either of us to police the other's purchases.

10/24/2011 1:20:23 PM

Sounds to me like this is a symptom of a bigger problem.

Solve that problem first, then address the money issues.

10/24/2011 1:24:44 PM

Charles? Explain yourself. I'm interested in hearing what you're thinkin'

10/24/2011 1:29:06 PM

Quote :

"that's the kind of stuff i'm looking for. her fees look pretty steep, and our estate isn't very large, but its worth considering. "

Yeah I'd at least ask her, she might be able to work with you with a lower fee or point you in the direction of someone more affordable for the two of you.

10/24/2011 1:29:45 PM

as a couple we make a lot more than most couples i know and are very well off from an income stream point of view. we just can't save. its more like she has dom perignon taste on a veuve clicquot budget

[Edited on October 24, 2011 at 1:33 PM. Reason : a]

10/24/2011 1:32:34 PM

Something I never saw on a website but worked for me: Open calendar with all your spending.

My wife and I literally had dry-erase board that we kept in our kitchen. Each time we spent money, we wrote down where we spent it. Now, we weren't in arguments over who is spending what (fortunately we just have a good agreement on what is "reasonable"), but you could always agree on what is essential (bills, food, etc... sounded like you already did that), then write in different colors what you are spending money on. The purpose is no public humiliation or demeaning your wife, but to force her to acknowledge her spending problem.

I agree with the last poster, though: there is a much bigger problem that isn't a "marriage" problem per se. It sounds like there is a serious personality flaw. I'm sure this isn't news to you, but if you are going to be in a successful marriage, both of you must be willing to place the priorities over the marriage above individual wants and desires. Doesn't sound like she's up for that right now.

10/24/2011 1:33:56 PM

I would say go with separate checking accounts and put her on a budget... I see someone has already mentioned Nancy Cooper ITT... but then I thought about the overdraft fees she would surely rack up. Maybe cut up all her cards and go the pre-paid Visa route, recharging it once monthly?

Quote :

"as a couple we make a lot more than most couples i know and are very well off from an income stream point of view. we just can't save."

In that case, the secret account idea sounds nice. You could make an IRA contribution a monthly "bill.

[Edited on October 24, 2011 at 1:36 PM. Reason : -]

10/24/2011 1:34:46 PM

Quote :

"Charles? Explain yourself. I'm interested in hearing what you're thinkin'"

Same idea as what you said previously -- it sounds like this guy's wife still acts like a child rather than adult. No offense, nchockey; something tells me you know this already.

10/24/2011 1:36:32 PM

Quote :

"The purpose is no public humiliation or demeaning your wife, but to force her to acknowledge her spending problem."

I think this is important. She may be bucking at your attitude trying to "control her." I'm not saying it's right, but it may be a part of the problem. Are you upfront when you overspend?

And I second the cash budget idea. It's one thing recommended by Dave Ramsey, who I really do actually think helps beginner budgets. He does free online classes as well. But, you take your cash to the store, so $200 for groceries, and that's it. Or $50 for haircut and that's it. You have cash, not debit cards, not credit cards. But, what's good for the goose is good for the gander, and if you're going to have her carry around cash, be willing to do the same thing yourself. You may be surprised at how much you're spending too!

10/24/2011 1:39:15 PM

Sorry for the double post...

...one thing about the seperate checking accounts. This might be a decent temporary fix, but you'll see a lot of information out there on the evils of seperate checking accounts. It's not just about money; it becomes about openness and the relationship. If you're trying to "prove a point", then the checking account with overdraft disabled could do little more than publically humiliating your wife as she over spends, causing her card to get declined, and potentially starting bad habbits that spiral into worse conditions (see "writing checks" and "forward dating checks").

I'm not saying "don't do it", I'm just saying to be careful. IMHO, there are similar way to accomplish the same goal.

10/24/2011 1:39:27 PM

Personally I think every married person should have a secret account. Even if it's just for buying Christmas presents without tipping off your spouse, it's good to have a stash of money you can tap into in necessary situations.

10/24/2011 1:40:08 PM

My wife was always a spender compared to me, but we were dating since high school so I knew all about it well in advance. Luckily her parents made sure she had her own checking account and it was only funded by her earnings as a PT nursing assistant. She overdrew multiple times back then but it taught her how serious it was once things started getting bad. She will default back to heavy spending every once in a while, but I monitor our finances on Mint.com and made our family budget so she listens to me for the most part.

About us: we live on about 22k/yr with a 14mo old son, I am in grad school, she is a SAHM.

I'm sure our situation is very different, but even with my wife being more understanding there are still arguments about money. I make sure to save as much as possible for us (I was able to build a 6 mo nest egg and have started a college fund for my son) as well as saving for a big vacation each year (anniversary week in Cancun this year). While she does not necessarily understand how much we save, she looks forward to our trips and knows that I am not trying to deprive her of her love for spending, just making sure she is realistic in how much she can spend.

Some of her respect for my financial decisions may be due to everyone telling her they can't believe we are making it on what we have, but I make sure to show her Mint every month or so and listen to what she has to say about how we spent for the month. I'm glad you guys are doing counseling and if you both feel that they are a good unbiased 3rd party you could definitely discuss your budget in that environment provided the counselor is willing. I don't necessarily think budgeting is too hard to do mathematically, but it is about attitude, intent and self control: all things a counselor concerns themselves with.

10/24/2011 1:42:03 PM

OmarBadmod. I would like you to know that i am refraining from posting "Help meditating with a midget" in the lounge

I'm krallum and i approved this message.

10/24/2011 1:42:16 PM

^x6 Yeah, I'd seriously want to know what her long term plans are. To work until the day you die? Divorce you and take half your stuff when she wants to stop working? I'm thinking that people like that can't grasp the long term.

Maybe the part of the brain responsible for delayed/deferred gratification never developed with her. I.e. offer a small child one cookie right now or a huge box of cookies if they wait until tomorrow. If you take the time to try to explain the benefits of waiting for the whole box that's coming tomorrow the kid will just moan for their one cookie NOW the entire time. At some point people develop that part of their brain. Perhaps she never did. So yeah, dog/DVR.

[Edited on October 24, 2011 at 1:48 PM. Reason : -]

10/24/2011 1:44:01 PM

wow that sucks

if she doesnt even want to "work" on her spending and can't seem to admit she has a problem-- i don't think you're going to be able to help her and still have a decent relationship

if she does realize she needs to do something i would take extreme measures (bc it seems like you have tried some others)

giver her access to a checking account via a debit card and put a certain amount in there every month. she has to budget off of that

also freeze your credit so she doesnt open a new credit card

also start canceling any cards that are newer (older cards are better for your credit bc they demonstrate history)

if you dont have that many credit cards already, call in and have all the limits decreased

my impression is that it's usually best for one person to be in charge of the finances as far as paying the bills, making sure the savings & retirement accounts are being funded and parsing out "fun money" - but that the other half of relationship is in agreement with this set up

some people just never learn how to handle & treat money. it doesn't make her a bad person but if she doesn't want to learn how to do it and "budgeting hurts her head" then take things into your own hands and help her help herself

btw if the debit card doesnt work you could kick it kid style and give her gift cards every month that you go refill (like, $200 at kroger, $50 at target, $200 on a visa gift card for general stuff, etc.)

10/24/2011 1:48:17 PM

Maybe try to get her to read the Dave Ramsey book and you as well. I think it helped me become more budget conscientious about my spending. It also got me excited about saving money and having finacial security. Women love security, even Dave says they do. I didn't use all his advice, like just using cash. But I do think about my budget each time I swipe my card. I am even putting all my birthday money into savings account and I'm happy to do it.

also, read this book as well. It focuses more on money and relationships.

10/24/2011 1:48:25 PM

Quote :

"The purpose is no public humiliation or demeaning your wife, but to force her to acknowledge her spending problem"

"forcing", or trying to, almost always creates more problems. they probably need to look everything as one entity and make (or try to appear to make ) mutual concessions. Agreeing to put a specific percentage of each salary into an IRA or other vehicle that discourages withdrawals is a good start. Likewise, agreeing to a specific misc. spending alotment for each creates equal, measurable footing.

creative solutions, like a "shopping jar" for the wife might also help. Sounds like there is a problem with visualizing long term goals vs. short term wants...making artificial milestones sometimes help make both more tangible.

"secret accounts" and the like are bad in the longrun imo.

10/24/2011 1:54:01 PM

i agree, this definitely goes deeper than finances, and we are working on the other stuff as well.

and i am not a fan of secret accounts or making this a forceful thing. if our marriage is going to be successful, i feel it needs to be based on honesty and a mutual understanding. i appreciate the advice though.

10/24/2011 1:58:17 PM

This thread makes me really appreciate my wife.

10/24/2011 1:58:32 PM

^ Same.

My wife and I help each other stay accountable for our budget. Occasionally we both go over, but we are honest about it.

Thankfully we are on the same page, which is, IMHO, the most important thing.

10/24/2011 2:00:53 PM

I would encourage you to read the context of the phrase "force her". Reading the thread, it's obvious that "argeements" have not been reached because there are bigger problems at work. Marriage counselling hasn't found the solution and his wife refuses to acknowledge her problem.

Where this leaves you is a situation similar to an intervention. You have to find some way to make it obvious to her that she has a spending problem, THEN solutions can be found.

We agree on what ultimately needs to be done, but in the short term there seems to be a need for something outside of the Ramsey plan. This isn't a normal "two married people trying to establish a budget" situation. It's a "a husband has a huge problem with his wife's spending and wife refuses to acknowledge that there may be an issue." When you listen to Ramsey's show (at least when I did), he would even suggest speaking to a mediator in those cases because "agreeing" is obviously not working.

[Edited on October 24, 2011 at 2:05 PM. Reason : ]

10/24/2011 2:02:23 PM

I have a friend who is absolutely horrible with budgeting engaged to a guy that I guess is decent with budgeting. Lately they've been getting into huge fights because she up and decided to quit her job because she didn't like her boss, had no new job lined up, and they can't afford rent without her income. And they're trying to plan a wedding on top of all that I told my husband he should be glad I'm not a spendthrift most days

10/24/2011 2:04:13 PM

Quote :

"My husband and I have a joint bank account where both of our paychecks are deposited into. From that, all of our bills are paid (cell phones, utilities, mortgage etc) and we get a weekly "allowance" deposited into our seperate bank accounts. From that, we use it to buy gas, lunches, clothes, whatever we want to spend our "allowance" on. That may be a good idea for you as your wife seems to be buying stuff using money that needs to be set aside for bills, savings etc. That way, she'll have some $$$ every week in her personal bank account but she's not bankrupting you both. "

we do the same, except gas comes out of the joint account

10/24/2011 2:08:32 PM