FINALLY, after 25 years, I'm getting a passport. I can at long last take that trip I've been dreaming of my whole life, and it's looking to be a realistic goal for Spring Break 2011. I'm planning on taking the gf on a 5-6 day haul through Scandinavia and northern Europe. I know there have been many threads on this kind of thing, but I want some info tailored to my specific goals.

My cousin lives in Bergen, so I figured we'd start there. I've planned a basic, tentative route roughly clockwise and ending in London. I fully expect to be spending a lot of time on rails and/or buses, which is part of what I'm excited about. Here's my (probably over-ambitious) goal so far:



The thick circles are places I want to really explore, probably stay overnight. The thin circles are places I want to visit, but wouldn't mind just passing through. The little unnamed spot in southern Poland is a small town called Oswiecim, and the spot in west UK is Blackburn, both of which we want to visit briefly for personal reasons. I don't really care about spending any time in Amsterdam, but I figured I might as well use it as a shove-off to get to Dublin somehow.

I fully realize that it is unlikely we would get to spend any time at any of these places if I'm trying to cram it all into 5 or 6 days, but I would like to see as much as possible. What I want is info on trimming the fat/getting things as cheap as possible, travel info (bus vs. train vs. rentals, etc), tips and tricks, places to stay, places to avoid, etc...general "middle-class white-american that's never left the USA" information.

Any insight is appreciated

[Edited on October 20, 2010 at 11:54 PM. Reason : it just occurred to me that there prooobably aren't any transatlantic flights direct to bergen haha]

10/20/2010 11:52:52 PM

very nice

10/20/2010 11:54:11 PM

[Edited on October 21, 2010 at 12:21 AM. Reason : oops, that first one was a little big]

10/20/2010 11:59:18 PM

Any advice on cheap flights? Looks like airfare is gonna be pretty steep...right now round trip it's looking like just under $2k for two adults

[Edited on October 21, 2010 at 12:30 AM. Reason : ^ ]

[Edited on October 21, 2010 at 12:35 AM. Reason : seems I can find it for a little over $1k maybe?]

10/21/2010 12:15:58 AM

man the more i look into flights and rail passes, it's looking like transportation expenses alone for the both of us could easily top $2500

that's a huge chunk of my total budget

I need someone that knows how to work the system

10/21/2010 2:11:30 AM

That's a pretty awesome trip! The only thing that kept me from being able to go with my friends when they went a few years ago was the cost. I wish I could have afforded to go, but I just didn't have the money at the time. It wasn't the lodging or food or other expenses, it was the transportation costs that were so bad.

IIRC, they hit all of the major destinations in France, Spain, and Italy. Total, per person (there were 4) was about $1700 each for the ~2 weeks they were gone. It may have been more, but I really don't remember.

10/21/2010 2:25:00 AM

see that's what I've heard, so I feel like for two people and one week I should be able to keep everything at or below $3k

I need them I-know-a-guy discounts, ya know

and I can't count...trip could realistically be 8-9 days

[Edited on October 21, 2010 at 3:03 AM. Reason : 8-9 days]

10/21/2010 2:36:47 AM

You're also traveling way more and way farther than just Spain, France, and Italy, which have a ton of services for traveling between. Dealing with the Norway region you're going to get a little pricier. Depending on how far you're booking, and the availability of the airlines, you could look into Ryan Air.

http://www.ryanair.com

They don't fly out of major airports, but will fly out of much smaller nearby airports (~30 min by train or so). I never got a chance to use it, and planning for those flights was a little bit of a hassle in that you are restricted by what days those flights fly, transportation to/from, but they are insanely cheap...if you book far ahead enough. I did have a flight booked to (near) Oslo and looked at Stockholm so check that out.

For getting to Europe period, word on the internet is that its sometimes cheaper to fly into, say, London, and then take another flight or train to your connecting city. Since you're flying to Norway that might not be an option but could be something to check into. You might be able to fly to London, then Ryanair over to Norway or major flightline to Bergen. I, for one, flew into Belgium and heard later it was cheaper to do London -> Belgium.

In another European travels thread, some TWWers mention a Europass or something similar that you buy for around $500 and can just hop on and off trains all over Europe for like a month. That might all be completely wrong, but if you can track that down (or a twwr mention it here) then give it a shot.

Try http://www.hostels.com for booking your hostels. I strongly advise going by the reviews, not just the price tag. You'll have the option of sleeping in a dorm (4 people and up to a room...which is just beds put into a room) or getting a room for 2, but more expensive. You won't be staying in the room anyway so why put too much money into it? We managed to avoid one shit hole in Amsterdam just because of their "policy" of not allowing one-night stays, even though we had called ahead. It was the closest thing to a crack-head den I've ever seen, except you replace the crack with pot. Very freaky, so read into the reviews and see what they say.

On that note, fuck Amsterdam. If you're going to go just to see the Red Light, smoke pot, eat brownies, canal ride, and party in general, then go for it. Otherwise its a waste of time, as you could easily do all of that in one night and there are very little touristy things like museums or attractions worth mentioning. Still worth a visit no doubt, but not a prolonged stay imo.

I've also heard friends say that the Lonely Planet travel guides are very good for getting around in cities. They have information that the locals would give you, such as where to eat and what to see, in addition to places not to go (tourist traps). One book for Rome saved my friend a ton of time at the Coliseum by listing a different place to get a ticket other than the Coliseum itself, so he was able to skip that line and see another museum for the same exact price.

[Edited on October 21, 2010 at 4:46 AM. Reason : lkj]

10/21/2010 4:43:00 AM

i was barely able to cram london and paris into 10 days - are you planning on just seeing 1 major thing in each city and running to the next?

for 5-6 days you need to focus on 2 cities - maybe 3 tops - for 8-9 days you could maybe do 4 cities but that's pushing it if you want to experience anything in the city at all - including travel that doesn't give you a lot of time to experience much

10/21/2010 1:53:30 PM

I would honestly pick two or three places (or just one!) and spread your time that way. It's going to be very expensive trying to jump to all those places (much cheaper if you're traveling by train through Western Europe) and you'll be spreading everything pretty thin trying to enjoy yourselves in that many places in that short of a time.

Just doesn't sound like a good idea.

10/21/2010 1:57:36 PM

i have to agree. . . i realize that everyone is different regarding their idea of "enough time" in each place, but i can't imagine anyone, regardless of how familiar they were with europe, would enjoy cramming all that in. that itinerary would mean you spent almost literally the entire time in airports and train stations.

in my opinion, 6 days gives you enough time to visit two cities that are fairly near each other, such as 2 in the UK, or munich and prague, etc. i believe munich is about a 6-hour train ride from prague, for instance.

10/21/2010 3:56:16 PM

yeah, i came in here to say that you're doing waaaaaaaaaaaaaay too much

i just got back from my honeymoon, which was two weeks in switzerland and italy where we were in 5 cities total and even that was too rushed

when i was in europe in 2007, i made the same mistake you're planning on, which is to try to cram as much as possible to get the best "value," (i did stockholm, oslo, copenhagen, bremen, muenster, and berlin in 12 days)

let me tell you, you're just going to regret it...you're underestimating how much time just traveling will eat up and you're not going to be able to do ANYTHING

[Edited on October 21, 2010 at 4:01 PM. Reason : .]

10/21/2010 4:00:10 PM

When I went to Europe in 2001, I rented a car and drove from Amsterdam to Germany, Luxembourg, France, Belgium, and back to Amsterdam, then went to England and rented a car there for a few days. I was there for a little over three weeks. It was great having the car because I could set my own schedule. I highly recommend it as an option.

**Disclaimer: I went in 2001 before they switched over to the Euro so everything was cheap as hell compared to now

10/21/2010 4:18:44 PM

Quote :

"for 5-6 days you need to focus on 2 cities - maybe 3 tops "

This. You need to focus on trying to really take in some sites instead of blitzing through as many as you can. Try and see if you can extend the trip atleast a few days (take the Friday before Spring Break and the Monday following off and you've got 11 days). That'll give you probably ~7-8 days of time to actually see things factoring out the travel time for the flights and recovery. Use those 7-8 days to see the truly top things on your list like maybe just the Scandinavian countries.

10/21/2010 4:28:01 PM

You're gonna want to spend at least 2.5 to 3 days minimum in any big city to even begin to appreciate a fraction of the things they have to offer.

10/21/2010 4:57:37 PM

Others have said it, but I'll chime in as well. I recommend trying to bump up your trip to around 10 days. Use both weekends and try to fly out on an evening after work (school?). You can have a good trip in 7 days, but I really recommend giving yourself a longer vacation.

The jetlag will put a damper on your first day, especially if you are bringing your girlfriend. You'll have fun, but you'll be really tired and limited in what you can do.

The train and air travel between cities can eat up a half day easily. You don't want to spend your entire vacation on the train.

I would try to narrow it down to one of these trips.

Munich & Prague (I could see fitting Berlin or Amsterdam into this)
UK & Ireland
Krakow & Prague
Scandinavia



[Edited on October 21, 2010 at 6:59 PM. Reason : :]

10/21/2010 6:31:12 PM

If you have managed to read this far, it should be painfully clear that you have far too much planned for such a short trip. Frankly, $3k would be a heck of a deal for two people with all of that travel in such a short time period. As others have mentioned, narrow your focus down to a region and save the rest for another trip. You will get the travel bug and beginning planning another eurotrip soon after you get home.

You will find that open jawed tickets that have you flying into one city and out of another will tend to be substantially pricier than tickets into and out of one. If you are dead set on flying directly into scandinavia, it has been my experience that copenhagen and stockholm will run $700-800/person during that time of year. You should also consider that the weather may SUCK in scandinavia that time of year. My brother came during his spring break to visit me in sweden one year and it was wet and nasty the entire time he was around. Stockholm won't take you more than a day or two and neither will Helsinki. Look into the ferry (basically a cruise ship) to get between those two, they almost always have insanely cheap tix for steerage class (Viking Line, Birka Cruises, Silja Line)

That said, people have mentioned ryan air and you should look into it. there are many other similar airlines out there too, look into wizz air for flying into Poland. Since you are dead set on Oswiecim (Aushwitz), you may want to look into flying into Krakow. Warsaw is cool and I have partied there more than once, but it is relatively ugly and a pretty long drive to where youre going. It is also worth mentioning that Poland/Eastern Czech Republic can be a bit tough to navigate for some people not used to Eastern Europe. You may as well throw your schedule out the window if you venture to these parts.

Most Importantly: BE FLEXIBLE

I'll tackle more of your trip later when I have more time

10/21/2010 7:25:32 PM

Thank you for all of the input folks, it really does help infinitely.

After sleeping on it and thinking about it today, I began to realize it was pretty ridiculous to try to do all that in the time I have. I just don't know when I'll have another chance to do something like this so I was trying to cram it all in one trip.

I would love to extend the trip by a couple days which wouldn't be a big deal if it was just work I was contending with, but I'm in school and (especially around spring break) I'm thinking there are going to be exams/projects that I can't really miss.

What are the options for traveling from the mainland to the UK/Ireland? I'm assuming train through the channel-tunnel to the UK and a ferry to Ireland, but is there a better way?

And especially thank you to ThePeter, that was a goldmine of info. I will look into all of this

10/21/2010 7:37:07 PM

Quote :

"What are the options for traveling from the mainland to the UK/Ireland? I'm assuming train through the channel-tunnel to the UK and a ferry to Ireland, but is there a better way?"

This really depends on what you consider to be 'better'. I, personally, would look into the discount airlines mentioned previously as they would be cheaper and you would have more options in terms of cities to fly from. Keep in mind though, that these airlines are only cheaper if you pack light, they will kill you on extra fees.

10/22/2010 9:12:16 AM

The discount airlines CAN be cheaper...but sometimes aren't as great a deal as you would think. The tickets themselves are always pretty cheap...but they get you on bag fees. So if you're going to try and get cheap plane tickets, pack light...because they charge you out the ass if you have heavy bags.

10/22/2010 9:19:09 AM

Quote :

"I just don't know when I'll have another chance to do something like this"

seriously?

the rest of your life is so booked up you couldn't figure out how to get away for a week?

c'mon son.

10/22/2010 11:51:45 AM

Right, do it frugal now at 25, then do it super baller when you're 45 and hopefully have much deeper pockets

10/22/2010 12:04:32 PM

It's just Europe. You're not on the next mission to Mars.

10/22/2010 12:15:21 PM

Quote :

"seriously? the rest of your life is so booked up you couldn't figure out how to get away for a week? c'mon son."

There's a difference. It's like going to Vegas when you're 25 and single as opposed to 45, married, with two kids.

I backpacked Europe when I was 25 before I settled down and got a real job. I went for 6 weeks as opposed to his one week. But I knew I'd probably never get a chance to do something like that again.

The younger you are the more you can "rough it" and do something cheap. I know if I go back to Europe 10 years from now with a lady, I probably won't be able to get away with staying in $15 a night hostels, sleeping in train stations, getting dropped off at the Greece Macedonia border by a cabbie that just took all my cash, and blacking out and forgetting where I parked my moped in Split, Croatia.

There's a time to do certain things, and the best time to travel Europe is in your early to mid-20s. You're young enough to go wild and crazy and old enough to appreciate a lot of the shit you'll do and see over there (as opposed to being too young and just getting hammered all the time and trying to bone European chicks that won't give you the time of day).

10/22/2010 12:27:26 PM

a link that might be handy: http://www.farecompare.com/search/flyertalk.html

when i daydream about my next europe trip i go there. since i'm up for exploring new places, i just put in RDU as the origination and select "europe" as the destination. turns out, actually, that you can go RDU-krakow round trip for $713 next march, which is pretty cheap for europe overall, and happens to be near a place you'd like to go. of course that is to AND from krakow, but you get the idea.

also you can go to dublin for $626 which is historically not too much of a great deal but is about as good as you can get right now to/from europe.

10/22/2010 12:32:20 PM