I've a 1995 ford windstar with about 140k on it. 3.8L v6 automatic. I took it to midas so they could put it on the lift and put the thermometer on the cats and confirm my hypothesis that it was just choking on exhaust. They said everything was in spec.

Before I bought the car the following was replaced
coil pack
plugs (though shitty autolite and possibly only did the front 3)
EGR valve
entire transmission was rebuilt

I replaced the fuel filter and air filter

I'm going to look at the plugs when I get home, they might have a real bad gap, but does anyone else have any other ideas what may be wrong? The only other problem it has is at a complete stop if I don't hold the break it will try and jump forward, as if it's not shifting itself into neutral.

Also I got some new bosch plugs just in case, pm me if you wanna replace em for me. It's a transverse V6 and I don't have that kinda time.

8/5/2009 1:43:32 PM

auto lites are about the only thing you want to put in a ford. never had a problem wit them, why do you say they only did the front 3, does it have a code?

8/5/2009 2:23:26 PM

throws a random misfire code and by that I mean the code is "random misfire" not a ton of codes for misfires on cyl X. I suggest just the front 3 because the back 3 are complete asspains to get to.

8/5/2009 3:38:26 PM

take that bosch shit back and get champions

and replace them yourself, it wont take you more than an hour. you pull the upper plenum, dipshit.

8/5/2009 4:26:54 PM

^

8/7/2009 9:45:49 AM

well I started changing the front 3 (with champion) and the 2 closest to the driver side looked fine, the one on the passenger side was covered in gas and soot. I tried starting it after just changing those and it sounded much better. While just looking around the bay, I noticed a ton of water pooling under the throttle body on top of the plenum. It's in an area where the water shouldn't get into anything electrical but I can't really figure out where it's coming from. I suppose I'll start inspecting hoses.

[Edited on August 15, 2009 at 1:29 PM. Reason : it also smells like it's running way rich with the hood up]

8/15/2009 1:28:05 PM

sounds like it might be leaking from the coolant circulation lines that connect to the tb. or, the tb could be cracked itself. that's assuming it even circulates coolant through the tb/intake, i've never really worked under the hood on one of those. where's the thermostat housing on them? might be worth a look there as well.

yeah, and as already noted, autolites are even worse than bosch. consider the source of that suggestion, though. it's hard to beat champions for 99% of domestics. OEM motorcrafts are decent too of course for all things fomoco.

Quote :

"The only other problem it has is at a complete stop if I don't hold the break it will try and jump forward, as if it's not shifting itself into neutral."

huh? does not compute... plz to elaborate.

Quote :

"it also smells like it's running way rich with the hood up"

wouldn't surprise me a bit. bad cats are notorious for wasting o2 sensors, and vice versa.

[Edited on August 15, 2009 at 7:57 PM. Reason : .]

8/15/2009 7:54:09 PM

Quote :

"plz to elaborate."

so when I'm stopped at a stoplight (this was before I just changed these plugs, reconnected the egr, etc) it would try to lurch forward. almost like I was doing a burnout on the rearwheels and my front brakes were all that was holding me in place.

I did use champion plugs and that smoothed things out a bunch, though I only did the front 3. My jack is at my parents' house and I'll be over there tomorrow.

It looks like the thermostat is on the passenger side with the timing belt and water pump. (I've been using autozone's website for all the repair guides)

Quote :

"wouldn't surprise me a bit. bad cats are notorious for wasting o2 sensors, and vice versa."

I can hear an exhaust leak but the guys at midas took the infrared thermometer to it and said my cats were within operating temp spec so I dunno what their status is. I would like to know why 1 of the plugs I've looked at looked like it was burning maybe 1/10 of the gas shot in the cylinder

8/15/2009 8:07:32 PM

do a compression test on it. that should tell you why, maybe

8/15/2009 8:32:02 PM

Quote :

"so when I'm stopped at a stoplight (this was before I just changed these plugs, reconnected the egr, etc) it would try to lurch forward. almost like I was doing a burnout on the rearwheels and my front brakes were all that was holding me in place."

okay, you do realize a steady pull against the brakes is perfectly normal when you come to a stop in an automatic, right? the only way you would eliminate that in any vehicle would be manually putting it into neutral/park when you come to a stop.

i'm going to HOPE that what you're really trying to explain is that it was surging when you came to a stop. almost like a manual vehicle with a warped/hot spotted flywheel. considering it was missing and probably had a rough idle, that's nothing abnormal. most stock torque converters have a fairly low stall speed, which means you're going to feel it more each time the engine gains/loses rpms at all.

the only other guess i've got is maybe it's really low in atf. that would explain you thinking it's going into neutral at stops. really, it's just the pump not being able to supply the torque converter with enough fluid to engage at low rpms. as you press the gas to take off, pressure/volume is increased enough to stall the converter and away you go with a feeling like it just switched from neutral to 1st on its own...

Quote :

"I would like to know why 1 of the plugs I've looked at looked like it was burning maybe 1/10 of the gas shot in the cylinder"

could have just been a bad plug that got fouled. or, there could be more to it. pull the new one out and see what it looks like. it it has similar deposits, then you've likely got bigger problems. coil pack/wiring on the fritz, low compression in that cylinder, etc...

8/15/2009 10:21:24 PM

finally got time to tear it down and do the back plugs. it's smoother... for now. after further inspection, my head gaskets are probably going as I can't find the coolant leak anywhere and it still smells to be running rich. there's a decent bit of build up around the deck area on the sides of the heads.

8/23/2009 6:42:53 PM

I have a 96 f150 and just had a random misfire code, think it was po300. I changed all of the plugs and plug wires ( think the plugs were fine but changed them anyway) but when I changed the wire from the coil to the distributor I found a ton of corrosion on the coil hookup and on the top of the distributor cap. Sanded both connection and put some electric contact grease on them, replaced the distributor wire and it fixed everything.

In my experience with misfires the first things i check is fire and fuel, after that I check all vacume lines etc. etc.

Hope i was of some help.

8/28/2009 11:40:33 AM

I'm going to go out on a limb here and have 90% of the Garage lambast the hell out of me.

The only Autolites worth owning are the double platinums. All the rest are pure shit. For those of you who don't know, Allied Signal manufactures Autolite and Fram. As we all know, Fram is shit. So is Autolite.

Champion is okay, but still not all that. They make good platinum and iridium plugs, and their fine-wire race plugs are good as well. This is a company that has made glow plugs, spark plugs, and ignitors for countless diesels, gasoline engines, and jet engines/gas turbines for YEARS.

Bosch is a damn good plug with one notable flaw: it does not perform well in engines that don't have a high swirl or quench type chamber. The porcelain insulator shrouds the electrode too much. I've run several sets in my Nissan and Toyota engines for more than 100k miles with good results and excellent fuel mileage.

AC Delco plugs are good. Most of their high end plugs are made by NGK.

My favorite plugs in the world are NGK, and everything I work on, be it domestic or import, gets them. They have a grade or line of plug for everything, and I've had nothing but good luck with them. They are the ONLY plug I will recommend for a Mazda Wankel...and the multi-electrode plugs for the Toyotas and Bimmers that use them are spot on.

Fuck you and fuck you and fuck you. Who's next?

A bad plug or plug wire will give you all of the symptoms you've listed. Well, except for the leaking part. Definitely could be one of the TB preheat hoses leaking. I was thinking that maybe the 3.8 could be similar to the Triton engines in that it might have a plastic intake or plastic intake components, but I don't think it does. I've seen a blue million of those crack and leak.

8/28/2009 12:20:51 PM

Quote :

"My favorite plugs in the world are NGK, and everything I work on, be it domestic or import, gets them."

Agreed.

8/28/2009 1:01:44 PM

yeah, I wanted ngk but nobody had any in stock. the motor runs way better but I still hear an odd beat the in exhaust at idle and it still smells rich at startup.

8/29/2009 1:46:02 AM

next time buy motorcrap

8/29/2009 9:44:13 AM

hey dont complain u paid like 500 for this pos

8/29/2009 11:00:59 AM

ihope hes not tying to flipper this thing

8/29/2009 1:01:12 PM

flipper's gettin it!

8/29/2009 2:13:01 PM

dolphins have small dicks anyway

10/15/2009 11:08:06 AM