Dear god, what a beautiful car.






Big specs: 2+2 coupe, Toyota 3.5 Liter V-6 putting out 280hp NA. 3000lbs, $70k base price.

There will be performance versions (im guessing a 340, and a 380hp SC models, plus likely a 400+hp cup car)

The interior is gorgeous as well, very clean and driver focused it seems. And no, it won't be called the Eagle, they are keeping the production name close to the vest until launch late next year. Probably won't hit the US until mid 2010 I'd guess.

Full news link for more info:
http://www.autocar.co.uk/News/NewsArticle/Lotus-Concepts/233975/

[Edited on July 16, 2008 at 5:31 PM. Reason : .]

7/16/2008 5:20:33 PM

Fuck. I just drooled on my shirt.

7/16/2008 5:33:31 PM

its ugly in the ass

7/16/2008 7:12:07 PM

I disagree mr. pooljobs

That is one beautiful car. Makes me feel bad about wanting to pick up an Elise in a couple years... (this looks sexier than the Elise IMO.) I wonder how access to the rear seats will be, and how much leg room they'll have. It'll be one helluva sports car I imagine.

7/16/2008 8:38:38 PM

older ones looked better

7/16/2008 9:45:09 PM

It would look better w/ out the rear seats. From the doors to the wheels (above them, too) looks a bit odd.


I'd still drive/hump it, though.

[Edited on July 16, 2008 at 10:10 PM. Reason : ]

7/16/2008 10:09:44 PM

Quote :

"Big specs: 2+2 coupe, Toyota 3.5 Liter V-6 putting out 280hp NA. 3000lbs, $70k base price."

I have to say this is disappointing. First they need to get away from this Toyota drivetrain bullshit. Second, 3000lbs? WTF, thats too high. Also, it looks too much like the Elise/Exige.

Finally, I'd prefer a late model Elise V8TT. Based on the specs looks like the old model's faster.

7/16/2008 10:17:38 PM

Quote :

"Second, 3000lbs? WTF, thats too high. Also, it looks too much like the Elise/Exige. "

seconded.

looks cool and all. i'd hit it for $35,000...not $70,000.

7/16/2008 10:23:48 PM

I wouldn't pay MSRP for any Lotus. 3klbs isn't that bad. But at the same time, comparing it to their trend (excluding the Esprit) of super light weight chassis, I would have imagined this closer to 2,600lbs. Kinda disappointing Lotus.


What's wrong with the toyota powerplant? It's reliable isn't it?

^bingo

[Edited on July 16, 2008 at 10:50 PM. Reason : .]

7/16/2008 10:50:31 PM

Just a few tidbits from the full article:

Quote :

"It would look better w/ out the rear seats. From the doors to the wheels (above them, too) looks a bit odd."

The rear seats are OPTIONAL. You can have them removed for more trunk space and weight reduction.

Quote :

"Second, 3000lbs? WTF, thats too high. Also, it looks too much like the Elise/Exige."

Keep in mind that this is still VERY light. The GT-R weighs 3800lbs, Subaru WRX STi is 3300lbs, Porsche 997 is 3175lbs. And that is bone stock. My guess is, if you opt out of the rear seat and the luxury options, it'll be in the 2750lb range, which would put it among the lightest V6+ production cars on the planet.

Quote :

"Finally, I'd prefer a late model Elise V8TT. Based on the specs looks like the old model's faster."

I believe you mean a late model Esprit. If you like being in the shop 9 months out of the year go for it. The FASTEST TT Esprit made 355hp and had a 0-60 time of about 5 seconds. It also had an extremely fragile transmission, 1990's suspension, and almost 0 safety features. And you'll still pay 25-40K for one today.

Also, the NEW Esprit comes out next year. It will likely be running the Toyota V8 being used in Nascar along with some form of forced induction, and will be priced in the 130-150K range. And I will bet my nuts it'll be the 2500lb monster we all dream of.

This is not intended to be a supercar. It's a daily driver sport luxury, aiming for the likes of a base model Carrera, Aston Martins, et al. It has a real trunk, it'll have road tuned suspension and enough room in the back seat for the kids or groceries.

7/16/2008 11:53:38 PM

Quote :

"It will likely be running the Toyota V8 being used in Nascar"

i'm curious to hear/read more about this. i'd be extremely surprised if any new production engine has much of anything to do with a nascar motor, those days were left behind decades ago. maybe very loosely based on it or taking some aspect of new technology from it, but i stress the words very and loosely. granted they're always improving what they're working with, but nascar motors in general are still limited to very ancient/basic designs.

as for the car in this thread, i've got to agree with pat and duke. the looks don't inspire me and the specs are a bit of a letdown also off hand. i'm sure it will be a decent performer, but i think they're stepping into a market where there's too many other cars for around that price or cheaper that will offer similar or much better performance. part of the lure of the elise/exige is they fill somewhat of a niche.

i do like the fact that they have the insight to stick with toyota drivetrains. lotus has always been great at doing a few things well as evidenced by their vast contributions to other manufacturers, but they've never quite gotten the hang of putting a whole package together. i personally don't fault them at all for it though, and think others should take note of how they've dealt with it.

farming things out has the ability to result in a far superior vehicle. prices should be cheaper also since a single company isn't required to carry the financial burden of so many design and manufacturing resources. look at the medium and heavy duty truck companies. they've understood this concept there for years. buttseks and i even spotted some cummins electronics on a cat motor a few weeks ago. that'd be like finding ford parts on a chevrolet or vice versa.

7/17/2008 12:59:34 AM

They will only be making ~2000 worldwide this year, so I doubt there will be any problems moving the volume.

The Europa (which is a much tamer visual version of the elise tailored to a touring car) sells much much more easily than the Elise/Exige in Europe. But rather than getting it certified for the US market, they just held out for this car instead. This car competes with Aston, Maserati, Ferrari and a number of other exotic touring models. And it costs 1/2 or less the cost of the others in it's class, so I don't know what you are talking about?

There isn't a car under 100k that matches up to the Eagle, not that I've seen anyway.

7/17/2008 2:10:39 AM

uhh, 911?

7/17/2008 2:20:26 AM

6 series? or how about the bargain slk550?

however, lotus better hope that's not who they're directly competing with unless they get some luxury and more power on tap. they should hope to be picking off would be sports car buyers or people looking to move up from other "lowly" 2+2's like the rx8. when you get up to prices of 70k plus and the demographics of those buyers, they don't care much about how much money they'll save when it means a big cut in luxery and performance. right now this car is in another gray area, and it's not the good kind of gray area that the elise/exige is in. with production that low, it may not really matter though. they can probably sell that many based on the name alone.

[Edited on July 17, 2008 at 3:08 AM. Reason : course, you know if manufacturers had their way they'd all be "in a class of their own" lol]

7/17/2008 3:04:26 AM

Good point

Dunno about you, but I'd much much rather spring for this than a base model 911. And Porsche has no problem selling their base model for 5-10k more than the base price of the Eagle, and a typical base model Porsche 911 walks out the door at over 85K.

^There is no SLK550. There's a CLK550 and a SLK55 AMG.

The CLK550 is a competitor definitely. It also weight 750lbs more, its slower (despite the 382hp), has terrible handling (as do all the non-AMG mercedes cars) and will get terrible gas mileage. Also a little cheaper

The SLK55AMG is a 2seater roadster that runs about 70k delivered. No back seats, no faster, worse mileage, less storage space. It also weighs 4000 pounds!

BMW 6 Series is also definitely a competitor. Slower 0-60, lower top end, weighs 3800lbs, and it's almost 10k more for the base model (7800 more to be exact).


Everyone seems to think these cars are all mega light, mega fast and mega cheap.

[Edited on July 17, 2008 at 3:27 AM. Reason : .]

7/17/2008 3:08:24 AM

what about the new skyline?

7/17/2008 10:20:30 AM

I'd say more like Caymen

7/17/2008 10:54:36 AM

are you kidding me? These days, 3000 lbs for a 2+2 V6 RWD car is pretty light. Think about the RWD V6 2+2 coupes of yesteryear... Camaro, Mustang, 300ZX... none of them were at that weight, and they had way less power.

7/17/2008 11:20:06 AM

^^Yep the Caymen is the one of the cars they are directly going after

7/17/2008 11:56:24 AM

i was going more for a similar performance and price point.. the cars are obviously nothing alike.

7/17/2008 12:04:33 PM

color me not impressed.

7/17/2008 12:30:43 PM

Quote :

"There is no SLK550. There's a CLK550 and a SLK55 AMG. "

yeah, that's what i meant to put. brain fart.

i agree with everything you're saying about those two (mb/bmw) being inferior in terms of performance. however, you've got to keep in mind that the people looking to buy such a touring coupe don't care. performance is certainly a concern, but it's rarely if ever primary. these people want a total package. power to show off a bit here and there or speed excessively, looks, status symbol, lap of luxery, gadgets, useable back seats and trunk for their golf buddies, etc. i see 9 out of 10 potential buyers in this segment turning their nose up at the lotus. especially if they catch wind of it having a toyota motor. doesn't matter if it was machined from a solid block of gold. cost isn't that big of a concern either. most people that have the bling to swing such a car are more concerned with getting something they really want, not saving every penny possible. i don't doubt the lotus won't walk the dog on the majority of if not all of it's technical in class competition. that doesn't give it top rank or make it a hot seller.

on the other hand, lets just look at it as a car in general, no class limitations. in this light, it's strict emphasis on performance becomes much more desireable and marketable. maybe you've got people in the market for a gtr, c6, viper, r8, or whatever. these are the people that will probably take a lot of notice. however, the problem here comes with not enough performance. it's adequate considering the weight, but not on par with a number of other performance cars in the same price range. bump the power up some or drop the price and they'd probably sell all day long. these are the true enthusiasts that aren't bothered with a few less comforts, the toyota drivetrain, etc.

again, for the reasons in the above two paragraphs the car is stuck in a gray area in my opinion, and it's not the good kind. neither side is going to be very willing to accept it as is. it's obviously simple stuff though. they could make it a real winner either way with basic changes.

who knows though, maybe they've purposely stuck it where it is to gauge reaction and the final production model will be decidedly in one group or the other. or, in true lotus fashion, maybe they'll offer two very different versions of the same car and stick their hands in both pots. hmmm, now what other car does that too?

7/17/2008 1:30:35 PM

^I still don't see this argument "it's lacking in performance"

It will do 0-60 in 5 seconds or less

It will top out at almost 180mph

Which puts it squarely in the same performance range of all the cars you've listed. The only thing it doesn't have is a 400+ hp engine, which it doesn't need because it doesnt weight 4000+ pounds. I agree that selling that concept is going to be hard in the US, but people "Get it" in Europe and Asia. And they've already announced there will be at least one SC option.

The engine looks to be the Toyota 2GR-FE, same as the V6 Camry, but will likely be tuned very much like the Elise's 2ZZ for a much higher redline and cam-changeover.

And looking at the Toyota Aurion which has a SC option on the 2GR-FE, and puts out a modest 323hp, I'd say it's very likely the Lotus equivalent will be closer to 340. And at 340, this thing would freaking scoot.

7/17/2008 5:57:16 PM

Quote :

"I wouldn't pay MSRP for any Lotus. 3klbs isn't that bad. But at the same time, comparing it to their trend (excluding the Esprit) of super light weight chassis, I would have imagined this closer to 2,600lbs. Kinda disappointing Lotus. What's wrong with the toyota powerplant? It's reliable isn't it?"

The only problem I have with the Toyota powerplant is that its just plain jane. However if they spruce it up with a high redline and engaging exhaust note it has potential.

Noen, my apologies. First, yes I meant Esprit, not Elise. And 2nd, I didn't realize (at the time) that this is not the replacement for the Esprit. Yes 3,000lbs is a great weight, but if this car is based on the Elise platform, and isn't terribly larger then 1,000lbs heavier seems a bit much.

The Esprit, at the end with the V8TT did 0-60 in mid 4s, not 5s.

Also, the Esprit replacement most likely will not have a Toyota (NASCAR?) engine. Last I heard (this month's C&D) it is going to have a variant of BMW's TT V8. Thats what I'm talking about!

7/17/2008 9:07:16 PM

I can tell you 99.995% that it will have a toyota powerplant behind it.

Yota has two V8's capable (the 2UR-GSE and 2UR-FSE) and it will likely be a tuned GSE:

Quote :

" The 2UR-GSE is a 5 liter (4969 cc) engine and powers the Lexus IS-F. It has D-4S gasoline direct injection, dual VVT-i, and VVT-iE on the intake. Bore of 94 mm and stroke of 89.5 mm, it will produce 423 PS (417 hp/311 kW) at 6,600 RPM and 51.5 kg·m (505 N·m/373 ft·lbf) at 5,200 RPM. "

All of Lotus' ECU development has been with VVT-i technology and TRD based SC forced induction. The Esprit will be a V8, and will also likely be supercharged (though I'm sure they will offer an NA model) and it will also like be tuned well above the baseline number of the IS-F.

My guess is ~430hp for the NA at an 7500rpm redline, and ~525hp SC version. Yeah it won't be the NASCAR block

Quote :

"The only problem I have with the Toyota powerplant is that its just plain jane. However if they spruce it up with a high redline and engaging exhaust note it has potential."

Ride in a SC Elise or Exige sometime and tell me it's a plain jane Yota. 8800rpm redline and a beautiful exhaust note on the Stage2 exhausts are nothing like you get in a Celica or MR2.

7/17/2008 9:48:22 PM

What an ugly fucking car.

7/17/2008 10:31:34 PM

^^

If it sounds good at all its because its behind you.

I'm still not convinced any 8000rpm I-4 engine can sound great.

7/18/2008 6:51:02 AM

I've ridden in an Elise w/ the Lotus test driver on VIRF. very fun ride, but yeh, i've heard a shit ton of better sounding cars.

a C6 would rape this car. certainly not as unique and "cool" though. 280hp in a 3000lb car for $70k? lol

7/18/2008 7:58:28 AM

the idea of that with a v8 makes me a lil hard

7/18/2008 8:00:22 AM

Quote :

"Ride in a SC Elise or Exige sometime and tell me it's a plain jane Yota. 8800rpm redline and a beautiful exhaust note on the Stage2 exhausts are nothing like you get in a Celica or MR2."

Like I said, if they heavily modify it. A supercharger and much higher redline would certainly qualify as that.

8000rpm I-4s sound good to me! A lot of it depends on good intake/exhaust tuning of course.

7/18/2008 3:03:30 PM

Well the s2000 sounds far from good.

That's my only experience.

7/18/2008 5:57:29 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3JqrBdUpRiw

Basically the aftermarket exhausts don't have the coffee-can sound of most 4cylinger mufflers. The stock exhaust does a little, but that's mostly because of the built in silencer. The Larini, 2bular and stage II exhausts all sound amazing in person, very deep and rich.

7/18/2008 7:11:22 PM

^^ man, i like the sound of an S2000...especially an AP1 revved to 9k.

7/18/2008 8:50:46 PM

^^ I liked that larini exhaust... Then I liked the stage II. That 2bular exhaust sounded like crap imo.

[Edited on July 18, 2008 at 9:10 PM. Reason : .]

7/18/2008 9:09:40 PM

Is your S2000 all stock Quinn? Putting an aftermarket intake on an S2000 makes it a whole different beast as far as sound goes. Exhaust adds to it as well.

7/18/2008 11:46:21 PM

^^Yeah all the 2bular videos I found sounded like ass. But two guys up here have it installed and it sounds very much like the Larini in person (which is far and away my favorite)

7/19/2008 4:08:33 AM

^^ yeah its all stock.

I dont know. It doesnt sound bad but there is no way I would classify it as ever really sounding good. If you put an intake on the car you cant even hear the exhaust period.

Quote :

"man, i like the sound of an S2000...especially an AP1 revved to 9k."

Problem with the 8300-9000 is the power curve completely drops off. there really isn't much point to it beyond not having to shift.

7/19/2008 8:53:47 AM

overrev to keep the next shift from falling off the vtec

7/19/2008 2:43:13 PM

VTAAAAKKKKKK!!11

Quote :

"I still don't see this argument "it's lacking in performance""

if you're just comparing it to other performance coupes in that price range it's nothing special and overpriced. if you leave it as strictly a touring car, it shines in performance but then becomes very lacking in other areas as mentioned above. also like i said, minor changes in power and/or luxery would decidely put it one way or the other in my opinion. it sounds like they've at least got other power options planned, so in reality it's probably a pointless discussion. lotus obviously knows what they're doing when it comes to cornering a piece of the market and filling a void.

i do have to admit the more i look at it, the more the looks are growing on me. still not something i'd lust over though.

7/19/2008 4:19:24 PM

worst deal ever. for that price it should weight 1500lb.

7/19/2008 5:10:34 PM

So the final weight is gonna be ~2800 lbs.

There will be a full convertible version.

And the SC version will have 400+hp. Now THERE's something to like.

8/6/2008 2:43:02 AM

Quote :

"If you put an intake on the car you cant even hear the exhaust period."

Well, if you upgrade the exhaust (Especially to a single) then you wont hear that cone filter intake, period.


[Edited on August 6, 2008 at 4:06 AM. Reason : Buddy Club Spec III (Or Spugen or T1R 70mm) FTW. If you want to get stupid, J's 70RR.]

8/6/2008 3:58:24 AM

I would consider the BC spec 4.

I heard a spec 3 from a friend in raleigh. Its pretty damn loud.

Its a good way to shave 50lbs off the car though.

Ive been pulled over for noise with the stock exhaust before. Are the 70RR's even DOT legal?

8/6/2008 12:57:46 PM

this doesn't directly answer your question, but I'm pretty sure as long as an exhaust is quieter than 98 decibels its street legal in all states.

My exhaust isn't terribly loud but I have been pulled over (in NYC) for having a "non-stock" exhaust. I knew that was the biggest loud of shit ever, but played nice with the cop and just got a warning.

[Edited on August 6, 2008 at 2:21 PM. Reason : k]

8/6/2008 2:19:43 PM

Has anybody said that the official name of the car is Evora?

Anyway, I saw it at the British International Motor Show last Friday.

BTW, I know that hp is not everything, but doesn't the engine make 268 hp in the Camry? And the 3.5 litre V6 in the Lexus IS makes 306 hp. But since highe powered versions will be released, I guess 280 isn't bad for a base model.

8/6/2008 5:21:50 PM

i hope they cover up that airbag space. why not blend it in with the rest of the dash.

8/6/2008 5:26:56 PM

^^Keep in mind it weights 800-1000 pounds less than either of those cars.

But yes, god what an awful, awful name. EVORA, seriously?

8/6/2008 7:21:55 PM

^just a little lighter than the Cayman.

8/7/2008 4:44:37 PM

"danmanevora"

Current dream garage in 1-6 years:
-40-60kmi my2008/9 evora, trd sprchgr?
-low 1st buyer miles 2008/9 bmw 135i coupe
-2008 mini cooper/s clubman for the wife and kid
-95 jag xjr (inline6, prev8)
-seriously ragged out db7 coupe...doesn't matter what trim/mileage/engine/transmission.... All I'll be doing to it is stroking it with a diaper.....

[Edited on August 8, 2008 at 2:30 AM. Reason : I type too much sometimes]

8/8/2008 2:12:00 AM

i'd hit it

8/13/2008 11:42:08 AM