Current Jobs:

Local school system IT Department. 40 hours a week. Base pay of about $25k. Lots of time off and downtime. Very relaxed and love my boss and get along good with most of my team. No overtime or chance for overtime. Very secure.
Cellular Sales: Part-time side job. Pretty relaxed. No pressure. Nice environment. Usually get 750-1000 month for working 2-3 hours a day during the work week and every other Sat. 10-4. Its hourly plus commission.

Job offer: The part-time employers wants to offer me a job 40/hours a week doing IT. $30k. Only 40 hours a week. Double my commute. Current time leaving and returning is 6:30 am to 6:30 pm. Would go to 7:00 am to 6:00 pm. Will go from 24 accrued days a year sick/vacation time to 5 vacation days a year. Would have chances for overtime, probably quite a bit. Probably would be more cutting edge on technology and would therefore teach me more.

If I can get him to pay me the same as what I make now, do you think it would be worth the chance to jump to a smaller company that may give me more chances to advance, or would you stick with the more secure job with guaranteed retirement, etc.?

Currently I am leaning to stick with the current situation. I don't gain much time at home, I will be physically farther away from home, and I will be working in a more stressful environment. But if I can talk him up on the money, then would it be worth it to you?

10/30/2007 9:39:37 AM

I guess what it really comes down to is this. Do you feel as though you have the time to spare? Double the commute, less vacation/sick time, more stress, tenuous employment, etc...
What's important to you now, time with family or a chance for promotion?

The benefits seem like a downgrade, hopefully you can negotiate on that.

I wouldn't go for the job, just b/c it doesn't seem all that much better than your current situation.

10/30/2007 9:49:56 AM

Yea I told him from the outset that he would be fighting an uphill battle and the only thing that he could throw at me would be money to make up the difference. I'm about 95% sure that I will be staying right the hell where I am, but just wanted to see what some other tech guys thought of this. One guy said it was not a bad offer for entry level tech. with no certs yet, but I have a year here next month, and the current payment just will not cut it at all from the prospective employer.

[Edited on October 30, 2007 at 9:56 AM. Reason : ]

10/30/2007 9:55:56 AM

You definitely need some certs though. Government jobs are far and away better in situations like this.

10/30/2007 10:30:13 AM

Both jobs sound like a stepping stone. Decide what you want out of life and pick the job that's going to get you there the quickest.

The "security" of the first job is a trap that I've admittedly fallen into as well. It's easy to stop trying when you can just collect a paycheck and know you're secure in retirement, but that's pretty weak when you consider that you only get one chance in life.

[Edited on October 30, 2007 at 11:03 AM. Reason : s]

10/30/2007 10:57:04 AM

Quote :

"Double my commute. Current time leaving and returning is 6:30 am to 6:30 pm. Would go to 7:00 am to 6:00 pm"

I don't understand this...if the commute is longer, why are you leaving later and getting home sooner?

Quote :

"Will go from 24 accrued days a year sick/vacation time to 5 vacation days a year. "

5 days a year off? Thats horrible. There better be a HUGE pay increase from Job A to Job B for taking that much of a cut in vacation time. Overall I don't think a 5K pay increase is nearly good enough considering how crappy the benefits are at the new place.

So the new job would be doing IT work for a Cell Phone Sales company?

10/30/2007 11:02:37 AM

Skack, I am already at the first job, and have been here almost a year.

Synapse, the reason being is that I am working my fulltime gov't job, and then going to a part-time job in the afternoons. Evenn with this, I'm still coming home only 30 minutes later. The job that they are offering me I would be unable to work a second job with, and would have more of a commute. However I can carpool with my neighbor who also works there.

And I agree about the days off and shit too. My current job gets all major holidays, couple days around Thanksgiving, 3 for Christmas, etc. etc. and they get like the day of off only.

And no they are a multifaceted communications company. They own radio towers, are an indirect retailer for a cellular provider, do radios and pagers, business phones, and provide internet service and computer support. They do dialup and microwave to home customers, DSL to business customers, and higher speed connections to hotels and other businesses.

10/30/2007 12:02:41 PM

Basically your banking on the fact that you can advance faster and cash out on a possible ipo.

Otherwise nothing you've described is remotely appealing.

10/30/2007 12:26:43 PM

Here's my take. I formerly worked an IT state job for Homeland Security. Great job, was easy, decent pay of 30k+ and great benefits, pension and hours. You get the normal 3% pay increase and possible overtime and promotions.

But I wanted something more than to be complacent and took a chance consulting/right to hire with a couple of companies. To me it was a win/win situation as I got a test run with other work environment and could see which ones were good in comparision with the gov't job and the new company could see if they liked me enough to hire me. I knew I could always go back to my state job, since they loved me so much, but I thought I could find better.

And I did and less than a year after leaving was hired on full time with another business and basically doing the same kind of work. The commute was about the same and now my pay now is equal to what I would have gotten paid at the state if I maxed out my position in promotions and waited about 5+ years for pay increases.

So the long story short, it was worth looking elsewhere and I know I can always go back if I really missed that job but I don't see it happening. I do plan on looking again in a year or two, after my 401K is vested...it's the easiest way to jump up fast, versus waiting for a promotion to come top you.

10/30/2007 12:40:23 PM

wtf


you guys are IT Grads making $25k a year?




am i missing something, here?

10/30/2007 12:53:29 PM

If you want to work in IT, keep looking. Those salaries are pathetic.

10/30/2007 1:21:39 PM

5k a year is NOT worth the trade off in holidays and stuff.
(3.5k ish after taxes...there's a thought for you)

It's no WAY worth it with less holidays/sick days AND more stress AND more time commuting.

Flat out do NOT do it. That said, - like the others here said if you have a degree (like CS) you are being way underpaid. IF you don't, seriously look into it or certifications.

10/30/2007 7:02:22 PM

Quote :

"5 vacation days a year"

Dear god. You'd have to pay me 100K for me to even consider a job like that.

Quote :

"Those salaries are pathetic."

Agreed.

10/30/2007 7:26:50 PM

Quote :

"you guys are IT Grads making $25k a year?"

think 25k x 4

10/30/2007 10:21:44 PM

At 25k, these guys are stealing from you (unless you suck at IT).

10/30/2007 10:37:16 PM

Quote :

"If you want to work in IT, keep looking. Those salaries are pathetic."

10/31/2007 3:57:17 AM

Sorry guess I didn't mention I have no degree, yet, working on it, and no certs to speak of. Got about 2 years towards my IT degree.

10/31/2007 9:09:20 PM

Your alumnus status threw me off.

10/31/2007 9:29:46 PM

fuck no i wouldnt move for that.

if you can eek out 35-40k, it may be worth it. otherwise id stick with what you've got. you likely have much better benefits with the government, and more job security.

keep what your doing, get your degree, and then move up a full notch in the job scales.

10/31/2007 10:12:09 PM

Just to clarify...30k was my first job after graduating in the decline of the technology around 2001 when the dot.com burst. I would have liked more but I was just getting experience under my belt. My friends were having trouble finding jobs and people were getting laid off left and right. Jobs are much better now and you can say I am approaching close to 3x that now. :-) I hope to make another jump in the next year and maybe change try for management in the future.

^ I agree if u haven't graduated the gov't job is safe and will make finishing easier, as you job is not as demanding and usually gov't jobs are more pro-education for their employees, which is good for studying.

[Edited on October 31, 2007 at 10:54 PM. Reason : agree]

10/31/2007 10:52:26 PM

Just so you know if you are in IT and making less than 50K you are getting reamed. It's fairly easy to find jobs in the $40/hr range in Raleigh now if you have experience.

11/3/2007 10:58:02 AM

experience is the word of the day.

11/3/2007 11:08:06 AM

^Exactly sir. As of this month I have a whopping one whole year of documentable experience in IT.

BTW thread is over I think. The guy talked to me about doing overtime and stuff to makeup the difference, but I told him thanks but the base salary would have to be higher to entice me away. Have not heard back from him, but I assume that its done for at this point.

[Edited on November 3, 2007 at 11:22 AM. Reason : ]

11/3/2007 11:19:02 AM

ANY experience though. Without it you should still be making $50K

Just know if you are a contractor and making $50K your company is taking 50% of the bill rate for doing nothing

11/3/2007 12:12:03 PM

uh, most companies bill their employees at 2-3x their base hourly pay. That's standard fare.

11/3/2007 3:09:17 PM

Keeping the current job is the only way you are going to be able to finish your degree

period

11/3/2007 3:27:20 PM

Quote :

"Just so you know if you are in IT and making less than 50K you are getting reamed. It's fairly easy to find jobs in the $40/hr range in Raleigh now if you have experience. ANY experience though. Without it you should still be making $50K"

WTF? IT != Computer Science

[Edited on November 4, 2007 at 10:01 AM. Reason : ]

11/4/2007 9:49:34 AM

^ eh, its really a frindge field between CSC and ECE

you don't need a degree to be successful in IT though. Most if not all of our corporate IT/Infrastructure folks at Duke Energy are non-degreed. I work with it some on the plant process control side, but most of the time I'm doing I&C. Either way, as stated $30K is low.

11/6/2007 5:14:06 AM

don't change jobs. Hold that gov't job ti'll you get your degree. It looks good to employers if you can hold a solid job for a long period of time. Esp once you get your degree any company will understand your feelings to move up.

11/6/2007 8:21:59 AM

^^ Yeah, but Cael was saying without any experience you should easily be able to make 50K.

11/6/2007 9:03:29 AM

yeah. you guys are in teh wrong part of town or something. $30K is how much bank tellers or law enforcement makes. at that rate your COLLEGE EDUCATION was worthless. my advice: GO BACK TO COLLEGE and get in the competitive work force.

you're going to die miserable at that rate.

11/6/2007 4:29:19 PM

He doesn't have his degree yet.

11/6/2007 4:31:31 PM

30K is terrible. my first IT job was $50K with no college. just military and I didn't even have experience from the military.

you're getting reamed. also what I've found is most IT guys making $70K+ typically don't even have degrees and the ones that do typically never majored in engineering or anything like that.

11/6/2007 4:31:48 PM

What the hell does IT mean, b/c I was under the impression it was misc computer hardware/software maintenance?

11/6/2007 4:33:00 PM

Quote :

"uh, most companies bill their employees at 2-3x their base hourly pay. That's standard fare. "

I know and it's bullshit. Mine get 5%.

11/6/2007 7:47:07 PM

It's not bullshit at all, especially if you get healthcare and retirement (401k/pension)

Most companies pay 8-30% of an employee's pay for health care yearly, plus operating expenses, lost time for sickness and vacation, it all rounds out.

Of course employees never look at it that way until they try and run their own business and realize all the shit that everyone seems to take for granted.

11/7/2007 4:28:35 AM

You qualified it. Yes it's bullshit, no it's not bullshit if you get all those benefits, but I know people making $40/hr and the contracting company gets $80/hr. They don't get benefits in that case. That is bullshit. It wouldn't be bullshit if contracting companies where in themselves intelligent enough to find qualified people, but they aren't. A lot of the big ones have referred 7 garbage candidates in a row to us.

Payroll and taxes take at most $3/hr a head.

11/7/2007 4:18:28 PM

^

Really good benefits are about $7.50/hr, our benefits package is worth about $15,000. We get a month vacation matching on 401K up to 10% and health, dental, disability, and life. All that for only $7.50/hr or $15,000/yr. Add in the $3 payroll = $10.50/hr to break even for the contracting company. Most however don't offer benefits.

11/8/2007 1:38:30 PM

Bttt, the owner of the other company came to me after work last night and offered me a minimum of $35k for the base 40 hours/week pay. Now I'm a lot more interested.

We are off for Veterans Day at work, so I'm going to go up there and actually shadow the guy that does the same job as I would be doing as a Sr. Network Engineer.

[Edited on November 9, 2007 at 10:00 AM. Reason : ]

11/9/2007 9:53:58 AM

he's still trying to play you or he really doesn't know what the people in the field pay.

11/9/2007 11:08:59 AM

Quote :

"Sr. Network Engineer."

Yeah, I'd say 35K is pretty low.

11/9/2007 11:13:27 AM

Even if you get $50K you are getting fucked unless you are are totally entry level. The jobs in Raleigh are averaging $35 to $40 an hour (that's 70-80K). And with a little experience (5 years) or if you are just totally bad ass and know your stuff $50/hr to $70/hr is possible.

11/9/2007 11:54:17 AM

Hmm, I've been doing IT work for about 5 years now for primarily the same company.. I'm going to be looking for a new job soon, haven't decided if I should try getting a few certifications or no? I don't have anything to prove I know what I'm doing besides the years of experience at the same job...I'm getting absolutely REAMED by the pay standards you guys have put out there in this thread but my situation is a bit more complicated right now

11/9/2007 1:44:20 PM

i would try to get company a to pay for your certs. then leave.

voila company b sees that AND your experience and BAM! new job :bling:



[Edited on November 9, 2007 at 1:59 PM. Reason : previous message deleted b/c i was dumb]

11/9/2007 1:47:09 PM

Why would I need a new heater core? lol

I think that's what I'll try to do.. Any suggestions on what certs to try to obtain first?

I've never really even looked into any certs and since I've been at the same place so long, have no idea which ones are most valuable and reasonable to obtain

[Edited on November 9, 2007 at 1:52 PM. Reason : asdf]

11/9/2007 1:48:07 PM

cisco certs?

11/9/2007 1:53:49 PM

Yeah, I'll start looking into them... MCSE of any value? I would assume so, just checking tho

11/9/2007 1:58:32 PM

MCSE isn't worth the paper it's printed on, BUT it doesn't hurt to have it.

i'd make sure you have it all down first before you get any certs.

i got put on the spot once and it was uncomfortable for sure. i knew the question, but what if i didn't?
ooooooooooweeeee.

depends on what you are going for. some people just like getting cisco first.that would not have been good.

the entry level cisco certs mean nothing. the higher tier = more money.

[Edited on November 9, 2007 at 2:02 PM. Reason : elton john]

11/9/2007 2:01:08 PM

I see... Well, time to do some research

11/9/2007 2:06:13 PM

Well Won it is fucking backwoods eastern NC and southeastern VA, so its not like this is the capital of technology jobs.

BTW to reiterate I have NO certs, NO degree, and 1 year of technology work at a school system. I would like to think this job will get me working with more cutting edge technology, instead of everybodys hand me downs that we get to play with now as a school system employee. My plan would be to get a couple more years experience under my belt, here or there, and then seriously pitch for jobs in the RDU area, so that I can get somewhere that pays decent. Being where I'm at there is almost no demand for comp. techs and the cost of living kinda keeps the low pay from being a real big deal. I own a 1600 sq. ft brick house right now, cover a family of 4 and I am not spiraling into debt, but paying for everything we have. $35k wouldn't cover shit in RDU. So I can't reasonably expect to get paid what you guys are getting with a full degree and multiple certs and a much more competitive environment with a higher cost of living.

11/9/2007 3:54:03 PM