Anyone ever had any experience with it? Taking someone to court or defending?

1/3/2007 1:23:19 PM

come on it's only $5, i'll pay back when i get the money

1/3/2007 2:29:40 PM

nah, its more like 450....and I might add in some late fees.

1/3/2007 2:46:50 PM

Just remember you are under the burden of proof. Unless you're 100% sure you'll win don't waste your time. Make sure you have all your facts straight...

1/3/2007 3:14:04 PM

and if you're talking late fees you will probably have to provide something saying the person was aware of them ahead of time, and your rate has to follow a legal APR

1/3/2007 3:16:22 PM

One of my exroomates and I had to go to small claims court because we didn't pay rent. Its one of the top floors at the court house and you see people from all walks of life. You have to sit there and hear them argue over the stupidest shit.

[Edited on January 3, 2007 at 3:21 PM. Reason : Avod going to small claims]

1/3/2007 3:20:33 PM

yeah, I'm basically taking my former roommate to court because she's refused to pay her last month rent and utilities and the fees I charged her for leaving a huge mess.

1/3/2007 6:51:25 PM

Like someone has already said. . .have proof: the lease agreement, photos of the mess or damage left behind, receipts for any repair or cleaning that you had to have done. . .

1/3/2007 6:59:16 PM

^ what she said. You DO NOT want to make a return trip due to lack of evidence.

1/3/2007 7:12:22 PM

450 isnt worth the trouble. if you dont have documentation, you will NOT win.


i have sued people in small claims before, and its a pain.

you have to put a value on your time, not to mention the fact that you have to try and collect the money=odds are you are going to have to wait 30 days, then file for execution, then wait for the person you are sueing to try and make a large purchase that will be blocked it.


just clean up the mess and move on

1/3/2007 7:34:08 PM

If your former roommate is not an NCSU student, then get some advice from student legal services. I did that way back when and won ($800 which ended up being $600 after the defendent's lawyer said he would appeal), but the defendent was a real dick about the whole thing, so I was glad I had a lawyer.

It's really not that big of a deal, but, as everyone said, be sure you lay out evidence you can think of in advance, perhaps typing yourself out an itemized list. If you can, know the exact date she moved out, exact phone charges that were hers, have receipts for what you paid to clean things up or make repairs, etc.

Consider the possibility that she will make up a story. If that happens in court, do not argue or talk out of turn, or even make an irritated noise, just write yourself a note about what she said that wasn't accurate and keep listening. Pissing off the judge by interrupting the other person is not a good idea. Good luck.

1/3/2007 10:39:29 PM

hmm, the evidence is the hard part. I've already cleaned up most her mess, and we had a verbal agreement for the rent and utilities. I have emails telling her I would charge her for any mess she left, and the holes are still in the walls, and my bf and parents saw the mess she left... eh, guess we'll see.

1/3/2007 11:39:37 PM

Judge Joe Brown

1/3/2007 11:47:29 PM

Just let this be a lesson learned, don't waste your time because you probably won't recover much/anything on a verbal agreement.

[Edited on January 4, 2007 at 5:07 AM. Reason : .]

1/4/2007 5:07:17 AM

eh, well, I'm gonna take her in anyways. There's always a small chance she'd rather actually pay me than go to court....

1/4/2007 8:59:37 AM

Have you informed her that if you she doesn't pay up you'll take her to court? Mr Grace has got the right idea about it not being worth the time and the effort. But if she has a job/school and doesn't have time to deal with retaining a lawyer or representing herself she might just pay up.

1/4/2007 9:52:53 AM

Yes, I've told her, and she refuses to contact me (I don't know how I'm going to serve her papers if I don't know her damn address!! ) and the nc judicial website said that lawyers aren't usually involved in small claims cases.

Has anyone else sued in a roommate/tenant case?

1/4/2007 1:35:57 PM

you are only going to be out another 50 bucks


you can server her via the classifieds in the n&0- but then you'll be out some more money.



i own a business that serves landlords/ apartment complexes.

they never bother with court-and they have signed legal documents from the tenants. if anything they will simply send someone a bill, and if they dont pay they report it to the credit bureau

1/4/2007 1:59:36 PM

but I'm not a business and didnt have her sign a lease, so the only way I can get it on her credit report is if I take it to court and they rule in my favor and she doesnt pay....I think...

[Edited on January 4, 2007 at 2:23 PM. Reason : sdf]

1/4/2007 2:21:28 PM

Quote :

"didnt have her sign a lease"

you understand the point of leases right?

they are a legally binding contract

since you did not enter a legally binding contract, you will not be able to win in a court of law

1/4/2007 2:39:51 PM

but verbal agreements are supposedly legally binding. The point is, she paid rent and utilities for 4 months and is now refusing to pay for the last half month.

450 may not be alot to you, but it would definitely help me out. You seem to be the only person posting who has had actual experience, but you're not very encouraging. What can I do to up my chances of winning? Why wouldn't I win? What could the judge think that would make him favor her over me?

1/4/2007 2:45:37 PM

sorry im not sounding encouraging, but what good is asking for advice if you only take what you want to hear?

you need to look at it from a different angle.

they didnt physically damage your home, and you got 4 months payments out of her.

thats better than a lot situations i have seen landlords be in.


ask any lawyer about the "verbal agreement" and they will laugh in your face, for a reason.


its just going to have to be a lesson learned in my honest opinion.

i have been throught it before, and i actually lost the first round of one case even though i had all kinds of paperwork, photographic proof, and a signed affidavit from a professional in the field.
(first judge was an idiot)



what you have is a he said/she said situation, and no judge is going to find a judgement in that case.


in the future, make sure you get anything important in writing.

1/4/2007 3:00:08 PM

I also had to put up with her bullshit for an extra half month and clean up her mess after her... she did leave damages, as in stains and nail marks in the walls and a bunch of her junk and trash. I just wanted to know what experience people might have had at small claims court so I might know what I have to look forward to.

1/4/2007 3:26:32 PM

Student legal services would have been the best bet for you, but I see that you're an alum. After you've said more about it, I agree it's probably not worth your time. It seems weird that she owed you for "half of the month." Why not the whole month? Some nail holes in the wall aren't that big of a deal, she'll deny responsibility for the stains, and if I were her I might counter sue you for any of my stuff that you discarded just because I felt like being bitchy. She could just say that you had agreed that she could leave her stuff there. Or, she could make up a story and say that wasn't her stuff. You can't just decide to tack on "late fees" out of the blue. It's likely that you will totally contradict each other, so it would all totally come down to who the judge felt was more credible, and the burden of proof is on you, not her.

Just so others here know: the student legal services are free for NCSU students. Consider at least calling them and getting their opinion when something like this comes up. You students fees help pay for their service, after all, and they have much more experience than tdub (three full time lawyers). They were awesome when I sued someone (they even had to use the Sheriff to serve him the papers.)

Here's a link for students:

http://www.ncsu.edu/stud_affairs/legal_services/

1/4/2007 4:53:00 PM

I did send her an email saying I'd charge her, but I didn't specify and she didn't ask. It just burns me to think she might get away with what she did. She was so disrespectful of my property (she kept doing stupid shit like cutting a friend's hair in my living room and let my cat escape and then wouldn't help me catch her, and now this mess she left at my place) and now she is completely avoiding me, won't return my emails... I even went to where she works and she "left for the day" five minutes after I showed up in the store looking for her.


*sigh*

I've gotta try tho... at least for my pride.

1/4/2007 5:13:58 PM

Quote :

"but I'm not a business and didnt have her sign a lease"

I'm not even sure if it is legal if she didn't sign a lease. There are all sorts of laws about sub-leasing, whether you owned the property, etc. If it wasn't legal for her to be living there in the first place, you have NO chance of obtaining a judgment for rent.

If you have pictures of the damages and bills from it, you could probably still get that, but you need proof. Even then, how much did the cleaning stuff come to?

1/4/2007 5:23:35 PM

I own the house, so yes she can legally live there.

Like I said, I cleaned/am cleaning everything myself. According to move out sheets that apartments give, even if I halve everything she didnt clean (since I still live here) and don't count the holes in the walls (which apartments charge 10-20 per hole, and she left about 14 of them), she'd still owe about 150 for cleaning .

1/4/2007 6:22:13 PM

I am glad none of my roomates fucked me like that, I had one that came close but we worked things out.

1/4/2007 6:43:00 PM

i'd totally be willing to compromise but lke I said, she's being dodgy.

1/4/2007 6:48:34 PM

Quote :

"I own the house, so yes she can legally live there. "

Even if you own the place, I don't think it is legal until you officially sub-lease it. From what I understand, its a pain in the ass, but unless you do it, she can leave at any time and have no legal obligation to pay you, even with a "verbal" contract. Even if she admits you had a verbal contract and admits she didn't pay for the last month of rent, she has NO legal obligation to pay you.

Thats what I gather though. It may vary from state to state though.

1/4/2007 10:53:38 PM

all I know is that verbal contracts are legally binding with regards to leasing situations. I dont know how you "officially" sublease a house you own. I've tried finding info on it, but its hard to come by...there don't seem to be many official rules for landlords who live in the same house as their tenant

on another note, I got a check today in the mail from her, but I'm not sure if its any good. She had an automatic payment set up, for one, and also she's had alot of bounced checks recently. I'll have to call tomorrow and see if I can actually cash it. If so, i'll go with that as a compromise since its more than what utilities and rent cost her, but less than what I charged for cleaning up her mess.

[Edited on January 4, 2007 at 11:05 PM. Reason : kjh]

1/4/2007 11:00:58 PM

^Well, having a check is some definite progress. I would make a photocopy of the check before attempting to cash it and also I would save the enveloped she mailed it in. Why would you call to check on the check? Just cash it. If it bounces, then you will win in court I think. By writing the check, she has basically admitted that she owes some money. So, it sounds like one way or the other you're in good shape.

1/4/2007 11:09:32 PM

Yep, if she was trying to stiff you, sending a check was the wrong move. That should be enough evidence to get you a small claims judgement if it bounces.

And that law about officially subleasing something may just be a New York law. I think that is the area that I heard about it from.

1/4/2007 11:19:36 PM

PROOF:

In your situation you need to get copies of your bank statements where her checks were deposited as well as copies of your bills that she paid her part of.

I hope you charged her the same percentage each month. Did she ever get any mail at your address. DO NOT OPEN IT. Tell the court you were keeping it until she came to pay you and never showed up.

What's her name anyway. There were some pretty good people on her finding the bitch that skipped out on my mom. Found her ass, sued her AND she went to jail for 90 days because of repeat offenses.

1/4/2007 11:34:30 PM

You are 100% completely screwed unless she voluntarily pays you.

This is why landlords get first and last months rent up front, why they charge security deposits and why they have you sign everything and it's brother in duplicate.

Because it's easy as hell for people to skip out, and hard as hell to get them to pay what they owe when/if they do.

You got lucky she sent you anything, next time you rent your place get it all in writing, signed by both parties. Verbal agreements are only binding if they are recorded or there is some written signed evidence to support it.

1/5/2007 12:44:14 AM

Quote :

"but less than what I charged for cleaning up her mess. "

Which was? (Out of curiosity)

1/5/2007 12:54:00 AM

I charged her 110... you really should have seen the place, mtn dew cans overflowing from the trash can AND in the garage, dirty dishes and pans still in the sink, she hadn't even thought about cleaning her room.... I'm not sure she ever vacuumed her room or cleaned her sink from all the hair and gunk I had to pull out of the drain, and then all the crap she left and the holes in the walls *sigh* I looked at a couple of apartment cleaning fee sheets and she would have been charged at least $100 just for the holes in the walls.


^^^ yeah, I'm not sure she's even put in a change of address form yet since I'm still getting mail for her.

1/5/2007 9:49:14 AM

I took someone to court for the same thing for about the same $$$. There were 3 of us in the apartment that had to pay rent and damages for the other 1. We split the court costs 3 ways and I did the legwork.

The guy showed up to court with an ankle bracelet on because he trashed some girls apartment the first time he tripped (LSD). Anyways, with all the documentation I had he couldn't contest it and basically after about 2 minutes he just said "Judge I owe the money".

We got a judgement against him and it went on his credit, but he did't care anyway. So basically for our $50 court costs we made his life a little more aggravating while the judgement was on his credit report.

-- Dave

1/5/2007 10:44:36 AM

Just find out what it takes to go on Judge Mathis and do that.

1/5/2007 12:19:17 PM

^^ see, if she didn't pay me, it going on the credit report would be sweet, esp if I could find out where she's living...then I could tell her new apartment complex and well, the consequences may be worth it...

but i'm just being evil... i'm much rather have money

^ and I did fill out the online form for judge mathis, lol

[Edited on January 5, 2007 at 1:12 PM. Reason : sf]

1/5/2007 1:11:49 PM

so did the check bounce? "you can't just give a build up like that and not...deliver" ---from Dazed and Confused in reference to the Abraham Lincoln dream. haha.

1/5/2007 4:02:14 PM

not yet but it's going to. I FINALLY got an email from her this morning, and she said that the check was sent in error and that she had closed that account etc etc

1/6/2007 12:35:35 PM

get her for writing a check on a closed account

1/6/2007 4:48:16 PM

Was that all the e-mail said? There wasn't any other kind of explanation or anything?

And was the check for what you say she owes you, or something else?

1/7/2007 9:52:18 AM

see if the check is any good before you asked her.

your actions might have given her enough time to close the account.

1/7/2007 12:06:04 PM

there's a specific court @ the wake county court house for bad checks. it's how businesses get their money when checks bounce. I know nothing about it but here's the link:

http://web.co.wake.nc.us/districtattorney/WorthlessCheckProgram.htm

[Edited on January 7, 2007 at 7:58 PM. Reason : ...]

1/7/2007 7:57:39 PM

Because she moved so often, she would just have the bank send checks, so she had the monthly rent on automatic draft, so supposedly, that was still active even tho her account was closed, and that she put a stop payment on the most recent check I received on Jan 2.

I was hoping the check was a compromise by her in an attempt to not have to ever contact me again. My reasoning was since rent was usually due on the 10th of the month and didn't usually arrive till then, and I received it on Jan 2nd which was also my cutoff date for when I wanted the rent (since I'd let her defer payment of the last month rent in hopes she would move out earlier and I could charge her less) But, I guess not

1/8/2007 10:53:01 AM

where did you get the $450 amount?

i'm almost positive it's only $30 - lawyers are only charging slightly more if you are too lazy to do it yourself

just a quick google search though....who knows
http://www.rmlawgroup.com/smallclaims/index.htm

Quote :

"You must bring $55 to file the lawsuit, plus $15 for each defendant (to cover the cost of the sheriff delivering the papers to the defendants). "

http://www.hatchlittlebunn.com/landlord_tenant_law.html

1/8/2007 11:16:37 AM

^$450 is about what she owes me. I know court costs are around 65.

1/8/2007 11:29:08 AM

ahh i misread that

have you filed the papers yet or are you still sitting around doing nothing about it?

1/8/2007 11:45:47 AM