Quote :

"The Ten Commandments could be posted in schools and government buildings and a large monument with the biblical directives would be placed outside the Capitol under legislation awaiting the signature of Gov. Ernie Fletcher, an ordained Baptist minister. "The governor looks forward to signing this bill," said Brett Hall, spokesman for the Republican governor who is currently in the hospital where he is being treated for a blood clot. "I'm sure he will be very happy to hear this news." The measure passed without debate in the House on Friday in a 90-5 vote, and drew immediate criticism from the American Civil Liberty Union of Kentucky. House Speaker Jody Richards, D-Bowling Green, said he believes the measure is constitutional because the commandments would be part of displays with other historical documents. "It's a bill that the people of Kentucky largely support," Richards said."

http://www.kentucky.com/mld/kentucky/news/local/14067781.htm?source=yahoodist&content=ken_news

3/12/2006 1:07:54 AM

It sucks that they would choose to do that, but it's really not that big of a deal.

Plus, if enough Hindus/Muslims/whoever else complain, I would think the law would have a hard time standing up in court.

But, they should post the 10 Commandments at presidential press conferences, in execution chambers, and on the inside of fighter jets too, if they love it so much.

[Edited on March 12, 2006 at 1:21 AM. Reason : ]

3/12/2006 1:20:40 AM

very appropriate user name

3/12/2006 1:24:48 AM

Yeah, Jon is pretty spooky.

3/12/2006 1:37:43 AM

^^Because he hasn't heard that before.

[Edited on March 12, 2006 at 1:38 AM. Reason : .]

3/12/2006 1:38:33 AM

^^^^ Don't forget Jews.

And atheists.

And patriots.

^^ Tru dat.

[Edited on March 12, 2006 at 1:39 AM. Reason : ^ erg]

3/12/2006 1:38:59 AM

^The Jews are probably the ones behind it

3/12/2006 1:56:12 AM

the 10 commandments are good advice, regardless of religion.

3/12/2006 3:59:12 AM

I demand Plato’s Republic to be framed page by page and posted in every government area that people want Christian stuff to be in, b/c we might want to count ancient Greek political thoughts as historical documents when it comes to our democracy if we are going to include the teenage angst stories of Yahweh’s communist kid.

Quote :

"the 10 commandments are good advice, regardless of religion."

They are pansy. 10 rules can't make you a good person. Things aren't that simple... careful and thorough thought can take you alot further without using a 10 rule check list.

3/12/2006 4:09:55 AM

Good to see that Kentucky isn't wasting taxpayer dollars.

3/12/2006 4:19:17 AM

Go ACLU. Don't let them pull that bullshit "history" excuse for religion.

Quote :

"the 10 commandments are good advice, regardless of religion."

No, only about 3 of them.

3/12/2006 9:02:33 AM

well, most of them.

3/12/2006 10:36:04 AM

^^ It is more than just three good ones.

And as a basic rule set, you could rough out a pretty good society on just those. With respect for people and property, any libertarian could tell you the rest. Thou shalt not lie, steal, or murder. I assume everything else could be handled by a system of common law. The only question would be how zealous they are with the rest of them, which could vary from wrecking all productive achievment to simply driving other religions under-ground.

[Edited on March 12, 2006 at 10:44 AM. Reason : .,.]

3/12/2006 10:42:43 AM

I AM THE LORD THY GOD. YOU SHALL HAVE NO OTHER GODS BEFORE ME.

3/12/2006 11:13:24 AM

Quote :

"It is more than just three good ones."

Quote :

"Thou shalt not lie, steal, or murder."

Yeah, those were the three. I'm not seeing any more.

3/12/2006 11:18:47 AM

Would faking respect for our nation’s leader at a formal event count as a lie? Would stealing a car to get a wounded friend to the hospital count as stealing? Would shooting an intruder count as murder? Of course if the response to these is anything but a binary of yes or no then the 10 rule check list has failed because you need more thoroughly thought out laws to be enforceable and just.

3/12/2006 11:52:43 AM

Quote :

"Of course if the response to these is anything but a binary of yes or no then the 10 rule check list has failed because you need more thoroughly thought out laws to be enforceable and just."

Where was the assumption that those were the only 10 rules needed made? The only thing I saw that comes remotely close is:

Quote :

"the 10 commandments are good advice, regardless of religion."

3/12/2006 12:09:11 PM

Quote :

"the 10 commandments are good advice, regardless of religion."

this would be true if not for the pesky first, second, third, and fourth commandments

3/12/2006 12:41:14 PM

"Where was the assumption..."
"The only thing I saw that comes remotely close is"

My point is that alone they are not really that great of advice, they are very lacking, so it’s not a great justification for putting up church doctrine in state owned property and I think I’ve already made it clear in the context of this thread that I’m attacking potential justifications for this as with case of “historical documents” since there are a lot more historical documents that strongly impacted our nations democracy. I’m glad you found the sentence I was responding to, you seemed to treat it as hidden and mysterious, but I hope it was easy to find since I quoted it.

3/12/2006 12:41:16 PM

go ahead

put 'em up

if these kids quit acting like badasses because the ten commandments are hanging in the classroom, more power to 'em

[Edited on March 12, 2006 at 2:38 PM. Reason : +]

3/12/2006 2:37:36 PM

Isn't this pretty much exactly what the Supreme Court just upheld last term?

3/12/2006 2:55:39 PM

Catholics and Lutherans use a different 10 commandments than Protestant. To be "historical" they need to put up all three versions.

http://www.biblicalheritage.org/Bible%20Studies/10%20Commandments.htm

[Edited on March 12, 2006 at 2:59 PM. Reason : s]

3/12/2006 2:56:34 PM

To quote a buddy of mine:

Quote :

"Religion is Ethics with a plot."

So, how bout we get rid of the backstory..

Get rid of 1 and 2.. since they directly relate to the blatant religious side of the ethical grounds layed out.

3 and 4 can also go, since one dictates a day of worship, and the other involves how part of the plot can be talked about.

Now we finally get to the meat. Don't kill, don't steal, don't lie. Sound like good ethical practices. Honor mom and dad, don't sleep with another man's wife, also sound advice.

And 10? Well.. kinda hard not to have desire in a capitalist culture.

So lets just have the 5 Ethics. Same message, without the religious/plot crap.

3/12/2006 2:57:04 PM

^ So how bout we... have done with the anti-religious hatred from people like you? Yup, sounds good to me.

^^ Eh, I don't think it's necessary to put up all three versions, as long as the basic understanding is the same. It doesn't have to be letter perfect in order to be a historical representation.

[Edited on March 12, 2006 at 3:16 PM. Reason : yep that sounds good]

3/12/2006 3:16:31 PM

Jews have a different list.

And attribute far less importance to said list.


Hey, here's an idea. You know after the tablets were destroyed, and God told Moses he would remake them exactly the same as before, and then he gives him a list COMPLETELY different from the old list? Why don't we use THOSE ten commandments?

3/12/2006 3:20:08 PM

Quote :

"^ So how bout we... have done with the anti-religious hatred from people like you? Yup, sounds good to me. "

don't even play that game. You have just as much anti-religious hatred as the next person. You hate the fact that I don't have a god. I accept the fact that you believe in god and do not hate you for that, but I don't understand why you cannot accept the fact that I do not believe in any diety.

3/12/2006 3:23:01 PM

HEEEEEEELLLLLLLLLLFIRE AND DAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAMNATION!

3/12/2006 3:34:37 PM

Hey, it's aaronburro.

3/12/2006 3:48:12 PM

we need to get rid of all states that start with a K

3/12/2006 5:11:11 PM

This bill again? *checks calendar* Yep, it's campaign season in the south again.

Seriously folks, this is much ado about nothing. The bill won't stand up to a legal challenge even if it is signed by the governor. Yes, it's another annoying gasp of frivolity from the jackoffs who'd prefer the United States to be a theocracy, but it's nothing to worry about.These things are passed and struck down routinely every couple years; Alabama was only the most recent example that comes to mind.

The way I see it, there are only two way this idea works: (1) Recognize and represent no religions in public (read: government) displays, or (2) Recognize and represent all religions in public displays.

I'd go with the former for practical reasons. It's far easier, less costly, and raises exactly _zero_ constitutional issues. Practice what you practice at home or at church. Put the commandments on your cars and the exterior walls of your own house if you want to, but government buildings ought to be off limits.

But, if the latter view is more palatable to you, I'd argue that they need to post the 8 Noble Truths of Buddhism, some words from Lao Tse on the Tao, the tenants of Islam, and pretty much every other list of religious ethics currently practiced in the United States. Otherwise the 14th amendment isn't even being considered.

Quote :

"Wolfpack2K: ^ So how bout we... have done with the anti-religious hatred from people like you? Yup, sounds good to me."

Better than a real retort I guess. And easier to type to boot.

For shits and giggles, can you point me to the religious hatred in Sayer's post? If not, I'll just continue to assume you're another of the "oppressed minority" Christians who still believe you're not in charge and don't run anything despite overwhelming evidence to the contrary. I guess that's faith for you.

3/12/2006 5:13:58 PM

i wonder when the nutjobs will get around to try to amend the constitution to make Christianity the official religion of the United States

i wonder if they ever bat that idea around

3/12/2006 5:17:42 PM

what a wonderful waste of money

3/12/2006 5:24:09 PM

Quote :

"The Jews are probably the ones behind it "

3/12/2006 5:29:26 PM

Quote :

"House Speaker Jody Richards, D-Bowling Green, said he believes the measure is constitutional because the commandments would be part of displays with other historical documents"

umm, teh 10 commandments != a historical document

3/12/2006 5:37:44 PM

Now let's see if this thread really takes off.

I'll start with a siren.

3/12/2006 5:44:48 PM