shotguns, b. the ting go skrrra pap pap ka ka ka skidiki pap pap and a pu pu drrrr boom SKYAAA du du ku ku tun tun poom poom

[Edited on February 15, 2018 at 9:38 AM. Reason : page 95]

2/15/2018 9:36:20 AM

Thoughts and prayers of course!

2/15/2018 9:56:10 AM

I would not defend my home with an AR-15. That is reckless and eluesis I hope you don't have any neighbors, or live in a brick house.

The best home defense weapon, IMHO, is the Taurus judge. Put 000 buckshot in that thing and you're good to go. If you can't hit a target with 5 rounds of 000 buck, you don't deserve to own a firearm anyway.

In my post regarding home defense, I said nothing about having an AR-15. I'm just talking about the 2nd Amendment in general.

2/15/2018 10:12:17 AM

22 cal bullets out of an AR penetrate walls less effectively than buckshot.

2/15/2018 10:23:59 AM

http://how-i-did-it.org/drywall/index.html

[Edited on February 15, 2018 at 10:28 AM. Reason : An AR is an excellent home defense weapon. Much better than a handgun. ]

2/15/2018 10:25:26 AM

It isn't just about going through drywall for home defense. You also have to be a pretty decent shot.

In the middle of the night.

Groggy but at the same time pumped with adrenaline.

Regular joe's gonna blow holes all over the place with an AR. A small spread with a .410 shell would probably yield better results.

2/15/2018 11:34:51 AM

Quote :

"An AR is an excellent home defense weapon"

A shotgun is a better home defense weapon.

Unless your use case is killing zombies from your roof.

2/15/2018 11:36:54 AM

^^ are there loads that will have significant spread inside 15'-20'?

2/15/2018 11:47:34 AM

So what do we do.

Do we expand background checks to include things like social media posts? If so, then we need a mechanism for denial. Right now the only denials are felonies and diagnosed mental illnesses, right?

God people would lose their shit if they knew they could get denied based on posts on social media. Hell half of TWW users would probably be denied.

But I think that might be a good start, outside of banning the sale of certain items or confiscation of certain items.

^probably not, but it would have to be better than a single round, wouldn't it?

[Edited on February 15, 2018 at 11:51 AM. Reason : dasdfas]

2/15/2018 11:49:34 AM

Forget background checks, we have to vet gun buyers with a process that starts at a "no" and puts the onus on them to prove they should legally own a gun. More like getting a driver's license than getting approved for a credit card (which is still harder than buying a gun). It should include an in-person interview and for the buyer to produce their complete school/work, medical, and legal history for review.

[Edited on February 15, 2018 at 12:32 PM. Reason : blah]

2/15/2018 12:18:14 PM

Y'all don't have a good understanding of how buckshot loads actually perform in close quarters

2/15/2018 12:51:09 PM

^^^ supposedly Canada requires personal references, specifically people you were in a relationship with.

Considering how many of these mass shooters were also spouse/girlfriend beaters, that would probably put a dent in killings and mass shootings.

Confiscation of guns from any person charged with domestic violence would also have an impact.

2/15/2018 12:58:52 PM

what do you guys think about requiring insurance for guns, or taxing guns/ammo to raise money for a fund for gun victims

2/15/2018 1:00:36 PM

sales tax unfairly burdens the poor. insurance would too. unless it's income based or something which seems unlikely.

[Edited on February 15, 2018 at 1:08 PM. Reason : .]

2/15/2018 1:07:36 PM

hmmm, that's a good point. especially in regards to insurance.

i think a sales tax could be set so it didn't cause a burden, yeah they are regressive and so not perfect but that doesn't mean they are always so bad they outweigh the benefit.

here is an opinion piece that is being shared on twitter calling for a 0.02/bullet tax:https://www.adn.com/opinions/2018/02/03/for-two-cents-a-round-we-can-help-victims-of-gun-violence/

Seattle taxes $25/gun and up to $0.05 per bullet, if you made a federal tax at a similar rate i don't think that would be unduly burdensome

2/15/2018 1:16:50 PM

republicans don't care about the poor's ability to afford anything... until it comes time to discuss insurance / tax / etc on firearms, then the poor being poor is an issue they care about.

2/15/2018 1:26:18 PM

i'm not a republican or a right-winger so i'm not sure what that comment is about. i'm against all forms of sales tax because they disproportionately affect poorer people. same reason i'm against a flat tax.

i don't really care that much about a small sales tax on guns, i just think it's a road we always go down and we should start thinking about alternatives (same with cigaratte tax, gas tax, etc.)

donating to gun violence victims is good and all, but we should get to the root of the problem. people are angry and fucked in the head. why?

[Edited on February 15, 2018 at 1:50 PM. Reason : .]

2/15/2018 1:40:28 PM

Quote :

"what do you guys think about requiring insurance for guns, or taxing guns/ammo to raise money for a fund for gun victims"

Slapping a tax (or insurance) on guns for this purpose - while definitely admirable - seems really defeatist.

'Hey we can't control the rampant gun violence in this country because of the 2nd amendment, but you know...here's some money.'

2/15/2018 1:44:32 PM

it's a reality that victims have expenses, and public victim funds are limited, so this seems like a good way to solve that problem

it's only defeatist to you because you keep creating these false dilemmas where you can't do anything to address parts of the problem unless it solves all of the problems by itself

2/15/2018 1:51:24 PM

Ah you're right, I've forgotten all the groundwork we've made to curtail gun violence recently.

Fuck yourself.

2/15/2018 1:55:45 PM

#triggered

2/15/2018 2:03:04 PM

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2017/10/04/opinion/thoughts-prayers-nra-funding-senators.html


[Edited on February 15, 2018 at 2:23 PM. Reason : ]

2/15/2018 2:17:49 PM

fyi if that article is pay-walled for anyone, run chrome in incognito mode

2/15/2018 2:19:58 PM

Quote :

" https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2017/10/04/opinion/thoughts-prayers-nra-funding-senators.html "

So McCain is a first-rate hypocritical piece of shit? I always thought he was a good guy.

Fuck him, and all the rest

2/15/2018 2:41:50 PM

Quote :

"I would not defend my home with an AR-15. That is reckless and eluesis I hope you don't have any neighbors, or live in a brick house. The best home defense weapon, IMHO, is the Taurus judge. Put 000 buckshot in that thing and you're good to go. If you can't hit a target with 5 rounds of 000 buck, you don't deserve to own a firearm anyway. In my post regarding home defense, I said nothing about having an AR-15. I'm just talking about the 2nd Amendment in general."

You know, if you don’t have a clue about the subject you are discussing it would be better for everyone to just not talk about it.

2/15/2018 3:21:36 PM

The gymnastics the "we have to do something" crowd will do to try and come up with gun legislation that could be enacted without actually stopping people from getting guns always amazes me.

2/15/2018 7:15:46 PM

Woop woop, #hottake alert over here!

Someone get some ice!

2/15/2018 9:08:19 PM

Is that a MAGA hat?
http://www.sun-sentinel.com/local/broward/parkland/florida-school-shooting/fl-florida-school-shooter-gun-neighbor-20180215-story,amp.html

2/15/2018 9:11:23 PM

I have arguably the most bad-ass home defense 12-gauge shotgun on earth, and I would still grab an AR first if someone was breaking in and I couldn't just haul ass out the other side of the house.

If I had a Taurus Judge, I'd have to think long and hard about putting .410 buckshot in it over .45 Colt, and in either case, I'd far rather have a 9mm with a 15 or 20 rounds in it.

[Edited on February 15, 2018 at 9:30 PM. Reason : liability ins for gun ownership is an interesting idea, but i don't know how you'd enforce it]

2/15/2018 9:29:21 PM

^^ links not opening for me, but yes the shooter is a eleusis/HCH type who trained at a domestic terrorist camp (the kind Trump cut money to investigate)

r/the_donald is complicit in spreading terrorist propaganda to recruit and radicalize people like the shooter

2/15/2018 10:06:55 PM

^^Its pretty wild to think you have to grab a gun just because someone is entering your house. You're most likely going to shoot a close friend or family member.

2/15/2018 10:47:17 PM

^^lmfao on the TDub comparison

Quote :

"have to grab a gun just because someone is entering your house"

CONTEXT!

Person enters house at 3 PM while I'm watching TV is WAY different than person entering house at 4 AM while my family is asleep.

Person enters MY house while I live in a high crime neighborhood is WAY different than a person entering my house at 2 PM on the day that I'm having a party expecting a ton of people to be entering my house.

[Edited on February 15, 2018 at 11:35 PM. Reason : a]

2/15/2018 11:28:58 PM

Its still highly unlikely that a person entering your home at 4am is so much of a threat that they have to be shot.

2/15/2018 11:42:22 PM

no one breaking into my house at 4AM has intentions unworthy of being shot over.

2/16/2018 12:49:29 AM

^^I totally appreciate what you're saying in that respect. But that is not a gamble I will ever be willing to take.

2/16/2018 2:57:44 AM

so just admit you'd rather have thousands of people die in mass shootings than take that risk

[Edited on February 16, 2018 at 3:09 AM. Reason : stop pretending like you care enough to make the sacrifice. ]

2/16/2018 3:09:13 AM

even if crazy guy couldnt get a scary looking rifle he could drive over 30 people at the farmers market

2/16/2018 6:48:32 AM

I’m not opposed to cars being outlawed.

2/16/2018 7:17:53 AM

Quote :

"Its still highly unlikely that a person entering your home at 4am is so much of a threat that they have to be shot."

Quote :

"I totally appreciate what you're saying in that respect. But that is not a gamble I will ever be willing to take."

Quote :

"so just admit you'd rather have thousands of people die in mass shootings than take that risk"

I don't understand how you got from 1 person breaking in at 4am and the risk of shooting someone who [perhaps] means no harm, to THOUSANDS of people die in mass shootings. Maybe I'm getting earled...

2/16/2018 7:51:26 AM

If u have to ask...

2/16/2018 8:35:38 AM

Earl is trolling. I don't know why people keep taking him seriously.

2/16/2018 11:22:37 AM

FBI blew it according to Wray. Unacceptable and if protocol is followed this possibly could have been avoided.

That said, Trumpers are going to turn this into “witch hunt in to Russia caused this.” Just watch..

[Edited on February 16, 2018 at 12:43 PM. Reason : Although I’m still confused as to what could be done that doesn’t violate rights?]

2/16/2018 12:41:40 PM

Just 2 weeks ago in my town a video went viral of a local student loading a musket and naming "whores" at school he intended to shoot, and gave a step by step how to best kill people.

It took days before the police got involved, and the sheriff and superintendent decided that the kid was not a real threat and there was zero punishment (not even a single day of suspension or detention).

He still hasn't shot anyone, probably won't especially now that people are watching him, but the girls named in the video are scared shitless and some of them still haven't returned to school. That is legit terrorism.

Worth mentioning that he called them whores not because they sleep around, but because none of them would go out with him. He also uses some pretty direct neo-Nazi language on his instagram profile.

2/16/2018 1:49:01 PM

can someone spell it out for wizzkid and dtownral since they have already decided they wont accept it from me.

2/16/2018 2:34:23 PM

Quote :

"I don't understand how you got from 1 person breaking in at 4am and the risk of shooting someone who [perhaps] means no harm, to THOUSANDS of people die in mass shootings. Maybe I'm getting earled..."

People want guns for self protection. As a result of guns being available, mass shootings happen.

Don't think it's that simple personally but a lot of lefties would disagree.

2/16/2018 2:37:40 PM

The answer to an abuse of liberty isn’t to restrict liberty but to defend against that abuse. We think we can enjoy freedom w/o consequence, that people will exercise their liberties with virtue. When they inevitably don’t, we race to blame the liberty. That’s the wrong response.

2/16/2018 2:48:34 PM

blah blah blah blah blah.......


Gun nuts love to speak in philosophical and ideological terms when it comes to gun ownership and their "liberties", and then turn around and turn a blind eye, or worse, actively endorse the systematic stripping of liberties from themselves and their fellow citizens when it comes to systems of surveillance, mass incarceration, or acts of political dissent.

If yoy drew a venn diagram between vocal "muh liberties" gun enthusiasts and those who condone systems of state oppression of minorities and politically disenfranchised, and you'd be looking at a blurry circle.

Gun nuts don't like guns because it protects them from tyrannical governments. Gun nuts like guns because it EMBEDS them with tyrannical governments.

2/16/2018 3:37:22 PM

Quote :

" but to defend against that abuse."

right. that's gun control.

2/16/2018 3:42:03 PM

^^
idk man, the "arm the left" movement is growing, and it's kinda reductionist to say anyone who owns guns is actually a tyranny-enabling hypocrite

either way, owning guns to protect yourself from the government is dumb as shit because the US military is so far advanced compared to what we can buy as citizens

[Edited on February 16, 2018 at 4:03 PM. Reason : maybe Bezos will fund the #Resistance!]

2/16/2018 4:00:19 PM

I think you'll find throughout history that tyranny is held via local police and secret police entities, not militaries.

Gun rights in America absolutely provide a strong deterrent against this.

2/16/2018 4:08:22 PM