Trump attacked Hillary from the left on Trade and entitlements, too. This is exactly what he'll do to Biden, while also hammering him for his obvious cognitive decline. Biden is such an incredibly poor opponent to go up against Trumpism. It doesn't matter that Trump himself has a terrible record on all three of those issues, because he's not above being a hypocrite to rile up the crowd.

3/6/2020 11:19:53 AM

^ yep. He's the weakest against trump despite the pollings. His electoral map is the same as hillary's. Going to be a hard fight for rust belt white people.

3/6/2020 11:24:06 AM

Prob a waste of time for Earl but, re exit polls, flashback to 2016 for the same exact argument

https://www.nytimes.com/2016/06/28/upshot/exit-polls-and-why-the-primary-was-not-stolen-from-bernie-sanders.html

3/6/2020 12:44:55 PM

I wish we could ban exit polls, at least until after official results were released, same with most pre-election polling

3/6/2020 2:13:42 PM

Eh I mean they are interesting but also need to be taken with a grain of salt.

Just because some children need to be kept away from scissors doesn’t mean adults shouldn’t have access to them.

https://twitter.com/wajahatali/status/1235989299037974528?s=21

Savvy beyond her years, still. Some people won’t like this but she will be the standard bearer for progressive causes for a long time and she is a fantastic politician — far better than Sanders has ever been.

3/6/2020 2:24:25 PM

It makes sense that the more passionate voters would participate more in exit polls. That completely debunks the conspiracy theories floating around. I just think its funny how people run around touting exit poll data and then suddenly switch to "exit poll data is not reliable" the moment its not convenient. Which is it?

Also, I agree with everything you said about AOC, including that she is a better a better politician than Sanders (so far) . We don't know what she's going to be like 50 years from now and are basing this on a 2 year record.

But the link you posted about supporting Biden when a gun is to her head is not evidence to any of that nor is it contrast to Sanders. Its not really a decision because it is not negotiable. A democrat has to support the nominee. Bernie always supported and said he would support the nominee. He fully supported Hillary in 2016 and you're fueling a dishonest smear by continuing to insinuate otherwise.

3/6/2020 2:43:37 PM

Quote :

"just think its funny how people run around touting exit poll data and then suddenly switch to "exit poll data is not reliable" the moment its not convenient"

The latter. If people you listen to are using the former as predictive, you're listening to the wrong people

3/6/2020 2:46:48 PM

also, seeing the results and looking at exit polls to confirm what happened (lack of youth turnout, which I incorrectly stated and apologized for) is not remotely similar to looking at exit polls as a sign that the DNC swayed the vote towards Biden. good grief.

3/6/2020 2:57:30 PM

One is saying young voters proportionately participated in exit polls

The other is saying Biden voters proportionately participated in exit polls



The same thing is being repeated for whatever groups MSM pundits want to create narratives for.
What difference am I missing? How is some of the exit poll data valid and some of it invalid?

3/6/2020 3:05:39 PM

You right. All exit polls can't be trusted. Bernie is wrong to say that he has an issue with youth turnout. The media shouldn't report on the exit polls and clearly are only talking about it because they are part of the establishment.

3/6/2020 3:30:44 PM

Quote :

" Savvy beyond her years, still. Some people won’t like this but she will be the standard bearer for progressive causes for a long time and she is a fantastic politician — far better than Sanders has ever been."

most people are fine with this, she is also wildly popular

3/6/2020 3:37:30 PM

https://twitter.com/leslieleeiii/status/1236018265220165633?s=21

[Edited on March 6, 2020 at 4:02 PM. Reason : v love it]

3/6/2020 3:53:40 PM

Good to see Sanders getting tougher about this kind of thing
https://twitter.com/BernieSanders/status/1236027606811754496

3/6/2020 4:01:53 PM

As a POC, Nina was being intentionally misleading with her quote. Even in Nina's rebuttal she makes a fair point about what the context of the quote means but her application of the quote is still misleading.

I won't go as far to say that Nina didn't have a right to invoke the words. Everyone has the right to invoke the words of whomever they want to. But they also have the right to be called out if what they say is misleading.

3/6/2020 4:17:00 PM

Of course youre okay with this

[Edited on March 6, 2020 at 4:27 PM. Reason : She even said "angry black women" ffs]

3/6/2020 4:27:25 PM

That was the legit worst apology ever. I mean may as well just double down instead of that weak shit.

3/6/2020 4:36:14 PM

It really sucks that the debate is so far away. There should have been an extra debate for this 2nd tuesday. They increased the number of debates then ran dozens of candidates and we end up with even less one on one debates than 2016. The March15th debate will be too late for Biden's gaffes to matter so much and he will enter the general election mostly untested.

[Edited on March 6, 2020 at 11:06 PM. Reason : they should add the exclusively healthcare debate between now and tuesday]

3/6/2020 11:06:08 PM

I mean, why do you think his gaffes would matter? While he has absolutely deteriorated a lot with age as all do (though no where near as much as Trump... yet) he’s literally been making terrible gaffes since the 80s. He’s a terrible campaigner and always has been.

Do you think, even if he fails miserably on stage, X’ers and Boomers are going to all of a sudden see the light and vote Sanders? It’s pie in the sky nonsense that Clinton thought would happen if she pointed out how disgusting a human Trump was. It’s all baked in.

3/7/2020 6:09:52 AM

is "shylock" an anti-semitic term?

3/7/2020 11:28:50 AM

If you have to ask...

3/7/2020 12:37:04 PM

Quote :

"Do you think, even if he fails miserably on stage, X’ers and Boomers are going to all of a sudden see the light and vote Sanders? It’s pie in the sky nonsense that Clinton thought would happen if she pointed out how disgusting a human Trump was. It’s all baked in"

He has a base of like 10-20% locked in but a huge chunk of people who vote for him last minute are "low information voters" and they can be swayed by more exposure. In a country without real journalists, the debate is the only opportunity to do that.

I know that they are low information voters because if you put all the policies out side by side and removed the people, there is no way in . hell most democrats would choose Biden over Bernie. A lot of Biden's policy positions are exactly why democrats are so motivated to remove Trump.

3/7/2020 12:51:42 PM

They weren’t low information. They were late deciders, who were paralyzed by too much choice. They also were more moderate, which makes sense given how crowded that field was.

3/7/2020 3:41:21 PM

Quote :

"If you have to ask..."

https://twitter.com/jackallisonLOL/status/1235969690016444416

3/7/2020 4:17:39 PM

People have a tendency to overidentify as "moderate" because of the negative connotation associated with "extreme". I don't even identify as "extreme" even though I'm what most people in this country would describe as extreme.

Put it this way. Almost all of those voters view climate action, and universal healthcare as absolutely critical and simply don't know that Biden doesn't. Nor do they know about his history of being against things that even moderate republicans and Donald Trump now favor (social security, gay marriage, integration etc). Its definitely a lack of information because theres a very small percentage of primary voters who are actually calculating "Well Biden is really terrible but at least he's a marginally better than Trump so that is what this country needs right now".



[Edited on March 7, 2020 at 5:19 PM. Reason : no Trump is not to the point of mixing his wife with his daughter. he just genuinely wants to smash]

3/7/2020 5:16:05 PM

Quote :

" Reason : no Trump is not to the point of mixing his wife with his daughter. he just genuinely wants to smash]"

I have no idea what this is about but if you’re going to couch-diagnose Biden you have to be crazy to not see Trump is even worse off. Trump at his best was far more coherent a public speaker than Biden (despite trump being an imbecile) and now he is incoherent and has some weird neurological thing going on.

For what it’s worth I’m OK with couch-diagnosing Biden. It’s a real issue and it’s meaningful. That said, people like Glenn Greenwald who are doing it to Biden but literally were OUTRAGED when people couch-diagnosed Trump are despicable, hypocritical pieces of shit.

[Edited on March 8, 2020 at 12:35 PM. Reason : Bottom line: unless you raged at those who diagnosed Trump, diagnose Biden to your hearts content]

3/8/2020 12:34:49 PM

Bernie bro’s mad the dnc is letting the 76+ year old candidates sit down

3/8/2020 2:15:13 PM

They’re changing it to a town hall format so Biden doesn’t have to respond to Bernie. Solid candidate.

3/8/2020 2:29:26 PM

First of all Trump is an idiot so he gets exposed when he's talking about technical things and policy detail. I think he gets nervous during these kinds of talks and he's reading things that didn't come from him, that he probably doesn't even agree with or understand.

When you watch him attack people or go off the cuff like at rallies, he's clearly not suffering from any decline nearly as bad as Biden. He doesn't have a huge vocabulary and messes up words but thats different. He also lies a lot as he always has. If he was in Biden decline he wouldn't be witty enough to tell these low-risk lies all the time. He seems relatively fine compared to Biden.

Biden can't flow through a sentence no matter what its about. He thought he was running for senate and thought his sister was his wife. He couldn't even remember the "we hold these truths to be self evident...." quote. The DNC is rigging the debate to protect him from getting exposed and shame on all the democrats who see all of this rigging happening but bury their heads in the sand and pretend its not happening. Trump is the president they deserve.

[Edited on March 8, 2020 at 2:52 PM. Reason : k]

3/8/2020 2:51:46 PM

^We’ll see what happens. Believe me.

3/8/2020 2:57:04 PM

I can't disagree with any of that.

3/8/2020 2:57:20 PM

Quote :

"moron All American 32256 Posts user info edit post Bernie bro’s mad the dnc is letting the 76+ year old candidates sit down 3/8/2020 2:15:13 PM daaave All American 645 Posts user info edit post They’re changing it to a town hall format so Biden doesn’t have to respond to Bernie. Solid candidate. 3/8/2020 2:29:26 PM"

they also changed it to exclude tulsi

i'm clearly not a fan of tulsi and don't actually want her to participate, but if you make a rule originally that says you need at least 1 delegate to participate in the debate you should go by that rule.

3/8/2020 4:04:48 PM

well you say that but you aren't going to do anything about it and they knew that which is why they did it.

[Edited on March 8, 2020 at 4:19 PM. Reason : im sick of democrats signaling that they actually care about integrity]

3/8/2020 4:18:56 PM

you're right, sorry I forgot the DNC listens to me, I'll get this fixed for you in the morning

3/8/2020 4:26:25 PM

Quote :

" He doesn't have a huge vocabulary and messes up words but thats different. "

I know you didn’t know Donald Trump existed before 2015 but watch a video or something from before. It’s a marked difference.

Defending Trumps obvious cognitive decline, but from the left.

3/8/2020 5:29:10 PM

Fuck warren as a staff, political candidate and a motherfucking crew. She is a progressive only when it can advance her career. The moment it doesn't, she's out.

3/9/2020 10:16:50 AM

[Edited on March 9, 2020 at 10:55 AM. Reason : address]

3/9/2020 10:53:54 AM

Flyin Ryan
https://www.dataforprogress.org/blog/3/5/sexism-one-reason-why-warren-didnt-do-better

3/9/2020 11:48:11 AM

Maybe if everyone wasn't so anti-Semitic, Bernie would do better. The bar is so low for Christian candidates and then they all endorse each other. Blind ism accusations are fun, aren't they?

3/9/2020 12:17:21 PM

yeah there is definitely no anti-semitism in regards to sanders

unrelated, https://www.adl.org/blog/white-supremacist-unfurls-nazi-flag-at-arizona-sanders-rally

3/9/2020 12:27:06 PM

Theres a massive canyon between saying "there is no sexism/racism/bigotry" and saying this candidate "isn't winning because they are a [identify]".

3/9/2020 12:38:31 PM

Nobody [here] is saying that latter thing either you dunce

3/9/2020 12:44:41 PM

Warren not endorsing today would be a massive betrayal to progressives, gotta say. Worse than staying out in 2016. Pure opportunism.

3/9/2020 1:44:52 PM

I don’t really get it. I mean I’ve seen some people speculate she is being pragmatic and will want to better be able to move Biden left but it’s not like he’d not accept her GE endorsement if she endorsed Sanders in the primary.

The polling is absolutely dire for Sanders today and the effect of a Warren endorsement might already be too muted which only makes her not doing it three days ago look even worse.

[Edited on March 9, 2020 at 1:58 PM. Reason : Also, both Biden and Sanders should be going scorched earth on Trumps response but I’ve seen little?]

3/9/2020 1:55:38 PM

"Betrayal" is an interesting choice of words for a group that mostly never supported her and spent all winter calling her a snake and a rat. Wild.

I, as a previous supporter, do think it would be a betrayal of her stated principles and damaging to the progressive movement. Unfortunately, I think she is a bad politician at a national level and perhaps too trusting of some bad faith voices.


Also wild that it's being used to paper over Sanders' failures as a candidate. Agree with NYM, he should be on any tv show that will have him to blast Trump response to Corona. He should generally be blasting Trump more. Voters want someone that can beat Trump. Show them you can scare Trump. It's great to have the best policies but voters clearly aren't responding to that message.

[Edited on March 9, 2020 at 2:06 PM. Reason : E]

[Edited on March 9, 2020 at 2:07 PM. Reason : Bloomberg got to 15% polling with one policy: "I'll beat Trump" ]

3/9/2020 2:03:48 PM

Quote :

""Betrayal" is an interesting choice of words for a group that mostly never supported her and spent all winter calling her a snake and a rat. Wild. "

Weird how some people were offended by her compromising her stated ideals by diluting M4A language and then lying about Sanders and his campaign multiple times.

But ultimately, the vast majority of Sanders supporters would have been more than willing to campaign and vote for her because this is an incredibly important election and she's a vastly superior candidate compared to anyone in recent history.

And I specifically said "progressive movement" not "Sanders movement" because I'm also talking about all of the other people - AOC, Omar, Tlaib, Jayapal, Khanna, as well as the majority of Warren's supporters who are fighting for a better world.

3/9/2020 2:09:35 PM

You didn't say progressive movement, you said progressives. If that's what you meant, I'll concede the point.

As for the "willing to support", they may have been willing but they didn't. And as for whether Bernie himself would have dropped out and endorsed Warren, who knows.

[Edited on March 9, 2020 at 2:14 PM. Reason : E]

3/9/2020 2:14:10 PM

I think it's really interesting that Sanders supporters (at least the ones I've seen online) are spending all of their time attacking/blaming everyone who 'got in Bernie's way' instead of changing course and attempting what should have been an obvious pivot: attacking Trump and his failure to effectively lead the country.

Actually, it's not interesting. It's sad. Biden isn't a great candidate other than the fact that he appeals to people who were cool with the 8 years Obama was running the show. Bernie hasn't done much of anything to make far left policies appealing besides trying to sow division within the party.

3/9/2020 3:17:49 PM

Quote :

"changing course and attempting what should have been an obvious pivot: attacking Trump and his failure to effectively lead the country."

everyone who isn't voting trump already knows that he has failed to effectively lead the country. This idea that the key to the election is convincing trump voters to vote democrat is preposterous and illogical. Also, this is the primary so even if it were true, now is the time to talk about why each person is the right person to effectively lead the country.

Right now, forget Trump. We need to focus on why Biden will fail to effectively lead the country. Fuck people who were cool with the 8 years Obama was running the show. They obviously are toxic people with no empathy so we don't need to worry about them.

3/9/2020 4:06:29 PM

It's a good thing that few rational/sane people share your idiotic world view.

3/9/2020 4:15:44 PM

Quote :

"Also, this is the primary so even if it were true, now is the time to talk about why each person is the right person to effectively lead the country."

Except Bernie has been having that conversation and getting stomped. People are voting Biden bc of "electability" nonsense, Bernie needs to show why he's the one that can beatup on Trump. He's losing, he can keep doing what he's been doing, or try something else.

3/9/2020 4:20:01 PM