^^you do realize that there is more than one source for funding right? government, private industry, various organization grants, etc.

[Edited on July 17, 2015 at 5:38 PM. Reason : ]

7/17/2015 5:37:42 PM

That comic is pretty much my view of the issue. Either way we are building a more sustainable society even if the AGW fears are exaggerated.

Oh no's though the Koch brothers are losing $Billions

7/17/2015 5:48:47 PM

^^lol, yes.

My point still stands. How can we have a good faith science discussion when you don't accept the integrity of the grant bodies, or scientist, or the peer review system, or whatever.?

The worst part being that there has been no meaningful evidence produced to doubt any of those entities. You're just going off your gut, or what you read on Breitbart, or ......

7/17/2015 8:24:45 PM

no, i'm not denying the potential for human caused climate change or the scientific process at all. just pointing out there is more to the funding side of things in the real world.

7/17/2015 8:54:51 PM

Although I am hardly the arbiter of peace and comity vis-a-vis the Soap Box or environmental issues, I retain an implacable belief that an aggregate elevation of scientific literacy both nationally and globally will engender the more civil and enlightened discourse so desired by various interests on this board. Absent such exposure to legitimate and seasoned manuscripts, it can be arduous to discern the meaning of a particular study and/or its conclusions. The result is vacuous regurgitations from whatever news wordsmith best appealed to our preconceived notions.

tl;dr version: We need better scientific literacy in order to avoid this:

7/17/2015 9:27:09 PM

^being completely on one side of a debate does not mean you are not able to discuss it rationally... I rather enjoy reading things that people like you post because you more or less know what you are talking about, and if not are able to rationally discuss things without name-calling (at least from what I remember without going back and post-stalking you lol)
(and like i've said before... i don't disagree with anthropogenic climate change. i just don't think it's as black and white as some people/groups (on both "sides") proclaim. and I think that black/white barrier makes dialogue on the issue harder.)

7/19/2015 8:43:22 PM

Of course, the big problem that this comic ignores is that the cost of of some of these policies and regulations are disproportionally put on poor people. Higher energy costs are regressive. Never mind that depriving developing nations of cheap electricity (i.e. coal) is immoral. But it's okay, since most greenies' hearts are in the right place.

The road to hell is paved with good intentions. And some unintended consequences are worse than the original problems. Such as Europe's new obsession with palm oil. To meet their demand, down in Indonesia rainforest destruction has been accelerated to make room for expanding palm plantations. Or the power plants in Europe that now burn wood pellets for energy instead of coal.

[Edited on July 20, 2015 at 9:14 AM. Reason : emocon pun intended]

7/20/2015 9:10:11 AM

I agree. It's catching a falling knife imo.

7/20/2015 10:56:29 AM

Well put

also edit: my above posts makes it sound like I don't believe there are any benefits to furthering new energy resources. That's not the case.

[Edited on July 20, 2015 at 12:01 PM. Reason : k]

7/20/2015 12:00:41 PM

i hadn't read about the wood pellet thing, but wouldn't that have the potential to be renewable if the wood is harvested responsibly?

of course nuclear would be better. invest in next generation nuclear plants that are passively safe and there goes a huge problem with emissions.

[Edited on July 20, 2015 at 2:44 PM. Reason : ]

7/20/2015 2:37:11 PM

Quote :

"Never mind that depriving developing nations of cheap electricity (i.e. coal) is immoral."

It's immoral to keep the costs of coal low while not working to bring down the cost of green energy.

And it seems anyway that developing nations are choosing green energy on their own, for the long term benefits.

And I also question how much cheaper coal actually is, especially when you factor health and environmental effects.

7/20/2015 2:43:04 PM

^^Wood pellets are less energy dense than coal. It's a losing proposition that leads to more deforestation, and a step backwards.

7/21/2015 8:23:38 AM

http://www.ingentaconnect.com/content/igsoc/jog/pre-prints/content-ings_jog_15j017

Quote :

"Historically unprecedented global glacier decline in the early 21st century"

New meta-analysis that suggests glaciers, across the planet, are shrinking and at an accelerated rate. The rate has doubled since the 1950-2000 average rate of decline and quadrupled since early records from 1850-1900 average rates. It also suggests that even if CO2 rates are sharply reduced a good bit of this glacier decline is locked in.

to the max

8/6/2015 9:13:00 PM

Quote :

"i hadn't read about the wood pellet thing, but wouldn't that have the potential to be renewable if the wood is harvested responsibly?"

it's good when the pellets are from waste wood, that is what the benefit is calculated from, but the rise in use has created a lack of supply so instead of using waste products they are harvesting for the purpose of producing pellets to sell. that wasn't the intent

8/7/2015 8:44:31 AM

8/12/2015 12:55:26 AM

What's your point? Arctic ocean was largely ice free and passable in the late 1800s. Was AGW to blame then as well?

8/12/2015 8:57:40 AM

It was partially passable, but where are you reading that the sea ice was below or at levels seen today?

8/12/2015 9:59:22 AM

meanwhile, Antarctic sea ice is growing.

8/12/2015 10:34:51 AM

and where do you think that ice is coming from?

here's a hint: that ice isn't forming in the middle of the ocean.

8/12/2015 12:25:51 PM

the southern ocean is warming even faster than the global trend, the ice is growing because of various reasons that are all part of global climate change

[Edited on August 12, 2015 at 12:37 PM. Reason : .]

8/12/2015 12:36:01 PM

I highly recommend watching the Vice documentary on the Antarctic (Episode 1 Season 3)

before Shane Smith went down to the labs, he went to the deniers conference where every deniers talking point gets created and repeated

he then took those talking points to the scientists down in the Antarctic for them to explain why they're wrong

8/12/2015 1:10:22 PM

yeah right. those scientists are living the high life in Antarctica with all the money they're receiving for perpetuating the global warming myth.

8/12/2015 1:31:28 PM

Quote :

"the southern ocean is warming even faster than the global trend"

I said nothing about Antarctica getting colder. Among other things, the ice growth is coming from elevated moisture levels in the air due to warmer air; Antarctica has some of the driest locations on the entire planet. Regardless of why it's happening though, the result is a slap in the face to all the doomsday prophecies over rising sea levels from melting ice.

8/12/2015 4:11:34 PM

but sea levels are rising due to melted glacial ice

8/12/2015 4:34:02 PM

Recent paper on coastal melting processes along the totten glacier in Antarctica:

http://www.nature.com/ngeo/journal/v8/n4/full/ngeo2388.html

This is where I think much of our concern should be. Some of the processes hypothesize the possibility of some relatively rapid glacier collapse scenarios, very scary!

8/12/2015 5:07:21 PM

My cup overflowed when all the ice melted

8/12/2015 7:21:46 PM

Quote :

"but sea levels are rising due to melted glacial ice"

the <1ft rise in sea levels over the last 100 years does not correlate into the 6ft of sea rise being predicted over the next 100 years by NASA. The only way for that to happen is for significant amounts of ice to melt off of the land masses of Greenland and Antarctica, but that's not exactly happening.

8/13/2015 8:58:03 AM

but significant amounts of ice are melting off of the land masses of Greenland and Antarctica

8/13/2015 9:50:43 AM

Seriously?

Antarctica:
The antarctic peninsula has imploded the last 5 years (-56 gigatons per year):
http://www.sciencemag.org/content/348/6237/899

Western Antarctica glaciers melting at -80 to -100 gigatons per year, and showing signs of accelerating:
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/2014GL061940/pdf

East Antarctica, Totten Glacier, estimated at -17 to 28 gigatons per year. This side of the continent was long deemed relatively stable, but recent research suggests it has the same huge cavities between the ice shelf and ocean and that melting could accelerate:
http://www.ocean-sci.net/10/267/2014/os-10-267-2014.pdf
http://www.nature.com/ngeo/journal/v8/n4/pdf/ngeo2388.pdf

Greenland:
Northeast Greenland, probably one of the more stable areas, melting between -15 and -20 gigatons per year:
http://www.nature.com/nclimate/journal/v4/n4/full/nclimate2161.html

Total mass balance of Greenland, around -200 gigatons per year:
http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v504/n7478/full/nature12854.html

8/13/2015 10:23:22 AM

http://www.cnn.com/2015/08/20/us/noaa-global-climate-analysis/index.html

If you felt the heat this past July, you are hardly alone.

July saw the highest average temperatures since record-keeping began -- globally, not just the United States -- the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration reported Thursday.

Globally, the first seven months of the year also had all-time record highs. The latest global temperature data make it likely that 2015 will be the hottest year on record, the agency said.

The NOAA's findings follow reports by NASA and the Japan Meteorological Agency, which reached the same conclusion using their own data.

Thursday's report "is reaffirming what we already know," NOAA Climate Scientist Jake Crouch said. "The world is warming. It's continuing to warm."

8/20/2015 1:08:24 PM

Jake Crouch, quoted in that article, is an NCSU grad.

8/20/2015 2:48:54 PM

Quote :

"ly saw the highest average temperatures since record-keeping began -- globally, not just the United States -- the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration reported Thursday."

More lies from the Global Warming Liberal Conspirators that hate democracy and freedom and make $$$ off government grants that take bread and milk away from hard working Americans.

8/20/2015 4:14:41 PM

China's getting cap and trade. We truly are last in the world.

9/26/2015 8:51:56 PM

China has a slew of other environmental issues that need to be tackled, but this is a curious Capitalist move for the oft maligned Communist government.

In other yet associated news, the Right already has its collective heckles up over the EPA's move to reduce smog constituents. Who the fuck can still attempt to claim that smog is not something that needs serious abatement?

9/26/2015 10:00:35 PM

smog adds character to large cities. imagine LA without it... pretty much impossible.

9/30/2015 1:51:19 PM

http://www.indyweek.com/indyweek/greg-fishel-was-once-a-limbaugh-loving-climate-skeptic-now-hes-fighting-global-warming/Content?oid=4830678

<3 the Fish

10/21/2015 12:37:08 PM

When our great great grandchildren are killed by tidal waves, tornadoes, and an iceage, I'm sure their last thoughts will be to thank Greg Fishel for writing a blog "fighting" global warming.

10/21/2015 3:45:12 PM

^I think you have a typo there. Let me fix it for you: When our great great grand children are killed by hurricanes, tornadoes, and heat waves, I'm sure their last thoughts will be to curse the ignorant fuckers who ideologically ignored the problem.

(No need to thank me for the correction).

10/21/2015 4:42:59 PM

Thats still a bit sensationalist. More like: when our great great grand children are experiencing more hurricanes, tornadoes, and heat waves, I'm sure their last thoughts will be to curse the ignorant fuckers who ideologically ignored the problem.

Or you could say "when our grandkids are killed by a war caused by drought, and global economic crisis..."

10/21/2015 6:52:40 PM

I guess my only question not answered in that interview (and maybe its too personal): "Does this mean that Fishel will only vote/support candidates that want to tackle the climate change problem will acknowledge that climate change is occurring???

He says he is a former rush listener and is religious, so I'm guessing he believes abortion is the holocaust 2.0, hyperinflation is just around the corner (GOLDDD!!11!1!!1!), poor people just chill at home and watch cable all day, and BENGHAZIIIIIII!!11!1111!!!1!1

The overlap between the above and those that even ACKNOWLEDGE anthropogenic climate change is occurring is essentially zero.

What's a weatherman to do????

10/21/2015 8:46:55 PM

Because by America acknowledging the problem of global warming, we can switch to all solar/nuclear power.

Oh wait, China is still shitting into the air non-stop so it doesn't matter, lets fuck up our economy to feel slightly better about the Earth's demise.

10/21/2015 11:43:44 PM

http://qz.com/275577/china-is-driving-a-global-renewable-energy-rebound-but-it-might-not-last/



[Edited on October 21, 2015 at 11:51 PM. Reason : ]

10/21/2015 11:50:53 PM

I'm sure that spending will continue with such a weak economy.

Also: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_carbon_dioxide_emissions

10/21/2015 11:58:46 PM

Per capita:
United States 5,300,000 16.6
China 10,330,000 7.4

10/22/2015 10:30:11 AM

Exactly. Our per capita is high as balls and we still aren't close to China's CO2 emissions.

It's okay though, Greg Fishel wrote a blog post saying Fox News is stupid, let's plant a tree and pat ourselves on the back.

10/22/2015 11:35:50 AM

per capita is all that really matters. Of course 2 billion people are going to pollute more than 300million. Anyone who makes the total carbon emissions argument in comparison with china is obviously just making up excuses to continue to be irresponsible.

10/22/2015 1:22:50 PM

Quote :

"per capita is all that really matters"

Not to the Earth. Total emissions are all that matter.

Quote :

"Anyone who makes the total carbon emissions argument in comparison with china is obviously just making up excuses to continue to be irresponsible."

Nothing says responsibility like writing a feel good blog about global warming. Maybe he should have written it in Chinese instead.

10/22/2015 1:43:24 PM

http://phys.org/news/2015-10-mass-gains-antarctic-ice-sheet.html

oh hey look... everyone said that all that ice in Antarctica was melting...

global warming alarmists were

11/2/2015 9:02:56 PM

It's almost like a 100 year trend in a 4,600,000,000 year old system shouldn't be freaked out about. Odd.

[Edited on November 2, 2015 at 10:46 PM. Reason : btw, i'm a alarmist denier agnostic]

11/2/2015 10:46:02 PM

agnostics wouldn't bring the ignorance

11/2/2015 10:52:00 PM