^ My AMD mother board doesn't support SLI

I don't know if I am hitting the 1Gb buffer rate, how would I determine that? Also, the only PC games I will be playing for a while to come is Dark Souls and Borderlands 2, and Diablo 3. My 560 is more than enough to run all of them maxxed out, but I was thinking its better to upgrade while my 560 has a decent resell value.

8/17/2012 11:00:38 AM

I did some reading on the 660 and even if you are not hitting the memory limit on the 560 I would get the 660 ti. It is twice the performance of a 560 and being that your board wont SLI, its a no brainer. Its a hell of a deal when you factor in free borderlands 2 and when overclocked it almost a gtx670 at $70-$100 cheaper.

Oh yea GPU-Z will give you a graph of the memory usage when your playing.

8/17/2012 11:12:42 PM

The 660Ti is 192-bit and not 256-bit ... how much does it matter and what does it really means?

8/17/2012 11:33:42 PM

256bit is higher memory bandwidth and is for resolutions like 2560x1440. If you are only running 1920x1080 then the 192 will be fine. The impact of memory bandwidth on performance depends on the application. In games that use a lot of textures, more bandwidth = better. The other thing to note about 256 is it scales better with SLI. Which you dont need to worry about.

[Edited on August 18, 2012 at 12:39 AM. Reason : Oo]

8/18/2012 12:37:20 AM

is there a tech rant thread? if not someone should make one.

New parts - Asus motherboard M5A97
16Gb of GSkill RAM
1TB HDD from Western Digital


Reason for this because the old motherboard shit itself Monday night while I was at work. I hate replacing motherboards. I hate it hate it hate. Never has one just gone smooth. It's always some stupid driver issue, fan cords don't reach, older parts not compatible, and having to reinstall the OS and programs.

I finally told people just buy a new PC and it'll be cheaper. But when it's mine I didn't follow my own advice. Worse the image of my HDD wouldn't work because Win7 didn't like me using a new board. So I got a HDD and just did a clean install, reinstalled my programs and my old drive is now storage.


Bright side is if anyone wants older DDR2 RAM let me know. Both pairs are GSkill

4GB (2x2GB) 240 Pin - DDR2 800 (PC2 6400)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231122

2GB (1x1GB) 240 Pin - DDR2 800 (PC2 6400)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231098

8/18/2012 9:49:39 AM

doubledriver might be able to help you with drivers.. maybe. http://www.boozet.org/dd.htm

Quote :

"One of the main reasons why you would want to collect installed drivers is if you don’t have the Driver CD that came with the computer or they are unavailable online. This comes in quite handy if you purchase a computer and want to backup the initial set of drivers. It can be quite difficulty for example to find drivers for hardware installed in a notebook if the operating system has to be setup again. Luckily Double Driver can now lend you a hand with that and save you a lot of time. Double Driver is a very simple and useful tool which not only allows you to view all the drivers installed on your system but also allows you to backup, restore, save and print all chosen drivers. Double Driver analyzes your system and lists the most important driver details such as version, date, provider, etc. All drivers that are found can easily be backed up the application and easily restored at a later point in one go."

8/21/2012 9:18:48 AM

Windows already does all that for me.

8/21/2012 9:25:04 AM

660ti in route

8/23/2012 11:03:52 AM

I'm loving my 24gb of ram, OC to 2200 stable.

8/25/2012 12:22:36 AM

Is there any preferred brand of compressed air to dust my PC components?

8/25/2012 12:05:39 PM

If my motherboard doesn't support SLI, can I still use a second Nvidia GPU as a Phyx-only card?

8/31/2012 11:19:53 AM

Yes but I'd look into the benefits. It varies per game and depending on the different in performance between the 2 cards you might be better off keeping it off.

8/31/2012 11:28:57 AM

If that's the case, I could just install the card, and only activate it manually via the Nvidia control panel when I need to use it a particular game, and otherwise have it set up to only use a single card for Physx and graphics.

8/31/2012 11:37:10 AM

I tried that and if the card in the primary slot didn't do physx, it didn't matter. I had an 8400gs in an extra slot and my 6970 as my main card but it didn't work.

just picked up a couple ocz vertex 3's for $60. will put 1 in the laptop I take to the track since I need something durable and more battery life would be nice. might add the other one to my desktop to put my games on. currently my games are on a raptor and os on ssd - no complaint on current load times

8/31/2012 11:56:11 AM

haha yeah I still have a raid 0 with 2 old Raptor 10k HDDs. Great performance.

8/31/2012 11:57:22 AM

^^ Both of the cards to Physx. I have a 660ti and 560.


^ where did you get those hard rives from? Are they at least 128gb?

[Edited on August 31, 2012 at 12:06 PM. Reason : /]

8/31/2012 12:05:33 PM

Long time ago. Just from Newegg. I should probably replace them with a single drive. Haha.

8/31/2012 1:02:59 PM

What's a good product with good balance of price/quality for a SSD right now for 128 or 256 GB (or more)?

8/31/2012 1:09:25 PM

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/ssd-recommendation-benchmark,3269.html

Vertex series are usually pretty solid. Check out Tom's. They offer good options for price/performance for each price range.

8/31/2012 1:19:55 PM

I think what I am seeing is that not many games use Physx that are worth even using the extra power, even with a single card. I can tell no real noticeable difference in Metro with it, however in Mafia II that is quite a notice difference but, do I want to play Mafia II ... no. As, Long as I can get the eye-candy in Borderlands 2, which the 660ti should handle alone since it not a terribly graphically intense game, I am be satisfied.

9/1/2012 2:09:23 PM

Any reason to NOT switch up to a 2gb GTX660Ti from two 1gb GTX560Ti in SLI? I can't say that I feel like I've been blown away by SLI performance... I still get this feeling that there's more I could do to my machine to make it turn out better graphics performance. Maybe my expectations are not entirely grounded.

9/3/2012 6:16:01 PM

why? just a waste of money for a little bit of better gpu performance from a 560 to a 660 with just a little more ram. Very few games really require more ram than 1GB and honestly, with smarter game engines, you really don't even need 1GB if its programmed right and still have ultra HD resolution cached textures.

Even now, the only real need to have anything beyond 560ti right now is if you want ultra HD graphics, all things set on high and have a 1440/1600p display or multi-display setup. With very few games out that can stress even the last gen's of gpu's, just seems like a foolish short-term investment.

Knowing you, I'd say be happy with what you got and save up for the next gen's of gpu's in a year or two. Even the next gen game engines that will actually stress gpu's won't be out for months. Game engines now days are designed to be dynamic and run on a wider range of platforms than they ever have done in the past.

9/4/2012 12:56:28 AM

bf3 consumes tons of VRAM, the new source engine (for cs:go) uses a ton - I see 900-1100 @ 2560x1440, and the unreal engine isn't far behind. Using VRAM is the way to go. I would ditch a pair of 1gb cards for a single 2gb card in a second since you get less noise, lower temps, lower power use, and better performance since with sli you only get to index the lowest common memory space.

9/4/2012 9:12:00 AM

^Completely agree. I don't see how it's possible to still have a 1GB card. I have games regularly pass the 2GB mark as well (not only the game is running).

You also have to take into consideration what else is running on your computer and taking up VRAM. I notice a wide range of VRAM usage depending on how many other things I have open when a game is running. Currently I just have my work stuff up and I'm hitting close to 900MB.

Having more saves me from having to close everything else before opening up a game.

9/4/2012 9:17:41 AM

Not everyone needs to have ultra HD resolutions... You can play BF3 on high and barely hit 800MB at 1080p. And I'm not impressed with "the new source engine". Blah at best.

The thing that I found as being a realistic 'game changer' in game engine design has been with id tech 5 using Virtual Texturing; being able to have an ultra HD 20GB texture pack to be referenced and seamlessly load them into VRAM without any stuttering, lag or needless load times to be a remarkable software design even though the game RAGE sucked ass. Really does way with the idea that everyone needs gobs of VRAM to play a game. What we need are smarter game engines that can use VRAM more effectively instead of engines that just load a bunch of shit that doesn't do anything but take up space.


Sure, there are a few games who can use more than 1GB of VRAM, but then again the 560 wasn't a high end, bleeding edge gpu when Axelay got them back in October/November. I mean its just pointless for Axelay to ditch his 560's for one 660 for only having them for less than a year...

If Axelay was one of those people who threw money away all the time for a hobby as gaming, then I could understand in his decision in flipping gpu's every year like some friends I know, but again he was very indecisive to even spend the extra few bucks for the i7 over the i5 until I pretty much convinced him to after finding him the deal in the i7.

He's like many gamers, a smart shopper looking to maximize his abilities for dollars spent. If I was in his shoes, I'd just wait for the next gen stuff and go beyond 2GB of VRAM if I was going to invest in something down the line. VRAM size is important, but I'd say at least quadruple his ram buffer size before jumping.




^Seriously? Would you have CAD running in the background when playing a game? It should be obvious to have everything closed when you are playing a dedicated PC game, unless its something casual like GTA or WOW.

AND SERIOUSLY... play games on your own time, do your work on work time damnit...

[Edited on September 4, 2012 at 10:16 AM. Reason : ]

9/4/2012 10:14:15 AM

Not cad just chrome with a bunch of tabs, excel, power point, a VM maybe, sometimes a RD session. I'm too lazy too close everything I'm working on because I want to play a game after work. It's a pain opening everything back up.

I know first world problems but I like having a lot of VRAM. I never have to worry about what's running on my computer.

Sounds like you're just mad because you don't have any VRAM.

9/4/2012 10:59:17 AM

I upgraded from a 560 to a 660ti and I am happy about it, and I get the benefit of a better framerate with Physx included - essentially I bought this card to spice up Borderlands 2 with the Physx. Also, the 660ti should last quite a while in terms of beating/meeting recommended requirements for major over the next couple of years. If you have the $300, go ahead and buy it, sell your other cards, and you get $20 off right now with a Borderlands 2 game code.

9/4/2012 12:04:36 PM

Quote :

"Sounds like you're just mad because you don't have any VRAM."

No thanks, three 570's is more than enough power for me right now. I'm actually thinking about building some water blocks for myself since they run way too hot on air with all three stacked on each other. Plus I really need to invest in a bigger PSU. Can't OC worth shit with my setup, but honestly I just want to make it more silent than 3 screaming blowers.

I'm putting the water block design in a CAD and can have my friend make it with a cnc milling machine but the material cost would be more expensive than to just buy off the shelf water blocks that would actually work with standard plumbing parts... then again that's $900 worth of parts to do it right.

9/4/2012 12:49:10 PM

If you only have 1GB of onboard memory on those 570's then you're way under utilizing them. Previously I had 2 460's and they were great but I kept hitting the vram wall in most games. You could have 4 680's and they'd still suck if you only had 1GB of vram. I easily go over a gig of vram in BF3 at 1080p.

Or you could just sell the 3 570's and get 2 2GB 660 tis. Much more powerful.

[Edited on September 4, 2012 at 1:05 PM. Reason : although they probably have 1280. Still quite low. ]

[Edited on September 4, 2012 at 1:11 PM. Reason : if you're content though it doesn't matter. ]

9/4/2012 1:05:09 PM

Why would I bother selling three 570's for just two 660's? I loose a lot of money to do this trade for no real trade off... I'm still capped at playing on a 1200p screen at 60fps so it makes no difference for me to upgrade for a few years.

9/4/2012 1:16:39 PM

Well, from a money perspective, I believe $300 for a 2gb 660Ti potentially comes down to less than $100 since I could resell both of my 560Tis. I did manage to keep all of the original packaging, and some used 1gb Twin Frozrs are going on eBay for just slightly above $100. I feel like I ought to go for this.

9/5/2012 8:19:00 AM

Honestly... I'd say keep your 560ti's for a while.

You forget that you got your 560's for 220 a piece so you'd be out about $200 in value then another $100 to get a 660Ti so this upgrade is going to cost you about $300 in total value even though it would only cost you about $100 in "upgrading" once you offload the 560's on ebay; a little more since you need to account for ebay fee's and shipping.

While the 660 ti is a much much faster gpu (about 30-40% faster in most games) than a single 560 ti, against two? that would be a no. You will be downgrading in throughput just to satisfy your urge to go from 1GB to 2GB buffer which really isn't a huge improvement. Again, only a few select instances and games actually benefit from the jump.

Save your money and get an SSD if you don't already have one by now. Vertex 3 120gb is on sale for $60AR and the Vertex 4 was around $80 like a week before, not to mention tons of other SSD deals popping up every day like the HyperX and Samsung 830 series.

9/5/2012 8:54:37 AM

Would this CPU

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103960&nm_mc=EMC-IGNEFL091112&cm_mmc=EMC-IGNEFL091112-_-EMC-091112-Index-_-ProcessorsDesktops-_-19103960-L0C

be bottlenecked (if I used that term right) or otherwise have its performance inhibited by this mother board?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131733

I see that the chipsets are different but I honestly cannot fully understand the numbers and what they actually mean. Here is a reference

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_AMD_Chipsets#A-Link_Express

9/11/2012 1:06:35 PM

No, the CPU would not be bottle necked by the chipset. Since the memory controller, cpu cache and such have all been put onto cpu instead of the mobo, performance hindrance of the mobo is a thing of the past (for the most part).

Higher end chipsets will have features that are lacking of the entry level low end chipsets, such as onboard RAID support, eSATA, usb 3.0, firewire, or whatever have you, so it really depends on what features you really want/need in your computer and what you are willing to pay for it. You could put that cpu in a entry level chipset mobo or a high leve chipset mobo and both will relatively perform exactly the same.


And to not rant too much, but the only reason one would look at getting AMD, specially FX, is if you got them at a good price and didn't want to pay the premium for a better Intel chip. While I like AMD and see the value of what they offer, FX just never really took off and even their own company said to wait for Windows 8 before we'll see noticeable performance increase.

I'm not to sure if the 8150 has the same heat issues as the 8120, but the second you OC them, they use mad amounts of power. Its definitely has a good thermal design, but its shocking how little gain you net for how much power it will suck from the wall... if OC is your thing.

[Edited on September 11, 2012 at 9:57 PM. Reason : ]

9/11/2012 9:56:22 PM

Intel just costs to much for me. AMD does me just fine. Thx for the info tho.

9/11/2012 10:15:45 PM

go for the the asus 97 instead of the 88, just make sure to disable the auto-oc. i have the same cpu and mobo (the 97) and after driver updates and oc disabling it's be rock solid. the only thing that slows my box down is flash

9/12/2012 12:48:38 AM

I'm gonna build my first computer for gaming and heavy web browsing, I've come up with a list of parts from Newegg, but I'd like to keep my budget closer to $1,500. So what should I adjust from the list below to get closer to my budget?

Case: COOLER MASTER HAF X RC-942-KKN1 Black Steel/ Plastic ATX Full Tower Computer Case - $186.49

Power Supply: CORSAIR HX Series HX850 850W Power Supply - $169.99

CPU: Intel Core i7-3770K 3.5GHz (3.9GHz Turbo) LGA 1155 Quad-Core Desktop Processor - $329.99

Motherboard: ASUS SABERTOOTH Z77 ATX Intel Motherboard - $239.99

Graphics card: EVGA GeForce GTX 670 FTW 02G-P4-2678-KR Video Card - $407.99

Memory: CORSAIR Vengeance 16GB (2 x 8GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory - $85.99

Primary Drive: Crucial M4 CT128M4SSD2 2.5" MLC Internal Solid State Drive (SSD) - $109.99

Secondary Drive: Western Digital Caviar Black 1TB 3.5" SATA 6.0Gb/s Internal Hard Drive -Bare Drive - $109.99

DVD Burner: ASUS 24X DVD Burner - Bulk Black SATA Model DRW-24B1ST/BLK/B/AS - $19.99

CPU Cooler: CORSAIR CWCH60 Hydro Series H60 High Performance Liquid CPU Cooler - $64.99

Total: $1,735.39

9/16/2012 8:51:23 PM

decent parts but you picked almost the worst possible example for every single one in terms of price

9/16/2012 8:56:34 PM

That power supply, motherboard, and processor costs way too much. I would got 8150FX processor, any FX compatible motherboard for $120-$140, and get a 750w PSU from Antech. And, if you really want to save a few more dollars, just get 8GB of GSkill Sniper RAM. And, you can skip the watercooling as well. The fans will work just fine.

[Edited on September 16, 2012 at 9:05 PM. Reason : /]

9/16/2012 9:02:57 PM

^ thanks for the feedback. I have been using AMD for awhile, but was thinking it may be time to switch to Intel since they have a performance edge. However, it would be nice to save $140 by going with AMD.

9/16/2012 9:48:47 PM

i think you should stick with intel. its worth the price over amd imo. also, i just built a new system recently (almost just like yours, but i didnt get the K version 3770, and maxed the ram out at 32GB), as well, and got a 128 SSD, but i wish i got at least a 256GB one. I think OCZ (vertex 4) has the best/fastest ssd out there right now [http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820227792 256GB $200].

i love that motherboard btw. is that hard drive 7200 RPM? here's a 3 TB drive for $149
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822148844

looks like a beast machine, very nice. funny, i was thinking about getting that exact case too

9/19/2012 7:58:33 AM

The difference (that is really very minor is practice use) is not worth an extra $140.

9/19/2012 8:30:47 AM

maybe.

if he were to go the amd route, i think the phenom ii 6-cores outperform the FX 8cores...

9/19/2012 10:00:41 AM

^stock vs. stock, they do, but the FX chips can be OC way more with the expense of soaking up 3x more wattage. If you like a heater than you go with AMD.

And I'm gonna have to agree with smoothcrim... All great parts, but worst possible combination for the price/performance ratio for your budget.



@mnfares: This is what I would do for $1500 right now just for parts.

PCPartPicker part list: http://pcpartpicker.com/p/hWmD
Price breakdown by merchant: http://pcpartpicker.com/p/hWmD/by_merchant/
Benchmarks: http://pcpartpicker.com/p/hWmD/benchmarks/

CPU: Intel Core i5-3570K 3.4GHz Quad-Core Processor ($214.99 @ Newegg)
CPU Cooler: Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO 82.9 CFM Sleeve Bearing CPU Cooler ($27.98 @ NCIX US)
Motherboard: ASRock Z77 Extreme4 ATX LGA1155 Motherboard ($134.99 @ Amazon)
Memory: G.Skill Sniper Gaming Series 16GB (2 x 8GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($69.99 @ Newegg)
Storage: Seagate Barracuda 3TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($139.98 @ NCIX US)
Storage: Kingston HyperX 3K 240GB 2.5" Solid State Disk ($159.99 @ Newegg)
Video Card: EVGA GeForce GTX 670 2GB Video Card ($399.98 @ NCIX US)
Case: NZXT Switch 810 (White) ATX Full Tower Case ($154.99 @ Amazon)
Power Supply: PC Power & Cooling Silencer Mk II 750W 80 PLUS Silver Certified ATX12V / EPS12V Power Supply ($89.99 @ Newegg)
Optical Drive: Asus BW-12B1ST/BLK/G/AS Blu-Ray/DVD/CD Writer ($59.99 @ NCIX US)

Total: $1452.87
(Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available.)
(Generated by PCPartPicker 2012-09-19 14:46 EDT-0400)

I'd go with the cheaper i5 quad core cpu to save a $100 and put it else where into the computer. Very few games right now can actually use all four cores, let alone two at 100%. Games have shifted back towards being GPU depended than CPU, until you start adding multiple GPU's and start hitting bottleneck traffic from the CPU. For now and the foreseeable future, a strong quad core for gaming is all you need. Any desktop CPU made in the last 3 years would still be considered overkill for "heavy web browsing"; for that feature you want more RAM than CPU power anyhow.

I cut the H60 cpu water cooler because... well you don't need it and you really don't net the value for the price you pay. Its an entry level, all-in-one water block system that's nice, but you'd be surprised that a cheap CM 212 air cooler will perform as good or as close to the H60 for 1/2 or 1/3 the cost. I say if anyone is serious about water cooling for OC, then do it properly and get a real kit or use high quality parts to do it right. If anything, I'd rather water cool the GPU first over the CPU just to reduce noise and increase cooling capacity of the GPU; you are talking about 77w cpu vs. 170+ of the gpu with a blower...

As for mobo, ASRock z77 is a budget minded board that doesn't skimp out on features or quality. Asrock is Asus and pretty much most of the components are the same; shit they built in the same factories. If you want a longer warranty period, then pick the Asus branded version of the same board for a few bucks more. Honestly, there's like 100 boards to choose from a wide variety of makers with the same features and in the same price point so do your homework. Just don't need to spend $250 on a high end mobo for the few features that you will NEVER use... Pay half and get what you need, not want.

Newegg as the G.skill 1600 speed, 16GB cas 9, 1.5v modules on sale this week for $70. Its actually a better product than the more expensive corsair that you picked since the only corsair I see with your features for $85 is cas 11. Don't need to over think too much on RAM, nor do you need anything beyond simple, standard 1600 speed modules. 16GB will last you for a while.

The M4 SSD is a good, reliable product, but the price is beyond everyone in the business and its value isn't there. There's SSD deals every day on Slickdeals.net, so keep a keen on eye on prices as they've been dropping like flies in the last month; hitting $.50/GB in a lot of cases. I picked the HyperX 240gb since its a great product that's fast using good quality NAND chips, but you pay a bit more for a higher capacity SSD instead of getting two 120gb drives then RAID 0 them.

Another option is to go even cheaper and grab OCZ agility or vertex series SSD's since their 120/128 and 240/256 models (series 3 and 4) have been hitting $60 for 120gb all month long. Grab two 120's, raid 0, and they'll be faster than any single SSD on the market right now for the cost... but they do have the highest failure rate in the industry so its up to you if you want to take the risk for a cheaper product. I do have to say that my OCZ SSD's haven't failed (yet) and most of my gaming friends have had similar good luck for the price. Just backup if you are worried.

I also added a cheap 3TB 7200 drive to the mix for storage so there shouldn't be any excuse for not backing up...

I also selected the same EVGA gtx 670 video card to your list so you shouldn't have any worries in gpu power, plus its way more efficient than my 570's so power, heat and noise are all reduced.

With a more efficient CPU/GPU combo, this combo will maybe use 350-370w of power so no need in spending bank on a 850w PSU, even a 750w is over kill if you don't plan on adding a 2nd gpu in the near future, but that's what I picked. I picked the PC Power and Cooling 750 mkii 80+ silver since its way cheaper and a great product; more than enough to power two 670's and still have room for over clocking. Like motherboards, there are tons of brands and products out there to choose from that no one pick will be the one to choose. Do you research and pick the best value that you can find; prices will change week to week so keep an eye again on deal websites to save a few bones.

Lastly, the case I picked is the NZXT switch 810 as its the major contender against the CM HAF X full tower case. I like the NZXT case because its just as big, with a lot of good features and way way way more water cooling compliant if you do choose to go that route. It can house a 4 fan 420mm radiator on top as well as an additional 240mm radiator in the front. I also think it looks pretty sleek and nice for the price, but you can easily cheap out and go with more normal mid-tower cases from name brands in the $50-100 price range that will work just as good for your budget with feature that you will actually use and need, not just want.

And just for kicks... Blu-ray burner... why not? they cheaper these days. Saved you moneyz so you can go out and fuck bitches... or play tons of video games and actually afford said video games...

9/19/2012 3:20:47 PM

Someone doesn't have a full time job.

9/19/2012 3:29:46 PM

I'm completely bored in Atlanta right now. Waiting for my shoot tomorrow, friday and sunday.

9/19/2012 3:35:32 PM

I still say you did not need more than 8GB of RAM, and go AMD. You don't need any extra cooling, stock cooling will do. And you probably don't need a Blu-Ray disc drive either.

[Edited on September 19, 2012 at 5:20 PM. Reason : /]

9/19/2012 5:19:48 PM

8GB is sufficient, but since 16GB(2x8) kits are crazy cheap right now, best to get them before DDR3 prices go back up. They already are showing demand for DDR3 is going down over the last year so it will only be a matter of time till supply gets back to demand levels and normalize; plus whenever DDR4 matches the switch to system memory, but I doubt that will happen anytime soon. Mobo makers don't want to support it because there's no cpu's to support and vise versa with Intel and AMD; don't want to make batches of cpu's with the DDR4 support if there's no supporting hardware.

Stock cooling will be fine, but those CM 212's are cheap and actually quieter than Intel or AMD stock heatsinks. For 20-30 extra, its nice to have such cooling capacity and a quieter rig. Shit, if you look around, you could get CM 212 plus for 10-15 AR.

AMD is fine, but if you got a budget of 200+ for a cpu, Intel blows AMD out of the water in value, performance and tech.

As for Blu-Ray, up to each person, but most people I know already have like 10 DVD burners sitting around. For $60, its not a bad price to jump into a bluray burner so you can watch some bluray's on your rig and have 25+ GB of disc backup. Shit its cheaper to buy the burner than to get a simple bluray reader drive right now.

9/19/2012 8:07:34 PM

wow! Thanks seedless, JBaz and stevedude for the feedback.

I think I am leaning towards the parts JBaz is recommending, although, there are a couple of parts I am wondering about.

1st, I was thinking of still getting the Intel Core i7-3770K for "future-proofing" (I know that sounds like a buzzword...).

2nd, after doing some more research, I came across the Silverstone Raven R03 case which has the motherboard setup 90 degrees for "ideal cooling". I've read this case can be a hassle for putting parts into, but I was wondering what you guys thought of the claim that it has better airflow.

One thing that I had put too much emphasis on when I picked those original parts was customer reviews on Newegg. Although, it now looks like the original parts are overpriced and I can see the points that JBaz hit on make sense.

Also, I currently have a Radeon HD 6850 1GB 256-bit card in my current PC. Do you guys think I should put that in the new build or get the GTX 670?

[Edited on September 19, 2012 at 8:27 PM. Reason : 1 more thing...]

9/19/2012 8:18:59 PM

1. "Future proofing" is hard to do, but you have to realize the major difference between the i5 3570k and the i7 3770k is Hyper Threading, which allows 8 threads instead of 4. But the additional 4 threads is really just adding efficiency to the 4 cores you already have in the i5. Realistically, you add 15-30% of additional performance gain in select programs that can use HT, which really only mean math crunching math or computation programs like content creation software (think Photoshop, CAD and such). Gaming doesn't really benefit from HT. Up to you if you think an extra $100 or so is worth it.

2. There's tons of cases out there, look at which one you like the looks at. Silverstone make awesome cases, but they hold a premium for their products. The Raven R03 is a nice case, but don't buy into the "ideal cooling" bit; that's marketing (aka BS).

The only two reasons anyone goes for the orientation is easier access to I/O at the top of the case (a god send for lan parties or you keep your case on the ground; aka bad back) and the reduced stress on pcie slots if you use heavy GPU's. They aren't that much different to work with or install, the only down side is that if you get a large full size case, you may need to buy additional sata cables to reach in some HDD slots (depending on mobo orientation). Oh and you might have issues if you use heavy duty, shielded dvi cables that don't flex very well, but the back panels should be recessed in fine to not be a problem.

My biggest complaint with the Raven is that you severely limit yourself if you try to do water cooling. You can't even install a 2x120 or 140mm radiator anywhere in the rig; I just don't understand why they didn't allow a 2nd fan slot on the back panel and the bottom fan slots aren't aligned correctly to do this either. Just silly to spend

3. Don't depend on Newegg reviews. Do your research from reputable review websites like anandtech, techpowerup, guru3d and tons more.

4. 6850 is still a great entry level value card that should still last a while, but a gtx 670 will be miles ahead of the 6850. If you got a budget for a high end card like the 670, why not get it?

[Edited on September 20, 2012 at 1:34 AM. Reason : ]

9/20/2012 1:33:07 AM