OK MORE TRANSMISSION PROBLEMS

I got a call to move 3 trucks from Apex to the dirty D and hooked up the trailer this morning. Left the neighborhood, 1st, 2nd, 3rd holy shit it feels like the driveshaft just fell out. Pull over on the shoulder and even sitting still in neutral its still making a hell of a noise, put the clutch in and it goes away, clutch out its back (even in neutral). Limp it back to the house and here it sits.

I am not sure if the part of the clutch came apart and is being slung around in the bellhousing or if some other retainer in the transmission came apart or if something else in the trans just plain broke but something is majorly fucked up this time.

After what happened before, and the way that this happened, I have to say its most likely another issue related to a poor rebuild on this transmission. Trouble is, since it was installed sometime prior to my ownership, there is zero warranty. Leaving me with two options that I can see, re-rebuild it or get another one. So far from what I am seeing- replacing it is going to cost at least $1300.

12/8/2009 10:43:25 AM

The fact that the clutch stops the noise is interesting. Noise is too loud to be a release bearing. Idling and inspecting from underneath noise is loudest at bellhousing area. I doubt its splines stripping off an input shaft or anything as I was able to drive it roughly a mile without it getting any worse. Noise is moderate at idle, a little more pronounced in 1st, even more so in 2nd, 3rd literally feels like something is coming apart. I havent even tried to drive it in 3rd it felt so bad.

Maybe flywheel or pressure plate? Seems like that would make noise with clutch out, in neutral, but with clutch in the release bearing takes the load. The flywheel/PP would be under progressively more load with each upshift, and that seems to fit my symptoms.

12/8/2009 11:16:37 AM

And so would the clutch disc. You think you might have cracked the hub or lost the marcel springs in the hub?

I have had a disc come apart like that after only 10k miles or less on a new clutch. Of course, there were many burnouts...

Keep in mind, too, that with the higher gears, there is an increasing amount of torque load on the disc.

Of course, the input shaft bearing could be shot to hell...or maybe the front countershaft bearing. Third gear is the second to the front of the tranny, and there could be that much more load on the bearing when in that gear.

12/8/2009 11:44:29 AM

I am feeling more and more like it is flywheel/clutch/pressure plate related. I can get new clutch and flywheel local from AAP for about $500, but I need to be sure first...

next up

Can optmusprimer remove this heavy motherfucker with a worn out floor jack and a bad back?

12/8/2009 11:54:44 AM

I guarantee that you can remove it with a bad back and pos tools.
Keeping it from smashing on the concrete on the other hand...

12/8/2009 12:30:48 PM

Joel...you need to let a brotha hook you up for cheap.

12/8/2009 1:41:07 PM

^^lol

how much does one of those weight anyways?

12/8/2009 2:36:09 PM

And its out!

Id say it weighs upwards of 150lbs.

12/8/2009 3:28:23 PM

left the clutch on the flywheel for now as the when I spin the input shaft on the trans by hand it is much tougher than it should be and will even bind up- looks like the culprit may be in there. I think I am going to have a local transmission shop tear it down and see whats going on.

[Edited on December 8, 2009 at 3:33 PM. Reason : or maybe Dan]

12/8/2009 3:32:47 PM

47rh-it

12/8/2009 4:44:55 PM

fuck that

12/9/2009 2:21:02 PM

Broke two teeth off the 3rd countershaft gear, lots of associated damage ensued.

Looking for another transmission now.

12/11/2009 1:56:29 PM

Wow. I didn't realize that 3rd was THAT bad sounding. I, too, have broken teeth off a countershaft gear. The racket that ensues is heinous. You didn't say the truck was bucking too.

12/11/2009 2:16:13 PM

It never bucked.

Guess that means no more rain drifting and 2-3 powershifts

12/11/2009 2:20:42 PM

lol

12/11/2009 2:42:17 PM

they usually buck or hitch at least a little bit when you break teeth like that.

And they REALLY do it when you rake the teeth off a ring gear, lol...

12/11/2009 2:58:17 PM

Yeah this felt a lot like when I broke the teeth off the ring gear in the little white cutlass. When I broke the ring gear in the yellow truck though it just ratcheted.

12/12/2009 8:06:02 PM

jesus how many have you broke

12/12/2009 9:06:14 PM

Sounds like the man is hell on a transmission.

12/13/2009 1:18:21 AM

Dodge trucks kinda suck. It's a piece of shit built around a good engine.

12/13/2009 1:33:56 AM

pretty much.

12/13/2009 3:27:08 AM

Quote :

"jesus how many have you broke "

Oh, I have not had that much trouble over the years, I am sure the rest of you have broken plenty of stuff as well right?
I have smoked 3 Olds Rocket engines, two 455ci (the second took one week, half as long as the first) and one 350, broke a planetary gear in (one of) my 88 Camry automatic transmissions, I tore the center out of a 4cyl S-10 clutch once, also blew two engines in that truck by dropping exhaust valves, twisted the HD axles in my last Discovery, broke the 7.5 ring gear in the 79 Cutlass (missing and skipping like crazy I might add) at the track, broke the ring gear in the diesel Discovery at Uwharrie, then the Dodgems transmission trouble. Probably about average carnage for someone who likes to push the limits a little bit.

BTW I have also never worn out a set of brake pads (start to finish) myself and have never had to change a flat on the side of the road.

12/13/2009 12:07:17 PM

Quote :

"Dodge trucks kinda suck. It's a piece of shit built around a good engine."

As a long time Chevy truck fan I admit the Dodge was not my first choice but I have been really surprised. Mine is in pretty good shape from what I have seen. Compared to the build quality of say, a Stratus or a Neon it seems pretty tight. For a 98 model I would say it was definitely the top pick over the diesel Chevy and the outside and in it looks better than the 98 Fords. I have a few little problems here and there but its not like Chevy truck door hinges, handles, or latches are worth a shit either. My transmission problems are 100% related to a shitty remanufacture job. I mean, its an NV4500- pretty strong transmission all things considered- not like a T5 or Getrag.

That reminds me, I actually tracked down the previous owners of the truck (thanks Google, White Pages, and Myspace) but even if I contact them and get this transmission warrantied I will just end up with another one of the same quality. I heard New Venture is not making parts for these anymore, I wonder if all the remanufacturers are using new gears made in China...

12/13/2009 12:20:30 PM

One of my 3 advance auto BRUTE FORCE non greasable joints was a defect straight out of the box. I dont have a lot of confidence in these damn things but I am gonna try them anyhow. The seals do look really good.
The anchor brand center support bearing from advance was wrong, the alternate was wrong, so I had to go to the dealer. I am not wasting time with carquest or vato zone. The correct (on the 1ST try, WOW!) center bearing from dodge was $145. Install was surprisingly simple with a new tool I made from part of the old bearing and a sawed-off Discovery rear driveshaft. :busted:

I am checking the new trans over now, and I decided I am going to go ahead and reseal it myself before even testing to see if its gonna leak. Since it looks like I might be spending $100+ on the correct fluid I don't even wanna risk it.

I think I forgot to mention before, the loose shifter feeling I complained of was apparantly caused by only one of the 4 shifter mounting bolts actually being tight. Two were finger tight, and the remaining one was backed out. Bolted the shifter up to the new trans and it feels really nice even with no fluid in it. I am going to pirate the reverse switch from the old trans and get some details on the new one here in a few...

12/19/2009 7:12:05 PM

OK after doing a little more research I am pretty convinced the reman that was in the truck when I bought it did not get the correct spec fluid in it from day one and that is what killed it. Even if I had switched to that fluid when I fixed 5th gear the damage was probably already done to the kevlar synchros. From the test drive until it broke the truck would almost always grind 2nd gear when cold, I thought it was air in the clutch master/slave but I am willing to bet now there was a problem with the synchros there, and from the looks of it probably with 3rd synchros as well. The day it broke I had an extra 2K behind the truck, the trans was cold, and when I shifted into 3rd it just gave me the big 'fuck you'.

Turns out all I would have had to do the day it broke to see the carnage was remove the PTO covers with the transmission still in the truck.







This reman transmission was advertised as having all the updates, from what I can see it has a full threaded mainshaft, grooved for thrust washer, locking nut, etc etc etc just like the broken transmission PLUS this one has been welded together. I think it should hold up pretty well, but I'm really careful not to be in 5th gear below 1500-1600 rpm anyway.




I just need to reassemble everything and get my hands on some correct fluid and I should be all set.

12/19/2009 8:10:26 PM

On the road again! Since yesterday around lunchtime. No problems at all except a intermittent reverse lamp switch.

12/22/2009 8:53:44 PM

Damn, what a headache...Nice work.

12/25/2009 2:15:00 PM

I have been driving pretty much trouble free since the install, first real test is tomorrow when I finally tow the loaded car hauler to Morrisville, then Durham, then home (probably just in time for rush hour).

I could really use a good source for Castrol Syntorque fliud though if any of you know of one. I am running Royal Purple at the moment but would like to try something else.

12/28/2009 11:03:01 PM

i just skimmed all this, but did you say who did the reman? i had some issues with my first nv4500 from man trans. they swapped it out with another one at no charge, though.

huge DING DING on the proper fluid being critical for the nv4500. syntorq or nothing, imo. i always sourced mine from any of the local gm dealers fairly cheap. it's been a few years since i've needed any for obvious reasons, though.

oh, and i do not envy the removal/install of this beast AT ALL, lol. i did the original swap on mine in an apartment complex parking lot with a basic socket set, a tow strap, and some ratchet straps.

[Edited on January 2, 2010 at 7:57 PM. Reason : do not envy]

1/2/2010 7:55:22 PM

Yeah I damn near broke my arm trying to put it back in, ended up buying a transmission adapter thing to go on the floorjack. The original reman unit looks to have come out of some outfit in Indiana who is selling theirs on eBay for 1100- the one I got came from Smart Part out of Dallas at $995 but looks to be a better rebuild. Why they dont charge $100 more and include the fucking fluid is beyond me. I used dat 190% ROyal Purple and it seemed OK at first but does not like the cold much, I need to round up some cash and find some of the right Amsoil or the real deal Castrol ASAP. I hate to pay the dealer $28/quart but I might have toooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

1/2/2010 8:34:09 PM

yeah, suck it up and get the right shit. those things simply do not tolerate any alternative synthetic, no matter how good. i can't remember specifically what's special about syntorq, but there is something...

1/2/2010 9:15:48 PM

Its got low enough sulphur content not to eat the kevlar off the synchros. The amsoil is supposed to be good enough but none of the amsoil dealers will man up and stand behind that going into a new trans, so fuck em.

1/2/2010 10:42:59 PM

Finally got my new (used) rear tires installed yesterday, sure is nice. Xmas day on 440 actually hydroplaned on a river of water going across the highway. Nothing quite like 7500lbs sliding sideways across 3 lanes at 65mph all on its own.

1/6/2010 10:50:26 AM

Oh and by the way, when I was hauling a truck to durham last week, I was pleased to find out that even with the extra weight behind the Dodge and no trailer brakes, the truck brakes felt really no different at all. Of course if I was driving in stop and go traffic for hours on end, or coming down a mountain, it would be a different story I'm sure.

1/6/2010 10:56:50 AM

Truck and my trailer, empty, weigh in at 9650 lbs

1/7/2010 9:04:13 PM

Damn, IIRC, the scrapyard weighed me, my dodge, a friend, and my 16 foot trailer at ~7600.... Im surprised there is 2000 lb. of difference between trucks...

[Edited on January 7, 2010 at 9:55 PM. Reason : tried finding the weight ticket but couldnt. know for sure it was less than 8k lb.]

1/7/2010 9:54:20 PM

You've seen my trailer, right?

1/7/2010 10:59:39 PM

your shorty or the football field that parks in your yard?

1/7/2010 11:00:57 PM

My 18ft. Its pretty heavy for its size, the hydro pump/battery/etc play a factor.

1/7/2010 11:05:28 PM

yeah... makes sense
extended cab+dually+trailer with 2 more feet, plus more trailer features could add up to 2k pretty damn fast.

1/7/2010 11:19:07 PM

Scrapped another truck shell today, dodgems + trailer = 9,240 lbs

(other day was actually 9,260lbs)

1/8/2010 9:52:35 PM

I think I am gonna try some Amsoil in the transmission, not sure I like the Royal Purple

2/5/2010 7:27:51 PM

why don't you listen to bbr and put some fucking syntorq in there and quit bullshittin'?

2/6/2010 4:41:08 PM

I cant get Syntorq, cant find it at all. Dodge dealer was no help on the OE fluid either

2/7/2010 3:45:33 PM

check with tri-point. that's where i buy transynd for my truck.

http://tripointtrucks.com/default.htm

2/7/2010 9:33:59 PM

http://quad4x4.com/NV4500%20Parts.htm

Go down the page and they have 2 qt. bottles of it.

2/7/2010 9:34:00 PM

Doesn't matter now.

Anyhow, Quad4x4 was one of the places I called who said they were out and didnt know when they would have more in- unless I wanted a 5 gallon bucket of it. Which I don't.

2/8/2010 12:33:44 AM

Popped an intercooler boot of today towing a truck I bought in SC, lucked out as there was a brand new auto parts store at the next exit and I was able to replace the clamp and get back on the road

2/11/2010 8:33:24 PM

OK so I keep smelling Diesel, think I need to re-do the fuel lines around the aux. pump. Wiring needs to be cleaned up too.

Getting an occasional "skip" or misfire feeling when idling warm at a stoplight, injectors leaking?

3/8/2010 11:18:57 AM

could be the injection pump

3/8/2010 7:38:01 PM