Quote :

"When were you there? I was in the range from about 4-6pm. "

i think we were there around 2:30-3 ish

I'm going to have to go and hold a S&W M&P and see how it fits my hand and how it feels when firing as compared to the glock. I'm definitely not set on anything yet, so we'll see. Thanks for that site!

1/7/2008 11:07:07 AM

Anybody know anything about the new Sig P220 compact? I'm looking for something a little smaller than my P228 to carry.

1/7/2008 1:59:19 PM

I have a P220 and love it. How much smaller is the compact? I have been looking for a P245.

1/7/2008 3:36:04 PM

The p220 carry is the p245 replacement.

The p220 compact is a little smaller

1/7/2008 4:56:07 PM

the M&P's have an available crimson trace grip laser that is fantastic. if i had one, it'd be one of the first things i would get, next to the fiber optic front sight.



[Edited on January 7, 2008 at 11:25 PM. Reason : s]

1/7/2008 11:22:13 PM

I was looking at one of those laser grips, and didn't see a way to adjust their aim. If that's the case, then they're essentially worthless.

1/8/2008 9:21:28 AM

Crimson Trace has two tiny allen screws that adjust the aim of the laser. It can take a while, but once they're set they're pretty much set. I've got them on my J-Frame and I haven't had any issues with it.

Right now, the CT for the M&P only comes with one grip size, who knows if they'll get more.

^^ Why the fiber optic instead of tritium?

1/8/2008 9:50:58 AM

Quote :

"^^ Why the fiber optic instead of tritium?"

I take it you mean the truglo tritium fiber optic or something similar? I have poor eyesight and can see it better at night without glasses. I just need to get one for my sig.

[Edited on January 8, 2008 at 6:26 PM. Reason : sh]

1/8/2008 6:26:03 PM

j frame laser sight

http://www.lasermax.com/category.php?id=8

1/8/2008 7:50:29 PM

those lasers that go in the guide rail

that is nifty

1/8/2008 8:12:13 PM

i like them, but i don't like how you turn them on.

1/8/2008 8:15:58 PM

yeah it would be cool if it turned on when you just picked the gun up rather than flipping a switch

1/8/2008 8:26:38 PM

yeah only CT laser sights have that.

too bad it looks so odd on my gun.

1/8/2008 8:50:38 PM

i got a late christmas present today!

Surefire X300 http://www.surefire.com/maxexp/main/co_disp/displ/prrfnbr/24462/sesent/00/X300-LED-WeaponLight

this motherfucker is so unbelievably bright its wild

also yeah those lasers that replace the spring are pretty sweet...I believe LaserMax is the company...and in regards to how to turn them on, i've seen one in a glock and we all know how simple stripping a glock is right? well the little switches you hold to release the slide kind of become the laser button...basically its not that uncomfortable to activate

that X300 has some adapters where you can add a small button near the grip but holy shit its so bright...i had it shining next to my Surefire L4 flashlight that I carry with me at work and its a whole lot brighter than that...unreal

1/9/2008 4:04:37 PM

be careful with those things


my M3 tactical illuminator almost burned my truck to the ground one day


I was at my parents place, looked out the window, but there was smoke rolling out the windows

the damn thing had shorted in the console and had almost caught the papers in there on fire, luckily the console was closed and it only smoldered

1/9/2008 4:54:11 PM

wow...yeah i know surefires get hot as fuck and they tell you never to set them lens down, etc

1/9/2008 5:41:16 PM

Congrats on the gift.
Surefire makes quality stuff.

Just my opinion though...I don't like the idea of gun mounted lights.
Whats one of the top rules of gun handling?
Don't point the gun at anything you don't intend to destroy?
You may find yourself trying to identify an intruder only to find out it's your drunk brother who never told you he was coming and needs a place to crash.
I have a few xenon lights that I keep around.
I don't really like stuff attached to my guns.

Don't like lasers either...I just think it's faster to use the sights than to point the gun then try to find a little red dot. It's made worse if it's not one of the instant turn on models because you have to mess around with a switch.
The only advantage I see in lasers is for LEOs. A laser could be used as a scare tactic when they want a badguy to give up.
If I find myself pointing a gun at someone then I'm not looking to scare them. I'm looking to shoot the hell out of them and quickly.

[Edited on January 9, 2008 at 10:37 PM. Reason : ]

1/9/2008 10:33:56 PM

if i could get a sig p229 .40 in good condition (has poorly installed truglo fiberoptic sights) with 3 mags, except that it needed:

a new guide rod & spring
maybe barrel (unknown shot count)

for $680 or so, should i get it?

what could i do about the poorly installed sights? they, according to the dealer, were drifted in and not pressed. they are functional, but dinged a bit from improper install.

1/10/2008 1:23:39 AM

I'd tell you to head to Lawman's first... they apparently have some barely used P229's right now for a good price. They were test guns or something of the like from what a buddy told me. I couldn't make it up there yesterday to look for myself.

1/10/2008 6:20:40 AM

^^ I bought my p228 used for a lot less than that

I'm sure you can find a ton of CPO p229s for less, too

1/10/2008 8:03:47 AM

228s typically cost less than 229s, but that's still an expensive price for a used 229.
For that price it should be excellent condition with no work needed.
A new barrel will set you have $150. That's rediculous to pay that much and then install a new barrel.

A certified pre-owned should cost less than that and they'll come with new springs.

As far as the sights, I'd just leave them. They're functional.

I second the suggestion to check Lawmen's.
Police trade ins are good working guns because they're usually shot very little. They usually have lots of holster wear though.

1/10/2008 10:01:01 AM

Quote :

"Don't like lasers either...I just think it's faster to use the sights than to point the gun then try to find a little red dot."

I like them on my J frame since the sights are so shitty. For me at least, the technique is to look down the sights, find the dot, and keep it on the target. I still use the sights, but the laser is a nice addition. If I can see down the sights, I can find the dot.

Quote :

"Just my opinion though...I don't like the idea of gun mounted lights. Whats one of the top rules of gun handling? Don't point the gun at anything you don't intend to destroy? You may find yourself trying to identify an intruder only to find out it's your drunk brother who never told you he was coming and needs a place to crash."

I've heard a lot of people argue this, and it makes a lot of sense. That being said, a lot of Sure Fires will allow you to illuminate the target without pointing the gun directly at them, and also allow you a second hand free to operate a phone, house lights, etc.

1/10/2008 10:23:07 AM

Just to try that (^) last night, I cut off all the lights in my house and then turned on my SureFire. I could see everything in each room with the handgun pointed safely at the ground. Thats just me though, I'm not saying it works or it doesn't work, just that it has worked for me.


On another note, I thought this was pretty cool. If you have a CCP, it'll let you do a quick check of which states honor your state's permit if you travel.
http://carryconcealed.net/packngo/index.php

Being from NC, there are only a few states that don't, but it also has links to the CCP laws in each state.

1/11/2008 9:13:16 AM

It's good you tried it and it works.

There are too many people out there that don't think about these things.

1/11/2008 9:47:26 AM

Quote :

"Whats one of the top rules of gun handling? Don't point the gun at anything you don't intend to destroy?"

do you always intend to destroy the floor? i get your point, but i also think you're just inherently anti-accessory

1/11/2008 9:52:39 AM

^^ and thats a home defense scenario, where I know where everything is . . . not a parking garage where I'm swinging a light around trying to find a noise.

You're right though, too many people buy a gun, load it, leave it in the dresser, and never give it another thought.

1/11/2008 9:56:15 AM

i dont know if most of the people in this thread do that

1/11/2008 9:58:24 AM

Quote :

"You may find yourself trying to identify an intruder only to find out it's your drunk brother who never told you he was coming and needs a place to crash.""

In a sketchy situation in your house, it's completely acceptable to violate one of the rules in order to make sure everything is secure. You still have rules 3 and 4, which are more of an issue than that one.

1/11/2008 10:38:25 AM

Quote :

"but i also think you're just inherently anti-accessory"

That's an accurate statement
I'm all about modifying guns...just not attaching stuff to the outsides.

I've had lights, side saddles, played with lasers and all that other tacticool mess and have just decided I personally don't need/want any of it.
The only things I might would add to defense guns are extended mag tubes, speed feed factory profile stocks, and rifle/ghost ring sights on shotguns.
I like my pistols plain.

[Edited on January 11, 2008 at 1:20 PM. Reason : ]

1/11/2008 1:19:57 PM

People at the ship on site stores are dumb.

I dropped my package off and when they asked what was in the package, they started acting weird when I told them it was a firearm.

It's not like it's going to bite you.

Without looking at the package, the guy at the counter said "yeah you have to send it next day air".

Thanks buddy, I already did that. Fucking useless.

[Edited on January 11, 2008 at 2:11 PM. Reason : prepaid shipping label.]

1/11/2008 2:11:21 PM

Once I went to the post office to ship a scope.
The lady asked what it was and I said "a rifle scope" (won't say that again).
I think she shit her pants as she yelled for the other workers to come to her and told me I can't ship a firearm (which is not true, FFLs can do it through USPS).

I had to explain to her that it's a scope, like a telescope, not a rifle.
One guy working there acted like she was an idiot, so that made me feel better.

1/11/2008 2:22:41 PM

What are some recommended home defense rounds that have low flash and recoil?

I know it's asking a bit much since I have a .40S&W, but still .

The gun stores I've been to seem to have the small boxes of defense ammo, but I can get larger boxes online right?

1/11/2008 2:54:38 PM

Speer Gold Dot
Winchester Ranger T
Winchester Golden Sabre & Golden Sabre Bonded
Federal Hydrashok
Federal HST
Hornady TAP

The Ranger T and HST come in 50 round boxes that usually cost less. Lawmen's carries them.
I don't know if the others come in bigger boxes.

Pick the lighter bullets for slightly lower recoil. All those loads have less flash than most cheap ammo. I'm not sure which has the least, but I think it might be TAP. Look around the net and you'll find the muzzle flash tests.

1/11/2008 3:05:57 PM

Trijicon sights and rubber grips are usually the only changes I make. Chamfered the mag well on a few as well. I like to keep em as simple as possible.

1/11/2008 3:31:37 PM

i dont have any holsters that will accomodate any lights or lasers or anything (actually i think the holster that comes with XDs might but i dont use those holsters) so i never really have lights with me or anything, but they're still nice sometimes when you're out in the cut or want to do some night shooting

1/11/2008 3:38:42 PM

Lights for house guns (IMO) = good

Lights for carry guns are ususally (usually) too cumbersome to be effectively concealed and few holsters are made for them.

^ some exist, you just have to look around. I can't think of anything off the top of my head but maybe try Blade-Tech?

1/11/2008 3:42:28 PM

i dont even really want one, i'm with you guys, the taurus im carrying right now is completely factory (except for a slip on rubber grip)...i think its kind of dumb to always carry a light on your gun unless youre some kind of military or special ops, but if you are going to get a light, surefire is as bright as you'll need

1/11/2008 3:44:26 PM

Quote :

"I'm all about modifying guns...just not attaching stuff to the outsides."

Quote :

"FFLs can do it through USPS"

Anybody can ship a long gun through USPS. You can even ship them to yourself at another address for hunting trips.

1/11/2008 4:45:39 PM

Need a good/comfortable concealed IWB holster for p229 with rail. I know it's asking a bit much considering how big the gun is, but still.

Someone reccomended Milt Sparks Versa Max II and the Watch Six.

Comfort is a high priority.

Also, is having a anti-carjacking holster something to consider?

1/12/2008 12:23:44 AM

played with a J frame with the crimson trace grip at lawmen's yesterday, very nice, and way cheaper than getting it later on in the game, it was only like 150 over normal cost versus over 200 if you bought it later.

I did look at the D&E P229 that they had there, it was in great shape and came with a box and 3 mags for $599.

I was surprised that the M&P's were cheaper than the sigs, I though they would have been more. I think I've narrowed it down to the M&P or the p229, didn't have the time to mess with the M&P as we got there at about 4:35. May try to go rent one and a J frame for the wife to try out later next week. Gun show's coming up!

And I know what you guys mean about shipping guns, I had to send my P85 back to Ruger, i took it in a box to the local UPS store and they freaked the fuck out... ended up having to take it up to Atlantic Ave to the Fed Ex place where they were more than helpful... weird how people get so easily freaked out

[Edited on January 12, 2008 at 6:32 AM. Reason : ]

1/12/2008 6:30:33 AM

Quote :

"Need a good/comfortable concealed IWB holster for p229 with rail. I know it's asking a bit much considering how big the gun is, but still."

Are you trying to carrry it IWB with something on the rail? If not, I use a nylon Passport IWB holster that is thin and comfortable that I would recommend.

http://www.passport-holsters.com/sizeguide.html#A3

1/12/2008 1:07:14 PM

Nothin on the rail. Haven't seen many offerings for a rail equipped sig.

[Edited on January 12, 2008 at 1:25 PM. Reason : c]

1/12/2008 1:23:26 PM

Fired a Browning HiPower 9mm today. I thought a 9mm had more power than that, I mean it seriously didn't feel anymore like firing MiniMags from a Ruger Mark II. There was however more concussion. It makes me think that a .40 S&W might be a better bet in a carry pistol.

1/13/2008 2:45:29 AM

9mm would make a fine carry pistol. If you want one with more power, look at the .357SIG.

1/14/2008 1:23:57 PM

The Hi Power is a steel gun, so it's pretty good at taming recoil. The 9mm doesnt have much recoil though. Doesn't mean it's a bad cartridge.
High quality 9mm JHP will penetrate just as far and expand almost as big as 40S&W and 45ACP.

Of course there's nothing wrong with 40S&W either, it just costs more to shoot for fun and some people can't shoot it as well because of the recoil.

1/14/2008 5:30:24 PM

that looks like the biggest POS holster ever. you need two attachment points to keep the gun from torqing around. Milt sparks summer specials have been great for me. a stiff belt and a good holster will make it alot easier to carry all the time. if you cant do a cartwheel with your gun on, you need better gear. good gun leather is not cheap, but it is worth it.

1/14/2008 9:21:48 PM

well i was looking at the summer special, watch six, and the versa max II.

can't decide which one is better.

1/15/2008 1:57:19 AM

If you've got the money, Mitch Rosen makes some great holsters. You don't NEED two points, some designs can get away without it, but for a large number, yes they help.

1/15/2008 10:21:32 AM

I wear a 5 stich wilderness products frequent flyer belt, it has two derlin rings for a buckle, so you are never between sizes. Its very stiff and supports my iron very well. beltman.com also has good stuff. most leather gunbelts are two layers stitched and glued together. personal defence has alot of nice holsters from wildbill's, and some nice belts as well. they can be hard to order from, I hear but off the rack at pdhsc you cant beat them.

1/15/2008 10:53:04 PM

sig p232 .380 NEW blued da/sa $495 (shipped to my FFL/includes everything).

good deal or no?

i really want a stainless model with or without hogue grips and nightsights, but those are way more than i can spend at the moment.

is there anything wrong with a blued finish?

it's either that or an HK p7 9mm

1/17/2008 3:57:37 PM