Quote :

"Even if he's impeached or the 25th is invoked does it really matter with less than two weeks left?"

I think it matters on principle.

1/8/2021 10:02:42 AM

It matters because he can still start a war for attention.

1/8/2021 10:04:32 AM

Elaine Chao resigned with his husband the Turtle.

1/8/2021 10:14:38 AM

Yea if he's impeached alone, it puts him on the record as only president impeached twice, also make every house rep stand up and announce where they stand (although 100 already have), and could do the same for senators if Mitch held a vote.

If he's removed, either through impeachment or 25th, that has a long list of non symbolic benefits (pardons, worries of military next two weeks, 2024,etc)

1/8/2021 10:17:26 AM

Quote :

"Even if he's impeached or the 25th is invoked does it really matter with less than two weeks left?"

it absolutely matters (for reasons laid out above). but i think with 2 weeks left, that's enough for people to cop out and say "well he'll be gone in 2 weeks, he even said he was going to peacefully transition" for it to not move forward. might be more urgency to do something if this shit happened closer to november, imo.

1/8/2021 11:05:54 AM

He's not getting removed, either way. Impeaching him twice sounds great, but LOL at thinking that 16+ GOP Senators will remove him now that their immediate safety is no longer in jeopardy.

If anything, Trump will just brag about being impeached TWICED, and yet he'll have "left" the office "peacefully"

Sorry to be such a Debbie Downer, but it ain't happening. Let's pray for 12 days of golfing, which means PLENTY of time for Trump to busy himself cheating/getting away with something non-consequential, at Mar a Lago.





[Edited on January 8, 2021 at 11:27 AM. Reason : fore score and MAGA years ago...]

1/8/2021 11:18:57 AM

I expect your prediction is correct, but that shouldn't mean he can just skate by and escape any form of justice like usual just because it happens to be close to inauguration.

1/8/2021 11:21:23 AM

The fact that he's not even been impeached already just goes to show you how glacially slow/inefficient Congress is. They could literally copy/paste the work they had from LAST January and have the articles filed without having to do ANY new research.

Blame Pelosi if you want, but it's far more than just her. It's mind-boggling how slowly the Capitol police responded, so it shouldn't be a shock/surprise that this is nothing but talk.

1/8/2021 11:24:28 AM

I think the other thing is that if he is 25th'd or impeached it bars him from ever holding office again. That would remove the future specter of him running in 2024.

1/8/2021 11:35:16 AM

I mean that's all great, but I'm pretty sure he's going to be fighting a long, boring, drawn out legal battle with the SDNY. Federal treason charges, although obviously warranted, get tricky because then he's going to be seen as a martyr. Way easier to take him down for financial crimes/corruption than trying him for treason, but IANAL

The Senate literally rammed through the ACB nomination before RBG's dead body was even cold in the ground and you think they'll just expediently cooperate with mostly symbolic impeachment charges, that would force them to abandon even the "good parts" of Trumpism that they still like? Yeah, that's a big no from me dawg.

[Edited on January 8, 2021 at 11:44 AM. Reason : .]

1/8/2021 11:37:45 AM

Quote :

"LOL at thinking that 16+ GOP Senators will remove him now that their immediate safety is no longer in jeopardy."

Does anyone think that? Here or in the larger public/congress/media?

1/8/2021 12:03:48 PM

Nuke codes are the reason he should be impeached/25th.

1/8/2021 12:04:20 PM

Quote :

"if Mitch held a vote."

Trump can be still be impeached after he leaves office. Schumer as majority leader would make sure a vote happens.

1/8/2021 12:16:17 PM

^^This might be the nicest thing I've ever said about Trump but I don't think he's that type of mentally unstable.

[Edited on January 8, 2021 at 12:17 PM. Reason : ^I did not know that ]

1/8/2021 12:17:37 PM

Quote :

"Does anyone think that? Here or in the larger public/congress/media?"

NO! Which is why this topic is just noise and a waste of everyone's time, albeit slightly less so than the 25th nonsense. It accomplishes nothing really, other than reminding people how horrible Trump is, yet he'll still manage to "get away with it"-- he literally got away with everything during his entire administration, so this is just handwringing.

1/8/2021 12:23:52 PM

It 100% accomplishes something. It's just you don't think those things have value.

Also to flip it, what's the downside??

[Edited on January 8, 2021 at 12:29 PM. Reason : E]

1/8/2021 12:26:23 PM

I mean The NY Times JUST reported that unless Trump resigns, Pelosi is moving forward with impeachment, so assuming this happens, we should BOTH be happy! I'm just saying that the removal aspect WON'T happen, which is going to erase any short-lived "good feelings" we will have.

The downside, as I said earlier, is that 2/3rds of the Senate WON'T vote to remove him, giving Trump and his supporters even more reasons to cry about being persecuted. It further pisses off the left/general public, and could possibly lead to more anger and violence, particularly the 20% lunatic part of the population that actually thought Tuesday's riots were OK...



[Edited on January 8, 2021 at 12:35 PM. Reason : .]

1/8/2021 12:29:20 PM

I will be happy! And the feeling will be at least as permanent as any other feeling of happiness in this hellish time! If she follows through I will give her credit (although partial bc it should happen TODAY, "if he resigns" is a stall)!

And I edited my post after you responded to say:

Quote :

"Also to flip it, what's the downside??"

1/8/2021 12:32:00 PM

^ A squishy Senate once again gives Trump a pass.

1/8/2021 12:35:47 PM

But so what? We won't get the upside of the removal but those senators have to live that down in their campaigns.

1/8/2021 12:49:36 PM

So you don't care if the outcome is merely more violence/acrimony/division on the very looooooooong shot that suddenly GOP senators will completely change their personalities at the very last minute? You also do realize that plenty of POS GOP Senators have SIX years until they face reelection?

K.



[Edited on January 8, 2021 at 12:55 PM. Reason : Here's where we differ: optimism vs realism]

1/8/2021 12:53:27 PM

I'll ignore the straw man and translate your response to be "I think another impeachment will cause more violence"

My answer to that is it seems there has been a pretty major public response against the actions of this week and acknowledging the fault. I don't see why impeachment would increase the threat of violence that exists just by the guy sitting in the oval office.

As for acrimony, how many people are left that would vote against Dems in 2/4 years bc they attempted to hold him accountable??

Quote :

"You also do realize that plenty of POS GOP Senators have SIX years until they face reelection?"

Sure that upside isn't massive but it exists. The downside is near non existent imo

[Edited on January 8, 2021 at 12:59 PM. Reason : E]

Quote :

"optimism vs realism"

More like optimism vs pessimism. We're both just attempting to make educated guesses.

[Edited on January 8, 2021 at 1:00 PM. Reason : E]

1/8/2021 12:57:51 PM

I mean I'm just not seeing where you're getting 16+ GOP senators to vote to remove.

Romney? Sure.
Merkowski? Sure.
Collins? MAYBE!!??
...

1/8/2021 1:20:31 PM

Nobody thinks they'll remove, least of all me. I would prefer that they did obviously, but I think it's easily worthwhile to impeach with a 0% chance of removal. As it is the chances are non-0. They are very very low but non zero.

[Edited on January 8, 2021 at 1:27 PM. Reason : E]

1/8/2021 1:26:14 PM

If A Tanzarian is right and they can impeach AFTER Biden is president, I'd much rather have it go down that way, personally.

1/8/2021 1:28:12 PM

Why? What will materially change if he gets 50 votes for removal rather than 48?

1/8/2021 1:29:51 PM

Because it would be a retroactive impeachment designed to prevent Trump for EVER holding public office again? It would be about holding him accountable for PAST crimes when he's out of power, instead of during a time where he's clearly unhinged and still retains power? Seems more productive than removing him on his way out the door, despite a disputed loss, less than two weeks of a lame duck term. Also, there wouldn't be any need to "rush", like there is now.

But that's just like my opinion, man.

1/8/2021 1:35:00 PM

I can see the value of waiting to get him out before inflaming, but I think he can still inflame his supporters on 1/21. I'll acknowledge that as a downside.

If that happens though, the impeachment should be deep and wide, if you're going to wait investigate it all. Cast a wide net. That was my biggest problem with the first one, they made it super narrow and fast. Like they were tying to rip off a bandaid instead of rooting out a cancer.

[Edited on January 8, 2021 at 1:47 PM. Reason : I see you also mentioned not needing to rush, so that's TWO points I'll give you! ]

1/8/2021 1:46:34 PM

I mean why is this even an argument? We BOTH want him impeached/removed, and we both know it ain't happening during the next 12 days. I get that there's not a whole lot else to talk about, but this is just a thought exercise at this point.

If/when the articles are filed, I'll happily start making popcorn, naively hoping that 16 GOP Senators totally stab Trump in the back on his way out of office, but we both know how that movie is going to end. I didn't even bother watching the Senate impeachment trial last year, let alone follow the news leading up to his Senate acquittal. I definitely watched the trial in the House though!

Again, I think it's wiser to just let Trump play golf, keep him quiet on Twitter/FB, and then let the SDNY/DOJ/Congress/etc do their thang once Biden is in office.




[Edited on January 8, 2021 at 1:58 PM. Reason : .]

1/8/2021 1:54:16 PM

I'm sure all of the Democrat politicians who, a year ago, were all "let's just vote him out of office instead of impeaching him" are going to be 100% behind impeachment, now that he's actually been voted out of office.

1/8/2021 1:56:57 PM

^^I thought we were arguing bc you didn't think Pelosi should be pressured to impeach?

1/8/2021 2:10:50 PM

LMAO wut?

He should have been impeached YESTERDAY, or right after the EC vote was certified while everyone in Congress was there.

Re-read the post I wrote talking about how glacially things move through Congress. A vote taking place sometime mid next week is better than nothing, but WTF does it need to take that long?

1/8/2021 2:21:18 PM

Lol i refuse to read our old posts. But I'll just concede I misinterpreted you, sorry about that! I agree we shouldn't be arguing!

1/8/2021 2:28:04 PM

Hug it out, bros. Mutual admiration society up in hurr.

Couldn't do this with Earl skulking around.

1/8/2021 2:39:35 PM

Kumbaya!

1/8/2021 2:42:15 PM

I already gave him a kiss face in another thread, I've hit my quota!

1/8/2021 2:43:04 PM

We all good TWW fam

1/8/2021 2:55:38 PM

Why did Earl get suspended (i mean, besides being an insufferable troll)?

1/8/2021 4:10:17 PM

message_topic.aspx?topic=648190&page=197#16589344

1/8/2021 4:14:03 PM

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-election/congressional-democrats-to-pursue-second-impeachment-of-trump-sources-idUSKBN29D1J8

1/8/2021 4:25:55 PM

I still wish theyd done it today but allow me to say: hell yea Gg Nancy

1/8/2021 4:33:17 PM

well, I wanted it done on Tuesday. Way for her to drag her heels

[Edited on January 8, 2021 at 4:37 PM. Reason : .]

1/8/2021 4:36:57 PM

https://twitter.com/sfpelosi/status/1347653080737714177

Quote :

"Per House Rules, need unanimous consent to meet sooner than its next session, which is Monday. Republicans would object. So #Impeachment article Incitement to Insurrection will be introduced Monday."

rules

[Edited on January 8, 2021 at 5:37 PM. Reason : Lisa Murkowski has now called for Trump to resign.]

1/8/2021 5:29:31 PM

K so we've got:

1. Murkowsky v
2. Sasse ?
3. Romney ?
4. Collins !?!?!
5. Loeffler/Perdue? (LOL since they both conceded, let's assume they're pissed)
6. Graham?
7. Mitch?

Yeah, not happening. But I do like the fact that Trump's own idiocy/refusal to resign will mean that Pence won't pardon him

1/8/2021 5:43:06 PM

My guess is he resigns Sunday night

1/8/2021 7:07:36 PM

^ doubt it

He's too stupid to do anything proactive; he's just going to run his gums on Parler or NEWSMAX or FOX, digging his own grave.

1/8/2021 7:25:32 PM

He won't resign. The Trump administration runs on the assumption that is someone has to publicly do something in order to stop them, they'll get away with whatever it is and so far it's worked.

1/9/2021 3:28:13 PM

Yeah he won’t resign. Nobody’s invoking the 25th. They will try to impeach him. But he won’t get removed from office.

Might’ve been different if this had happened right after the election in November. But with less than 2 weeks it’s way too easy to wait it out and just keep saying “it’s time to unite blah blah”

1/9/2021 3:43:50 PM

It’s being reported Trump regrets making the concession video.

I think some democrats and republicans aren’t think what Trump could do a week or month from now. Trump could keep telling his followers to stage attacks and they’ll do it. History has long shown that people like Trump don’t give up, failed coups are followed by successful coups very often. I’m genuinely worried things will get far worse if we can’t immediately hold Trump accountable, as well as his supporters in congress. They are not loyal to America or the country or the constitution, they’re only loyal to Trump.

1/9/2021 4:57:34 PM

Without Twitter/FB/Reddit/Parler he's going to have a hard time delivering his messages, which obviously is going to piss him off; however, he's been pretty much neutered for at least the weekend, so there's that.

Once the impeachment charges are filed on Monday, I expect him to go nuts on FOX/NEWSMAX, Rush, OAN/etc, but I think the collective embarrassment of the Capitol PD/Pentagon has rattled enough people with actual authority/power to make sure that DC will be safer. As for the rest of the country? Yikes.

[Edited on January 9, 2021 at 7:01 PM. Reason : .]

1/9/2021 6:56:58 PM