Quote :

"The law doesn't grant anyone permission to do anything. It is overtly designating a specific day of religious prayer to an Abrahamic God. It is a recognition that prayer to God as a something Americans do on this day, every year. It's disgusting. "

Quote :

"on which the people of the United States may turn to "

!=

Quote :

"on which the people must"

If I say you may troll this thread, then I am giving you permission.
If I say you must troll this thread, then I am giving an order (which if given by the president would require obedience)

As said before it is a "nothing" proclamation. No one is excluded. No one is injured. No one is forced. If you can show me that you are harmed in some way or that your rights are being infringed upon then I might change my mind.

Quote :

""Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion". Together with the Free Exercise Clause ("... or prohibiting the free exercise thereof"), these two clauses make up what are commonly known as the "religion clauses" of the First Amendment. "

If anything this is upholding the 2nd clause.

4/26/2010 4:27:40 PM

The U.S. Government, by making a law proclaiming a particular day to pray to God, is endorsing religions that pray to God. It's not a "nothing" proclamation. It has no provisions for Americans who pray to other gods, who observe their religion without prayer, or do not pray at all.

And if it did have those things, then it would truly be a "nothing" proclamation. A day of "Pray or don't pray". Which would obviously be pointless. Which should clue you in as to how useful the existing legislation is.

The bottom line is that it serves no secular purpose, and until case precedence shifts from Lemon v. Kurtzman (1971) it is unconstitutional on those bounds alone. I'm sure smarter people than us will argue it in court but for the moment I agree with the District Judge.

4/26/2010 4:42:40 PM

Let it go man, you lost. You have no grounds to hold such an elevated hatred for prayer. Maybe it's because you don't understand it? Either way it has 0 impact on your life as an individual if there is a day proclaimed as prayer day or not. You're just grasping for straws at this point. Focus your energy on something else.

4/26/2010 4:56:03 PM

I don't see how you can call disco_stu a troll when you post this kind of shit, man. I don't even know if you're being serious.

4/26/2010 5:13:49 PM

^because I gave up reasoning with him a couple pages back.

The bottom line is this has no affect on his life what so ever. Why is he so bent out of shape over prayer and religion? I do not know. But luckily his opinion doesn't matter and we're all free to follow our own believes/faiths.

4/26/2010 5:16:37 PM

Prayer has an effect on society. That's the argument being made. The belief that prayer alone can solve problems is a false belief. It's causing people to stop seeking solutions when they should continue seeking solutions. That's a negative consequence of prayer that everyone in society suffers from. If it was limited to people believing stupid things and keeping it to themselves, it wouldn't be an issue. It's a much bigger problem than that, though.

4/26/2010 5:55:25 PM

Quote :

"Prayer has an effect on society. That's the argument being made. The belief that prayer alone can solve problems is a false belief. It's causing people to stop seeking solutions when they should continue seeking solutions. That's a negative consequence of prayer that everyone in society suffers from. If it was limited to people believing stupid things and keeping it to themselves, it wouldn't be an issue. It's a much bigger problem than that, though."

That tells me you are in disco_stu's sinking boat. Neither of you have a shred of understanding of what prayer is. You read 1 article on some crazy family who's child died because they refused medical attention and you've suddenly become experts.

Now to put you on mute with disco.

4/26/2010 6:14:28 PM

Ah yes, the old "I can't refute your points so I'll put my fingers in my ears and scream 'LALALALA.'" I went to church basically every Sunday for 18 years. I attended many different churches in many different denominations. I know what prayer is. At least you can sleep easy at night knowing that you'll go to Heaven, while 99.9% of humanity will burn in Hell for all eternity, right?

[Edited on April 26, 2010 at 6:51 PM. Reason : ]

4/26/2010 6:50:49 PM

Quote :

"Matthew 6:5-6 And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites are: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward. But thou, when thou prayest, enter into thy closet, and when thou hast shut thy door, pray to thy Father which is in secret; and thy Father which seeth in secret shall reward thee openly."

4/26/2010 8:27:49 PM