no other way huh?

what would the problem be if we didnt go through the FFL? obviously if i put some bodies on the thing, and the firearm was found to be the source, it would go back to him as the registered owner

but since im a lover and not a fighter...not likely

2/9/2009 12:52:58 PM

In actuality, probably nothing.

But

If it was flagged for any reason, it is a violation of Federal firearms laws. These are never a good thing to break. If shipping to an FFL and the package is lost or stolen, you are covered. If shipping to 'a friend' and it gets lost or stolen you might be in for more of a headache.

The $40 is just the easiest, most secure way of doing the transfer.

2/9/2009 1:53:46 PM

Quote :

"it is a violation of Federal firearms laws"

prison? possessing unlicensed firearm, interstate transport, unlicensed firearm within city limits, etc...

it would be bad for him, worse for you.

though if your state allows face to face transfers, you should be ok?`

[Edited on February 9, 2009 at 3:01 PM. Reason : ejk]

2/9/2009 3:00:19 PM

The easiest thing is for you to go to an FFL and have the dude ship it to your FFL.

If you plan on coming to NC then:
-Get pistol purchasing permit from home county (with old driver's license for proof of residence)
-Wait a week for the permit
-Buy pistol, give him purchasing permit
-Mail pistol to yourself at your WA address (it is legal to ship it to yourself)

You don't have to "transfer it to your own name." because it's probably not registered.
If it is registered (because the guy lives in Durham County or some other stupid municipality) then simply have him declare it sold and show them a bill of sale before you get it.

If you want to do it real cheap then you could have him ship it to you in two shipments. One with the stripped down frame.
The other with all ther other parts.
If anyone opens the box then they probably won't know what any of it is or would be stupid enough to believe you when you say "ohh, it's not a whole gun, just parts."
Yes, it is illegal as hell to ship the registered part (the frame) accross state lines to another person.
I don't recommend you do that because it's illegal, I'm just saying you could...

2/9/2009 5:17:53 PM

Does this http://www.dol.wa.gov/forms/652004.pdf bypass the transfer to a FFL. Assuming both parties sign the original and it is filed accordingly, should I still have to pay the completely unrelated dealer for this to be legit?

2/9/2009 5:29:09 PM

Since when has durham county made it manditory to "register" your firearms, last I checked it is illegal for any part of the government to have a privitzed list of all of the legally purchased firearms..................or am I just outta the loop? And what in North Carolina outside the class 3,AOW and SBR types are constituted as "illegal unlicensed Firearms".

I wouldn't recommend trying to bypass he ffl transfer, or ship through th postal service, as its a felony and I think 10yrs prison, sumthin like 100,000$ fine, 40$< 10yr ass pounding

[Edited on February 10, 2009 at 1:49 AM. Reason : I would like to know where some people get there info.]

[Edited on February 10, 2009 at 1:54 AM. Reason : forgot something, oh and not trying t be a total ass]

2/10/2009 1:47:22 AM

You have to register them in Durham. Its the (unconstitutional) law.

Unless you are a felon. The courts have ruled forcing a felon to register a gun is a violation of the 5th amendment.

2/10/2009 2:27:20 AM

Anybody know of any whacky guns laws (like the one above for Durham County) in Chatham County?

2/10/2009 9:20:56 AM

I was told that if I ever lived in Durham, to NEVER register your firearm since it is unconstitutional. Basically, then end point was that it will end up in a State Court and they will dismiss the case.

2/10/2009 9:54:22 AM

Quote :

"Since when has durham county made it manditory to "register" your firearms, last I checked it is illegal for any part of the government to have a privitzed list of all of the legally purchased firearms..................or am I just outta the loop? "

They don't have a list of purchased firearms. They do have a law that says you have to register handguns.
It's rather silly, you buy a handgun, then go to the court and tell them what the make, model, caliber, and serial number is. They have no real proof that you actually own anything.

http://www.ncrpa.org/ncgunfaq.htm

Quote :

"Q: I have just moved to NC from another State. Do I have to register my guns with the Sheriff or the NC State Government? A: There is no NC state law that requires you to register your firearms, or notify any public official. One county in NC requires its residents to register handguns - Durham County. This power was granted to Durham County by the State Legislature. No other counties or localities are permitted to require registration. With the sole exception of Durham County, if you are a law-abiding citizen who lives in North Carolina you are entitled to possess the firearms you currently own without any hassle or red tape. Some county sheriffs, inundated with inquiries from people who move to NC from more restrictive areas where registration or ownership permits are required by law, have instituted voluntary notification procedures. In other words, if you have a burning desire to tell a public official about your private possessions, in some counties they will take your information and store it in a computer database. NCRPA recommends that you refrain from doing this - it's none of their business. "

Quote :

"And what in North Carolina outside the class 3,AOW and SBR types are constituted as "illegal unlicensed Firearms". "

NC doesn't restrict the types of firearms you can own any more than the federal laws. You also don't have to be "licensed" to own anything in NC except for having paid the taxes on the class iii, aow, etc.
I assume you were talking about what seotaji said. Now, when you throw the fact that the dude lives in WA then you could run into some issues if he gets the gun and WA requires licensing or registration. That shouldn't be a problem though. He acquired a gun, if WA requires registration then he simply has to register it. For all they know he had it before he moved to WA.

2/10/2009 11:06:28 AM

Question on OC & CC.

I went to a friend's house this past weekend and I was OC'ing. When I got there, I found out it was a party and they were selling cups to a keg (I thought it was a small get-together when I was invited). What's the ruling on OC'ing/CC'ing at such a scene? Also, can you CC, without a CCP, on someone else's private property (I know you can on your own)?

2/10/2009 11:09:03 AM

As long as you are not drinking, then you are fine to continue carrying.
They don't have an ABC license so you are fine. They are breaking the law technically, but it would be phrased as recouping the money they fronted.

You cannot CC on any property but your own without a permit.

[Edited on February 10, 2009 at 11:12 AM. Reason : .]

2/10/2009 11:10:52 AM

^thanks. I figured the CC with no CCP thing would hold only to your own property.

2/10/2009 11:13:44 AM

^Just a tid bit...you can't have a firearm at public gatherings. That typically means parades, concerts, etc, but could mean something like a block party.
You said it was a party at your friend's house and that's ok because it's a private party.

Here's a good site about laws:
http://www.grnc.org/firearms.htm

[Edited on February 10, 2009 at 3:48 PM. Reason : ]

2/10/2009 3:47:46 PM

public gatherings are OK to carry at if they are not on the grounds of medical institutions or under government control.

A block party is fine to carry at always.

2/10/2009 4:54:17 PM

^Only if it's a private street.

2/10/2009 5:17:49 PM

Quote :

"From Wolfpack to packing heat...."

-WRAL

2/10/2009 7:09:57 PM

Come on, brown truck of happiness. I want my model 60!

2/11/2009 1:54:13 PM

anyone been down to the wake co. range in apex/holly springs? They are doing a range orientation this Sunday (required before you can shoot there) and I was thinking about going down.

2/12/2009 1:48:37 AM

Is it ok to transport a gun without a CCL if I keep the pistol locked in its container in the trunk and the ammo seperate (and not loaded in any mags?)

[Edited on February 14, 2009 at 12:32 PM. Reason : ]

2/14/2009 12:31:49 PM

The standard for 'transport' in nc was, last I checked, that it not be where the driver or a passenger could 'easily get to it'. Standards for what that means seem to change based on the mood of local law enforcement.

2/14/2009 12:56:33 PM

^^if you mean only in NC, then you can just lay it on your front seat or put it on the dash - as long as you don't cover it up, it's legal.

2/14/2009 2:53:32 PM

http://www.jus.state.nc.us/NCJA/ncfirearmslaws.pdf

2/14/2009 4:44:51 PM

something that sums it up a little better:

http://opencarry.org/travel.html

2/14/2009 6:42:37 PM

Quote :

"anyone been down to the wake co. range in apex/holly springs? They are doing a range orientation this Sunday (required before you can shoot there) and I was thinking about going down."

Great facility, shitty hours.
The guys who run it are very good people, but they're strict on their range rules (as they should be), so don't take offense if they tell you you're doing something wrong.
It really is a nice range, especially for testing rifles/loads at 100 yards. It is expensive though cause they charge by the hour.

2/16/2009 1:35:02 PM

Can you rapid fire?

And is it true that the class required to shoot there is 2hrs long?

2/16/2009 3:07:33 PM

Quote :

"Can you rapid fire?"

IIRC it has to be "controlled." They don't have a silly 3 second rule, but you can't go and blast away or you'll eat up their ceiling.

Quote :

"And is it true that the class required to shoot there is 2hrs long?"

Yeah, i think it was about that long. I'm not sure though cause I took the hunter safety class there, which covers range access.

2/16/2009 4:43:43 PM

2hrs really? that's terrible.

2/16/2009 5:06:01 PM

yeah. Class was crowded as hell, 2 hour class is ehhh, and the range fees are comparable to PDHSC even for the 1 year memberships. Nice if you NEED 50 or 100 yard lines. However, the whole 'having to go down range to change targets' is a ig suck for me. I like being able to walk in, and shoot/change targets as often as I can for the hour or so I am at a range. Plus the Sunday afternoon/tues night/thurs night thing means i might as well not drive 20 miles to go shoot.

That, and the range officer spent more time 'correcting me' for having 'spread' on my target than he did observing. I had added 4 small 1 inch stick on dots to my target to pop away at with a 22, at those up then chewed the center out. Then got 'cautioned' for having a 12-18 inch spread with rapid fire 10 shot groups from a P11.

2/16/2009 6:24:52 PM

i'll pass on that range then.

2/16/2009 6:45:38 PM

I'm looking into purchasing sometime in the near future. Does anyone have a Glock 38 or a Sig 220 Compact or a Springfield Armory XD9 Subcompact they can comment on? I also want to try these out before I make a decision, so if you've got one, I'd love to meet up with you.

I'm also up for suggestions. I narrowed it down to these three because I'm 5'4" and 105 lbs, and I have very small hands. I have minimal experience with guns, but I'm planning on taking a training course and a concealed carry course before purchasing. Any advice would be appreciated. Thanks!

2/17/2009 11:08:37 AM

apples oranges and pears.

I don't know how the Glock 38 got in there, but you can toss that right now. .45GAP is a stupid idea, whose existence is now completely unnecessary thanks to the SF (short frame) models.

The 220 compact is probably heavier than you're going to want to carry. Subcompacts will be a better fit, rather than a large chopped SIG. XD9 isn't a bad choice, but if you considered a Glock 38, why not a Glock 26, the subcompact Glock equivalent to the XD?

I would recommend a G19, as subcompacts are harder to shoot well for beginners. Still, go to PDHSC and rent different models and see what you shoot best.

2/17/2009 11:22:14 AM

Quote :

"I don't know how the Glock 38 got in there, but you can toss that right now. .45GAP is a stupid idea, whose existence is now completely unnecessary thanks to the SF (short frame) models."

She meant Glock 36, I promise.

2/17/2009 11:24:22 AM

I actually meant Glock 36 instead of 38. As far as the Glock 26 goes, it may be a little big for my hands, after speaking with someone whose hands are a similar size to mine. To give you a good idea, I wear a kids glove. Women's smalls are too large.

Thanks for the advice!

2/17/2009 11:25:44 AM

your hands are REALLY small. you are in that position where you HAVE to go to a store and handle all the guns. i'd recommend davi's for the selection, not the staff.

you might have to get modifications like short triggers and whatnot, if you go with the p220.

[Edited on February 17, 2009 at 11:33 AM. Reason : eh]

2/17/2009 11:29:37 AM

Quote :

"i'd recommend davi's for the selection"

Where is that? I have only been to PDHSC -- Gzusfrk and I just started down the path of guns.

I'm looking at something I can use for CC -- probably an XDm 9mm...lots of people seem to dislike the 9mm for defense, but with JHP bullets it could probably do plenty of damage. I like the idea of the 20-round capacity as well.

Other options are the XD45 and the Glock 30. I have my reservations about Glocks going kaboom though...

I won't discount a full-size gun -- something I can conceal is better, but I might get a full size as well.

2/17/2009 11:33:12 AM

there is nothing wrong with 9mm. don't believe the haters. though +p ammunition might be something worth looking into, but that's another topic altogether.

4900 Leigh Dr
Raleigh, NC 27616

left on milbrook off capitol, right on signet dr.

glocks and kaboom are something that happens with barrels that are not fully supported (this is something that's been debated on the internet for a while) and most of the time reloaded ammunition. if i'm wrong, someone here will correct me. nothing to worry about in 9mm models.

Quote :

"I'm looking at something I can use for CC -- probably an XDm 9mm"

Are you sure you want to lug something that big around everyday? I did that and switched to something smaller. It made a huge difference in livability. Of course I'm not a huge guy either.

Have you figured out how you are going to carry it and where to keep it when it's not being worn?

2/17/2009 11:41:52 AM

Quote :

"Are you sure you want to lug something that big around everyday? I did that and switched to something smaller. It made a huge difference in livability. Of course I'm not a huge guy either."

Any recommendations, then? I have shot a Glock 30 and liked it, I also like what I have read about the XD series.

Quote :

"Have you figured out how you are going to carry it and where to keep it when it's not being worn?"

Nope.
I am open to any suggestions.

[Edited on February 17, 2009 at 12:03 PM. Reason : ]

2/17/2009 12:03:07 PM

Here's the rub for her: with hands that small, the subcompacts and snubnose revolvers that will fit will probably not be the most pleasant to shoot. I'd recommend seeing how a J-frame with a Hogue on it will fit, and how well she will shoot with it.. but for the love of Christ, make SURE it isn't an ultralight. That's the quickest way to lose interest in shooting.

The rub for you: Carrying a handgun takes practice, dressing around it, holster options, etc. Find one you shoot well, then worry about the concealment later.

2/17/2009 12:38:35 PM

The Glock kaboom issue is pretty much limited to the .40 S&W exclusively, and in very rare instances. Any other caliber is perfectly safe in that platform.

I carry a XD-9, both concealed IWB and open in a Serpa. I transitioned to it from a PT-111 subcompact, and it honestly is no more trouble. It is bigger, but in a holster, there's not a huge difference.

For the lady, might I suggest trying something in .380? The frames are particularly small, but it's still a viable defensive caliber when employed properly. As suggested, a snubby .38 is also a great idea, but unless you take the time to practice with it and learn to manage the recoil, it can definitely be a quick turnoff.

My g/f has a S&W .38(with the aforementioned Hogue grips, which do help a lot), and I've got an XD-9, so if you guys want to meet up at PDHSC sometime and test drive, just let me know.

Getting the right gun is simply a matter of trying as many different things as you can, and seeing what works and what doesn't - period. More guns in the hands of trained, responsible people is always a good thing in my opinion, so let me know if there's anything I can do to help you guys out.

2/17/2009 4:59:33 PM

I admit it, I am a gun snob on 1 issue. I don't like how the Glock's point for me. Its a grip angle thing pure and simple. I shoot a 4 inch model 'compact' XD9mm, I also have several Keltec products. If you have small hands, just remember, all XD models OTHER THAN 45 are the same physical size where you grip it. Grip length is the only change from compact to subcompact.

The p11(double stack 9mm KelTec) is a nice small gun. The old p40/p357 model of that gun were and are a bit hard on the hand for the size.
Keltec PF9 if you need small, want 9mm to match whatever you 'big gun' will be, and don't mind a single stack.
Keltec p380/ruger LCP for a single stack tiny 380, or a P32 for a REALY small pistol.

If you get a keltec, get the pocket clip with it. Also remember, they will fluff+buff it FOR you if you mail it in. They service/repair on their dime , or at least have on everything I have seen sent in to them(excluding obvious user triggered damage events).

Double stack major name gun? go pick up a Smith and Wesson M&P. they are tiny in the hand for the capacity.

2/17/2009 5:56:52 PM

Anyone know of any local Benelli dealers? I am looking at getting a Nova (or two).

2/18/2009 10:41:01 PM

Eagle One is a Benelli dealer (used to be at least, I haven't been there in about a year).

2/19/2009 7:54:44 AM

I have to agree with the comments about the J-frame. We picked one up for the wife as her "pocketbook" gun or whatever. She hated shooting it at the range, so she wanted a semi automatic as she got more comfortable, and we picked up the Kahr for her. I might get a set of the Hogue's for it and see if it gets any better as I'm going to be using it more than her now.

2/19/2009 9:27:09 AM

Thanks. You guys have been great with advise. We've rounded up all our friends, and have about 10 pistols to try out soon. We've got someone to go over basics with us, then we're taking a concealed carry. After we get some practice, we'll purchase at that point. If you've got any other tips for beginners, we're really open to suggestions.

2/19/2009 9:32:21 AM

Picking up two Next Generation Arms lower receivers on Friday....


BOOOYAH

2/19/2009 9:36:14 AM

Looking for a pistol cleaning kit (.40) I've looked at Wal-mart but didn't see much. PDHSC didn't have any kits - any suggestions?

Would rather get it somewhere locally so I can get it ASAP

2/19/2009 9:55:29 AM

^I've got two, I can sell you one cheap.
it is the Hopps starter kit.

2/19/2009 10:21:02 AM

Put together your own kit.
Get a stainless or coated pistol rod, a patch pusher, jag, bronze and nylon brushes, Breakfree CLP, bore solvent, and an old T shirt for patches.
Get a $5 tool box from walmart to keep it in.

2/19/2009 4:46:38 PM

if all you have are 40's, just buy a bore snake. I use my 9mm one non stop, same with the 22 one. Once you have one, your rod will only be broken out for 'oh shit' type situations.

2/19/2009 4:57:52 PM