of course the chicken isn't worse...its, for all intents and purposes, fully digestible compared to the rawhide, which is a processed chew. (bully sticks, on the other hand, are simply stretched and dried...go for the vacuum sealed kind, preservatives aren't as much of an issue then)

I feed my dog a completely raw diet based off of the PREY model. Chicken quarters (sometimes the whole chicken), turkey legs and necks (with additional meaty meat), pork ribs and pork butts, beef hearts and whatever other beef I can find reasonably priced, eggs, salmon oil, and organs. the RMBs are what gives the dog a workout...large hunks of meat, even without an edible bone, challenge the dog mentally and give him/her a nice jaw workout.

my pup hasn't chewed any of my stuff since I started her on this diet, in part because it has satisfied her need to chew. she still gets bully sticks as an occasional treat, but the ones I get her (Jones, in my opinion, are the best brand and size for large dogs) are fairly expensive.

you can also tried deer antlers (brand, Antlerz). They don't chip or break apart like weight bearing bones do (also called wreck bones...good way to chip a tooth) and instead wear down slowly. Good source of calcium.

sleepyhead:

as far as chew toys, it just depends on the dog. my pup isn't very thrilled to knaw on a toy...but the most popular I believe will be one of the many different Kongs that are out there. some dogs do well with thinking toys, that they don't chew on per say, but rather are mentally stimulating as they attempt to retrieve the cookie or toy. I'm personally not a fan of the nylabone bones because some dogs can rip off chunks of plastic (and that is certainly not good to ingest) however they work for many dogs. same with those rope toys...some dogs pull the rope apart and can ingest parts of the strings (bad) while others won't. you'll just have to try a few different things, always observing your pup, and see what works

2/14/2008 7:49:10 AM

my dog won't play with those kong toys. she only likes rubber or stuffed things with a squeak in them, or just plain stuffed toys, which she eventually tears up.

my dad always told me that i shouldn't give dogs chicken bones, because they are more likely to splinter and then hurt the dog. we've always given our dog rawhide bones and they've never had a problem with them...

2/14/2008 7:57:14 AM

^your dad is correct if he's talking about *cooked* chicken with bones. any cooked bone becomes brittle, even those smoked bones you see in grocery stores "made for dogs", however raw chicken bones are quite flexible and digestible.

2/14/2008 8:11:53 AM

yep... raw chicken bones are fine, cooked ones splinter and a dog can choke on them very easily..

read up on the whole raw diet if you haven't already... you pretty much can feed them a whole raw chicken if you want

2/14/2008 8:44:29 AM

oh good to know, thanks!

2/14/2008 9:11:28 AM

2/14/2008 9:36:11 AM

thanks JSnail...i need to get him something soon. he'd ripped the soft toy he was playing with for the last few days so i took it away from him so that he didn't eat the cotton.

he found his walking leash today and has chewed up the plastic, ripped the rope and its in tatters now

[Edited on February 14, 2008 at 8:18 PM. Reason : ]

2/14/2008 8:08:13 PM

I know we're kinda hijacking the thread, but, and this sounds silly, you might want to just take your pup to a shop and let him pick out the toy he'd like. Obviously you'll want to weed out some choices first, look for sturdy construction and warnings that the toy might not be meant as a chewy. See what he'll go for...does he like squeakers? grunters? rattles? does he like to think? (puzzle type toys) does he like to "kill" his toys? (if so, look for something with long "appendages" that will flop around)

worst case scenario, if you can't find something, go with a kong and stuff it with something super yummy...peanut butter, cheese, satin balls (just google the recipe), or a cookie, if that's all it takes to motivate him, and let him go to work.

2/14/2008 8:36:56 PM

Quote :

"when they shit, stick their nose in their shit and spank them."

What worked for your parents might not work for everyone.

2/14/2008 8:44:11 PM

Yup, if you want something that'll be REALLY entertaining to the dog get a sheep/pig head. Most people get weirded out by them though.

My dog chipped a tooth on a sterilized bone she yanked from the trash (part of a toy pack, thought it was buried too deep in the trash can for her to get it).

2/15/2008 12:32:52 AM

so i googled up kong...my question is how does the dog get to the centre? does he chew through the rubber i.e. is a kong a one-time use toy?

2/15/2008 7:46:46 AM

got my dog a kong once, filled it with peanut butter and froze it.


after getting as much peanut butter as he could by licking it, the fucker CHEW THRU THE KONG and ate the rest of the peanut butter, then promptly threw it all up about 30 mins later.

my lab is an epic chewer.

2/15/2008 7:54:26 AM

raiden, have you tried the black kong? its for power chewers...supposedly

sleepyhead, lol...they lick the treats out, they don't actually eat the kong (unless apparently they are raiden's pups *grin*). I like to sometimes shove a large cookie in there...then they have to figure out how to get it out...not as easy as just licking out peanut butter. However, frozen peanut butter (or anything else frozen) is a great treat in the summer.

[Edited on February 15, 2008 at 8:11 AM. Reason : ]

2/15/2008 8:09:34 AM

i flipped out last night under the influence this dog probably hates me now... i'm gonna be a horrible parent

[Edited on February 15, 2008 at 8:14 AM. Reason : got caught up in the moment of being strict in front of "mommy"]

2/15/2008 8:14:03 AM

so lately we been putting her in the crate more....last 2 days when i've let her out around this time, she will dook AND take TWO pisses...pretty pleasing...i think shes learning to hold it and release it all at the same time, as opposed to just going once, then coming in and going inside 20 minutes later

2/15/2008 7:25:53 PM

I bought my puppy a puppy kong and she liked it at first but then go frustrated and stopped playing with it.

2/17/2008 12:44:20 PM

we are getting a muzzle soon....for those that think its cruel i'd like to know why you do...not that it will change our decision on getting it...i think shes getting use to being in her cage

2/25/2008 10:19:55 PM

why are you getting a muzzle?

2/25/2008 11:27:27 PM

so we dont hear barking 24-7, and so our neighbors dont hear barking 24-7...basically so it cant bark and or make loud noises

2/25/2008 11:57:24 PM

Well for one it's an inappropriate use of a tool that is meant to prevent biting not barking...obviously. Occluding the mouth from opening prevents the puppy from panting, puppies naturally have higher body temperatures so it is important that they are able to properly cool themselves. If she is unable to do this she can overheat. Similarly, a muzzle isn't intended to be used for long periods of time (this is on the back of EVERY muzzle package). She'll be unable to drink, and it could lead to discomfort and rubbing sores.

I know it is incredibly annoying to listen to a small dog bark, but part of the problem is that dog's innately really enjoy barking, just like some obnoxious people really enjoy running their mouths. It also tends to be a habit formed out of boredom. Maybe all she needs is to be worn out a little more!

It can be an uphill battle at first, but if you are persistent you can control it. Spend a weekend with a spray bottle or a soda can with pennies in it, each and every time she goes to bark squirt her or shake the can to startle her. If you are consistent she will learn quickly!

Here's a link that might help http://www.dogpatch.org/sheltie/barking.html

Taking a shortcut with a muzzle, won't make things easier it can lead to more issues and is certainly not in the best interest of the puppy's welfare.

2/26/2008 1:33:54 AM

So instead of barking you'll hear whining because the unresolved issues that led to the pup's barking will not MAGICALLY DISAPPEAR...you'll have a miserable pup. how cruel. the only time I agree with muzzles are when they are used to prevent bites...at the vet, on walks, or maybe if you have a touchy dog that doesn't like his nails cut. MAYBE. They are NOT meant to be worn for extended periods of time and, yes, they do inhibit the ability to eat and drink.

there is NO shortcut to patience and training. if you didn't want to deal with a puppy then you should have rescued an adult. you would at least have had a better idea of the behaviors to deal with. in fact, maybe you shouldn't have gotten a dog at all.

2/26/2008 6:45:42 AM

i appreciate yalls concern...heres an example...i want to be sleeping now but she is barking and i cant.....if i had to guess shes barking at about 50 barks per minute right now


ok read a little more of yalls post....she rarely drinks from her water bottle on the cage, and whimpering is way less loud

[Edited on February 26, 2008 at 9:03 AM. Reason : .]

2/26/2008 9:02:28 AM

my post on Page 1... "

Quote :

"its doing what a puppy does! if it whines/barks and you give it attention then it will associate making noise with getting someone to give it attention, good OR bad. You have to ignore the noise, then give attention when the pup is silent."

How is the exercising going? And mental stimulation? Dogs need both...its your responsibility to fulfill those needs. And we aren't talking 15 minutes walks.

So basically, the issue is with you and your roommate, not the dog. It takes a LOT of repetition and patience, as I've already stated, to train the dog that barking unnecessarily is NOT allowed. If you falter just once, you've failed your dog.

Try training the dog to bark on command. Give the dog boundaries...barking is ok at *this* time or when I give you *that* command. Barking is not acceptable the rest of the time.

Don't just scream at the dog. Does the dog really know what you are asking it to do? Or, what is it that the dog is trying to get you to understand?

Again, you have to be willing to put forth the effort here. Hopefully you understand that a muzzle is not going to be a fix, as the issue will continue to occur without you addressing the behavioral problem.

2/26/2008 9:23:18 AM

idk...i will admit in the past few days she'll go on like a 30 minute break with no barking every now and then.....but thats because we have been putting her in the cage A LOT and shes getting use to it(hopefully)...sunday she was basically in the cage all day except to use the bathroom, and yesterday she was in for a while as well....maybe that was our problem, that we were not putting her in the cage long enough....

my conspiracy theory is that since "mommy" is way more nice to her than i am that she misses "mommy"....if she is barking and i walk in mommys room and just stare at her...nothing else but stare at her...dont even got to say anything all i do is stare, and she will just sit and look at me...we tried this the other day as a test and i literally stared at her for about 7 minutes and she didnt do anything

i'm still just waiting on the people that live below us(we are on the top floor of a 3 story apt) to come to our door and be like can you please be quiet or something....lately the dog will pee when it comes up to me(sometimes like a full squat and pee, sometimes just some drops)....dont know if thats because its excited to see me or scared or a little of both



oh and something me and mommy are wondering.....can dogs fake going pee? like if she knows i took her out to pee but she doesnt have to, will she learn to fake it to make me happy?

[Edited on February 26, 2008 at 9:41 AM. Reason : .]

2/26/2008 9:37:35 AM

I really hope you're kidding about her being in the cage so long...that's utterly cruel. no wonder she barks all the time. she's bored, has no stimulation, and has no outlet for her energy.

and yes, dogs can "fake" going #1.

I honestly think you should just find her a new home. I'm not trying to be mean, I'm just being honest.

2/26/2008 9:52:20 AM

Quote :

"I honestly think you should just find her a new home. I'm not trying to be mean, I'm just being honest."

Reading this thread really made me wonder why your roommate/you got a dog -- especially a puppy -- in the first place.

2/26/2008 9:57:18 AM

jsnail i dont get how you either a) have a job or b) have a dog...unless you have a job and some kinda pet sitter or something.....you act like you dont put her in the cage at all...i thought you were some cop


stop being such a woman...


-----------


the dog needs to learn that sometimes its gonna be in the cage, and sometimes its gonna get out

[Edited on February 26, 2008 at 10:00 AM. Reason : .]

^cause you can mold a puppy into a good dog but if you get a horrible full grown dog, it will be beyond repair

[Edited on February 26, 2008 at 10:03 AM. Reason : .]

2/26/2008 9:59:47 AM

I see.

2/26/2008 10:07:09 AM

Yeah, crate training is a very useful tool. A lot of people give the "OMG DONT PUT THE DOG IN THE CAGE THATS CRUEL OMG" bullshit, but mainly because they're uneducated. Spend a few minutes reading and report back.

2/26/2008 10:11:58 AM

Yea I'm beginning to agree too, a dog's not like a guinea pig, fun to enjoy when you feel like it and then locked in a cage by itself otherwise.

They are gregarious, they want to be around you. Sticking her in a room, alone might also be half your problem. Put her cage out in the living room where there is stuff going on, there will be stimulation for her, and if she starts on a barking rampage, you can quickly correct her.

Also crates aren't intended as a means for you to confine your dog when you don't want to deal with her. Housebroken means she doesn't "go" in the house, not just her crate. And certainly a stint longer than 5 or 6 hours is too long! How boring for her, she goes from being with her litter to staring at bars all day, what kind of quality of life is that?!!

Honestly, can I ask what kind of enjoyment your roommate gets out of having this dog? Why did she get it in the first place? Would she really be devastated if you gave the puppy away?

You aren't doing what's best for the pup, and it seems that you're only interested in addressing concerns that are of immediate importance to you without considering what's best for the dog.

Relocate her crate, spend more time interacting with her (if you're home, what else do you have to do), let her spend more time out of her crate. And be available to correct her immediately and appropriately when she starts on a barking rampage.

A lot of people mistake Jack Russells for just being an "easy" small dog, but they are extremely high energy and active, they crave opportunities to get out and run, play, exercise. Let her do more of that and a lot of these issues may dissappear!

2/26/2008 10:16:57 AM

HAH! And you can't "mold" a puppy into a good dog if you have no idea what it is you're doing.


People who have no clue and make it up as they go are those that create those dogs you say are "beyond repair."

2/26/2008 10:19:34 AM

i mean dont get me wrong its not like we dont play with her and give her a ton of attn and she sleeps in mommys bed at night....shes just got to learn that sometimes we wont be here and she will have to be in the crate






[Edited on February 26, 2008 at 10:20 AM. Reason : yall are such freaking females!!!]

2/26/2008 10:20:23 AM

^^^^ But surely you must recognize a difference between crate training and simply locking the dog up because you don't want to deal with it.

Crate training is great when done properly.

[Edited on February 26, 2008 at 10:21 AM. Reason : ]

2/26/2008 10:20:49 AM

Agreed... It's a complicated situation when they're puppies with how long to leave them in a cage per day, esp for people who work full time. IMO after they're house trained very well they should be allowed to be free all day everyday (assuming they don't destroy stuff)

[Edited on February 26, 2008 at 10:24 AM. Reason : and even then really its your responsibility to give them something to do other than destroying stuf]

2/26/2008 10:23:32 AM

Absolutely.

I got my puppy when I was in grad school, so I was home all day, every day with the exception of three hour classes three nights a week.

Now she's two years old, housetrained and wonderfully well behaved, and she has no problem hanging out in my apt while I'm gone 8-10 hours a day for work.



I was pretty sure you weren't saying what I thought you were saying, but you just never know in this thread.

2/26/2008 10:25:35 AM

Not that I need to defend myself to you, but...

You know full well that I have a job, and a very time consuming job at that.

Dakota was crate trained as a puppy (would even sleep in the crate, on her own accord, if I left the door open) but now has full reign of my house. If I travel, I CAN bring the crate and she will go on and sleep on her own, but I don't have to use it because she doesn't need it. She gets exercised in the morning and afternoon, has "play dates" throughout the week, and goes on hikes during the weekend, weather permitting.

I have select friends who I trust with her, and they are on standby pretty much all the time if I need someone to take her out for a potty break.

No, she doesn't get fantastic exercise every day, but we make up for it when we can.

She is healthy, active, and friendly.

She does not have any negative behaviors. She does not bark, she does not have SA, she does not potty inside, she does not eat my belongings.

Granted, she was a lovely pup to begin with, but it also took energy on my part to help her become what she is today.

Time consuming to own a dog? Yes. Do you have to make sacrifices? Yes. Is it worth it when you have a polite, healthy, active, happy dog to show for your efforts? Yes!

Dakota is a GSD/border collie mix...two VERY high energy breeds. Believe me. I know what it takes.





[Edited on February 26, 2008 at 10:31 AM. Reason : pic]

2/26/2008 10:30:05 AM

Quote :

"Quote : "I honestly think you should just find her a new home. I'm not trying to be mean, I'm just being honest." Reading this thread really made me wonder why your roommate/you got a dog -- especially a puppy -- in the first place."

2/26/2008 10:58:48 AM

was AKSnoopy at cici's pizza last night?

2/26/2008 11:45:12 AM

putting a muzzle on a dog to prevent it from barking is not nice. Besides, as already said, the dog can still make noise.

Leave the dog in the crate when you are not there. Give her toys and treats to keep her occupied. When you are there, let her out and play with her.

When she barks, ignore her. Don't punish her, hit her or yell at her. She's like a child, she sees that as getting attention, good or bad. Just ignore her until she shuts up.
When she is quiet, give her love and attention.

None of that seems very hard.

2/26/2008 12:32:35 PM

1. ^^Yes I was

2. I think people who aren't reading the whole thread are getting the wrong impression of what DNL is trying to say. If you notice, this thread was created on 1/31. It is now 2/27. It is evident in his posts that the dog IS becoming housetrained.

3. If the dog is barking less, maybe a little more time and patience is a good idea.

4. How do you correct a dog who is barking when it is inside its crate without hitting or yelling (since these are bad ways to punish a dog)? If you take it out, then you are saying it is ok to bark right?

[Edited on February 27, 2008 at 2:41 AM. Reason : #2]

2/27/2008 2:41:15 AM

^correcting it? ignore her when she barks. Eventually, she will get tired and shut up. When she is not barking give her attention.

2/27/2008 5:41:20 PM

Quote :

"4. How do you correct a dog who is barking when it is inside its crate without hitting or yelling (since these are bad ways to punish a dog)? If you take it out, then you are saying it is ok to bark right?"

you can spray it with a water bottle (in the face) and if that doesn't seem to work then put a little pinch of garlic in the water.

but hitting/yelling at the dog is not necessarily a bad way to punish it. some dogs need to be hit because that is the best method for them, particularly unspayed/neutered dominant agressive dogs

2/27/2008 5:48:46 PM

^
really? Obviously you don't know much about dogs. And hitting a dog just because she is not spayed? what? If you are going on the idea that dogs who are not altered are more aggressive (not necessarily true, but whatever), why would you hit an aggressive dog? If you know the dog is aggressive or has behavioral issues, why hit her? It will make her a more aggressive animal. Please don't do that. If it doesn't make her more aggressive it will make her fearful and scared of you, or possibly all humans.

2/27/2008 6:18:20 PM

^^ wow.
I hope to god you don't have a dog

2/27/2008 6:47:20 PM

haha even dog owners are not safe from haters on tww


OMG YOU DONT RAISE IT LIKE I WOULD IT MUST BE WRONG!!!1

2/27/2008 6:47:59 PM

haha

rawr rawr rawr

2/27/2008 7:27:18 PM

haha even dogs are not safe from haters on tww

2/27/2008 7:48:46 PM

Quote :

"haha even dog owners are not safe from haters on tww OMG YOU DONT RAISE IT LIKE I WOULD IT MUST BE WRONG!!!1 "

Drunknloaded, there are many different methods people can use to train a dog. Just like there are different methods for raising a child. There are different ways that can still produce a good, well-behaved dog. However, some methods are just wrong no matter how you word it, and could end up disastrous in that the dog becomes an aggressive or fearful dog.

2/27/2008 8:19:51 PM

Quote :

"i flipped out last night under the influence this dog probably hates me now... i'm gonna be a horrible parent"

dnl, if you ever do find a woman who will let you put your penis in her, do not under any circumstances knock her up. do the world a favor ok






JSnail, dakota is beautiful!

2/27/2008 8:54:31 PM

^agreed about JSnail's dog. My dog's name is Dakota too, and here is one with the same name who rivals her good looks

I also second the advice about dnl not ever having kids.

2/27/2008 11:36:33 PM