5/8/2008 10:48:18 AM

white people arent allowed to talk about race

5/8/2008 10:49:02 AM

now Barack has to say, "yes, but only women will vote for you in the general because you'll be up against McCain" - and then look at her and say "see how stupid that sounded?"

5/8/2008 10:55:55 AM

She's in it to win it!

And is anything she said false? Do the exit polls not show Hill doing much better with poor white voters?

If her statements are not false, it must be a "new low" because they are uncomfortable truths. But ignoring the data for the sake of comfort won't make it go away.

That being said, I don't think her case is all that air tight. Just because poor whites favor her over Obama doesn't mean they won't favor Obama over McCain. And just like you need these voters in the general election, you also need black Democrats too. And my impression is that they would be much less likely to vote for Hillary in the GE if she won under present circumstances (the million dollar question super delegates have to ask themselves is "how much less likely").

Really, I hope this episode makes Democratic leaders re-consider their whole primary process. After bitching about the electoral college giving the Presidency to George Bush, they left the final decision of their close primary races in the hands of a similar body of elites, except they gave their elites even more disgression. Very un-Democratic.

[Edited on May 8, 2008 at 10:58 AM. Reason : ``]

5/8/2008 10:56:14 AM

I hope Hillary quits.

Obama has shown he cannot get the votes Democrats need to win – blue-collar, working class people. He can get effete snobs, he can get wealthy academics, he can get the young, and he can get the black vote, but Democrats do not win with that.

And that's who Hillary was actually getting, so I hope she drops, she's the more dangerous weapon to the republicans.

5/8/2008 10:58:13 AM

^ they're choosing BETWEEN democrats now

In the general, that won't be the case

Do you ever have anything to add that makes any sense?

5/8/2008 11:01:54 AM

So, Obama can pull the young who never vote, blacks who always vote for Democrats anyway, wealthy academics who are few in number and vote for Democrats anyway....

I understand Clinton's point.

5/8/2008 11:01:58 AM

^ x3

lol i thought that sounded familiar

Quote :

""Barack Obama has shown he cannot get the votes Democrats need to win -- blue-collar, working-class people," Limbaugh said. "He can get effete snobs, he can get wealthy academics, he can get the young, and he can get the black vote, but Democrats do not win with that.""

http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/05/07/limbaugh.obama/

[Edited on May 8, 2008 at 11:02 AM. Reason : aha]

5/8/2008 11:02:21 AM

Rat,

Aye. All those demographic groups routinely vote Democratic anyways, including the last two elections they lost. Maybe Obama is hoping to generate huge turn outs in these groups, but I don't know if that will work. I mean, how many non-voters are in those groups left to "turn out" that did not vote in 2004 or 2000? I will have to look at the data, but I don't think "ralleying the base" is going to solve the Dems problems in the fall.

[Edited on May 8, 2008 at 11:05 AM. Reason : ``]

5/8/2008 11:04:07 AM

If you can refute my point, then refute it.

Obama can't get the votes of anybody but the young, the black, and the rich. The evidence to support that claim is widespread and common knowledge.

The only reason you resort to quips and short quotes is because you have no proof or evidence whatsoever to prove that it is wrong

5/8/2008 11:05:43 AM

WOW, Rat just copied from Rush Limbaugh VERBATIM!!!

Marko just called him the fuck out

lol

5/8/2008 11:06:00 AM

Awwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww
shit.



marko swoops in with maximum pwnage.
++3

5/8/2008 11:06:24 AM

i didn't call him out

i just swore i heard it before

5/8/2008 11:06:35 AM

and he has no evidence whatsoever to claim that it is incorrect

5/8/2008 11:07:57 AM

Anyone who thinks in their head "HMMMM, I am not sure how to put this! I think I heard RUSH LIMBAUGH say it best, i'll just find his words, copy them, and use them verbatim" is a huge idiot, btw

5/8/2008 11:08:39 AM

i didn't dispute it, you silly goose

not everyone on here is in a constant battle of one upmanship

[Edited on May 8, 2008 at 11:09 AM. Reason : ^^]

5/8/2008 11:08:44 AM

In an e-mail entitled “The Limbaugh Effect in Indiana = 7 percent,” Obama campaign spokesman Bill Burton wrote: “According to the latest exit polling data, 17 percent of voters in the Indiana primary today said they would vote for John McCain in a Clinton/McCain match-up. Forty-one percent of that number is constituted by people who voted Clinton in the primary but also indicated they will vote for McCain in the general election. That comes out to just under 7 percent of the primary electorate the number that may be attributed to a Limbaugh Effect.”



So you are calling Obama an idiot now terpball? nice. he himself recognized Operation Chaos who was run by Rush. So. hmm..

5/8/2008 11:11:10 AM

Campaign's say the darndest things. I do not believe in the Limbaugh affect since the margins were not the ones that pushed Clinton over the top.

My father is one of the Republicans voting in the Democratic Primary in Indiana, but he voted for Obama. In his mind, if McCain isn't the President then it sure and hell shouldn't be Hillary.

5/8/2008 11:14:50 AM

^^what? what the fuck kind of argument are you trying to form?

Did Obama go find Rush Limbaugh's words, then go speak them as if they were his own? I seriously doubt it, and if he EVER does, yes, he's an idiot and he'll lose my support quicker than your mom loses her panties when I open her bedroom door.

[Edited on May 8, 2008 at 11:19 AM. Reason : ]

5/8/2008 11:15:52 AM

^^ i don't really think operation chaos, did much in the nc/ indiana primaries either

it did however, as the Obama camp recognized publicly, say that Hillary came out ahead in Indiana because of it

i think it's good either way... we get to finally figure out who this unknown candidate is with a little competition for a few more weeks. maybe he'll answer a question or 2 more honestly during those weeks to give people more insight into who he is.

5/8/2008 11:21:15 AM

Even then i don't believe that it caused Hillary to come out ahead. Only 10% of the electorate in Indiana was Republican and only 54% voted for Clinton with 46% voting for Obama. Independents were 23% and voted for Obama 54%. Clinton won with Democratic voters, plain and simple.

5/8/2008 11:26:27 AM

^true, in fact i suspect that in many cases, republicans that dropped their party to be able to vote, a majority of them voted for obama. i believe this to be true in north carolina.

but from a strategist point of view, back to my original point, if i were a democrat my priorities would be winning the general election. it seems to me and countless other sources that the demographics needed for the democrats to win were by far and large the ones that hillary got.

and to make it worse for the democrats (strategically) mccain is a very moderate candidate with many similarities to hillary clinton. i think it's safe to assume that perhaps 15%- 25% of her supporters will vote for john mccain.

5/8/2008 11:31:35 AM

Why do terrorists support Obama?

5/8/2008 11:32:07 AM

Maybe because they are tired of Osama Bin Laden asking them to blow themselves up? Maybe they want to stop fighting? That's just a guess.

5/8/2008 11:33:00 AM

^exactly. they need their lands back so they can re-quip and gather up for some new attacks.

makes sense to me too.

5/8/2008 11:35:03 AM

Quote :

"but from a strategist point of view, back to my original point, if i were a democrat my priorities would be winning the general election. it seems to me and countless other sources that the demographics needed for the democrats to win were by far and large the ones that hillary got."

Clinton rides the traditional democratic base. Blue collar working-class candidates. In instances in other elections, gov., senate, etc. when there is a battle of getting the support of base voters and you see these demographic shifts, 9 times out of 10 the family comes back and is reunited. There is no evidence to suggest other wise. Obama lost democratic voters to another democrat, not to a republican. Sure we have polls claiming Clinton voters will not vote for Obama, but we also had polls back in 1988 at this time of the year showing Dukakis beating George Bush by 17%.

come convention time, if we still see that split, then we can talk.

5/8/2008 11:40:17 AM

^true, we'll have to wait until then to really see the damage done. however it's madness to say that he'll clean house 9/10 in the family after seeing the voting trends and the similarities between hillary clinton and john mccain. in fact mccain is so moderate it wouldn't suprise me if he picked her up as his running mate and she ran as an independant


i know that sounds dumb, but we've seen same strange shit so far in 2008. i think anything is possible at the moment

5/8/2008 11:46:48 AM

I'm thinking if the Democrats can link McCain to Bush more so than he already is, then McCain's appearance of being a moderate will go with the wind.

Over all, this is an election we haven't seen the likes of in the past 40 years.

5/8/2008 11:57:38 AM

yeh, mccains gonna have to come up with a guy who is:

1) economically sound
2) pro war

so he can win over the rest of the republican base, and not just get some hillary supporters, but even swipe some obama voters.

edit: however, as the primaries indicated, obama is gonna need states like ohio and florida (ones hillary won and those are the people that are gonna most likely cross the isle when it comes time to vote)

[Edited on May 8, 2008 at 12:03 PM. Reason : .]

5/8/2008 12:01:31 PM

I don't trust the Florida numbers. That was a beauty contest state in which Obama was still an unknown commodity when the election was held. Ohio wil be tricky, but I think in the end people are going to vote their pocketbook and the war, both of which hurt McCain.

5/8/2008 12:06:01 PM

Rat-- partisan hacks are supposed to rephrase talking points.

Just a pointer.

[Edited on May 8, 2008 at 1:12 PM. Reason : .]

5/8/2008 1:12:04 PM

PartisanHack

5/8/2008 1:12:45 PM

i don't think obama has much of a chance in florida. ohio might be a different story. but if obama competes in some of the newly battleground states (VA, CO, TX, etc), then it might not matter if he gets florida or not.

5/8/2008 1:35:01 PM

Quote :

"Rat-- partisan hacks are supposed to rephrase talking points. Just a pointer. "

^ I think hell will freeze over before he wins texas - that's just what I heard from my friends in Texas though - they may be ill-informed

[Edited on May 8, 2008 at 1:36 PM. Reason : ]

5/8/2008 1:35:15 PM

I only poked my head in this thread for a microsecond to let Rat know that he got

5/8/2008 1:35:36 PM

^^i don't know. that could very well be the case.

5/8/2008 1:37:56 PM

http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/05/09/report-obama-adviser-ousted-after-speaking-with-hamas/

5/9/2008 10:57:06 PM

sounds like the obama campaign made the right choice...even though he was speaking with them for some other place he worked for, the campaign was right to sever ties

5/9/2008 11:02:15 PM

Here's Paul "The Forehead" Begala--Democrat political consultant, CNN commentator, and former advisor to Bill Clinton--"rephrasing" exactly what Rush Limbaugh and subsequently Rat put forth:

Quote :

"We cannot win with eggheads and African-Americans, okay? That's the Dukakis coalition, which carried ten states and gave us four years of the first George Bush."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qvmtbth2YKM

Basically, all of you that disputed Rat's position concerning Obama's limitations can suck eggs. Even the Democrats fucking know it.

[Edited on May 10, 2008 at 6:27 AM. Reason : .]

5/10/2008 6:15:22 AM

I love how you act as if Paul Begala--PAUL BEGALA--is some sort of representative of ANYTHING.

5/10/2008 8:18:59 AM

begala's a big clinton supporter

5/10/2008 10:16:44 AM

Shall we cite certain Republicans on McCain's chances of winning?

5/10/2008 11:08:40 AM

hey, the only reason i said it was because it was true, you can have all your faggot partys about who or where it came from...

the point is that the democrats know it, and if i were one, shit like that would worry me too... oh well.. when you follow a certain candidate like you are his slave then i guess it's expected from you to turn your ears and eyes from danger like the sheep you are.

5/10/2008 11:28:09 AM

^^^^rofl

5/10/2008 11:29:32 AM

5/10/2008 11:30:45 AM

FAGGOT PARTYS!!!1

5/10/2008 1:21:04 PM

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080510/ap_on_el_pr/obama_endorsement;_ylt=AkNlC9A_Lf242vkcTxPuSH2yFz4D

obama in the lead with superdelegates...lets see if clinton gets a few people to come out for her just so she can say she has it one more time before he overtakes her for good

5/10/2008 3:55:25 PM

I have to admit. At this point I find myself completely divided. I can't decide which I'd rather see:

1) Clinton graciously concedes.
2) Clinton refuses to accept defeat and security drags her out of the convention kicking and screaming.

5/10/2008 8:23:35 PM

i like how over %50 of the hillary supporters will be voting for mccain come november

gotta make all you D's lol a lot huh? lol

5/10/2008 8:27:28 PM

its probably only gonna be like 25 percent lol

[Edited on May 10, 2008 at 8:28 PM. Reason : ]

5/10/2008 8:28:41 PM