It's actually better the second time, so I shouldn't have given you nerds such a hard time. It's still not that great though. Everything I said was pretty much how I still feel, but to a lesser degree after seeing it twice...

5/21/2005 12:17:53 PM

So, could the emperor be Anikan's "father".

The Emperor mentioned that there was a dark lord that could create and sustain life from the force. Then, the apprentice (maybe the Emperor himself) killed him after learning all his tricks. We know that Anikan had no father - potentially "conceived" by the force. Maybe that was the Emperor's creation. He seemed to know a ton about Anikan - even about his mother. Seems like if you wanted to make someone who was going to turn out awful angry and not be identified as a force user - you'd make him a slave on a world too distant to have him screened for miticlorians.

Now, flash forward to episode 6. Luke gets lit up like a Christmas tree by the Emperor and his lightening bolts for a sustained amount of time. Now, admittedly, Vader has seen better days and he just lost his hand again, but he shouldn't be near death. Vader dumps the emperor into the pit - and gets a little juice from the lightening at the same time. Now, suddenly, he's near death? Was his life somehow tied to the Emperor's life? That would make sense if the emporer was holding him together by the force since his conception.

5/21/2005 12:24:54 PM

besides the suit, Vader drew from the power of the dark side to sustain his body. At that point he abandoned that power and his body got a whole lot closer to death.

The lightning didn't help.

5/21/2005 12:35:44 PM

Quote :

"So, could the emperor be Anikan's "father". "

Anakin, and no. If it could be anyone it would be the Emperor's former master and even then, there's nothing conclusive either way. The whole idea comes from a grand total of one line in the movie. However, yes, the Emperor was that man's apprentice. He knew a whole bunch about Anakin because Anakin treated him as a father figure and one of his only friends.

Quote :

"Vader dumps the emperor into the pit - and gets a little juice from the lightening at the same time. Now, suddenly, he's near death? Was his life somehow tied to the Emperor's life?"

Go get any electronic device, like say, a life support system. Then, when the life support system is running, take it outside and have it get struck by lightning. Does it still work?

No, because the entire thing is fried. Vader dies because the Emperor's lightning breaks his suit and he'll die without it.

Quote :

"besides the suit, Vader drew from the power of the dark side to sustain his body."

That too.

[Edited on May 21, 2005 at 1:11 PM. Reason : .]

5/21/2005 1:10:54 PM

Quote :

"Anakin, and no. If it could be anyone it would be the Emperor's former master and even then, there's nothing conclusive either way. The whole idea comes from a grand total of one line in the movie. However, yes, the Emperor was that man's apprentice. He knew a whole bunch about Anakin because Anakin treated him as a father figure and one of his only friends."

I disagree. I think it was obvious that Palpatine is Anakin's "father." Palpatine says that Plagarius teachers his apprentice everything he knows about manipulating Midochlorians to create life and then the apprentice kills him. By the start of THE PHANTOM MENACE, Palpatine seems fairly well established as a political figure as well as a Sith Lord. I would guess that he had replaced Plagarius long before then or at least sometime before Shmi Skywalker was impregnated.

5/21/2005 5:29:54 PM

^word

i hated the whole "my son has no father" shit Shmi laid down in the first one
but after hearing that, i was like "you sneaky bastard"

5/21/2005 5:47:54 PM

the emperor being anakin's father would be the dumbest plot twist ever. i prefer not knowing.

5/21/2005 9:26:32 PM

its not that you don't know
its that there is nothing to know

he doesn't have a father

5/21/2005 9:27:37 PM

I always thought that since vader was made largly of machines to keep himself alive that the lighting fucked the circuitry up.

5/21/2005 10:11:55 PM

Isnt a story suppose to solve all running questions... Too many lose ends.

5/21/2005 11:22:34 PM

split up the word anakin

ana
-A prefix in words from the Greek, denoting up, upward, throughout, backward, back, again, anew.
http://www.question.com/dictionary/ana.html

kin
-related by blood
http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=kin


he IS related to a lot of the characters....maybe its old, because i havent studied star wars or anything, but was this naming intentional

5/21/2005 11:37:32 PM

those of you talking about lucas getting better actors

star wars has a tradition of undiscovered actors....if you watch the documentary that came with the trilogy, it talks about how he went to great pains to get unknown actors

5/21/2005 11:59:19 PM

i think the actors are fine, the direction and dialog needs improvement

5/22/2005 12:04:20 AM

Quote :

" it talks about how he went to great pains to get unknown actors"

*coff*revisionist history*coff*

5/22/2005 12:10:30 AM

So I finally saw it tonight. I gotta say, I rather liked it. I can see what some of you have been saying about it:

*Anakin really did turn to the dark side a little too easily, and it just seemed to me that his fear of losing Padme wasn't enough of an ample reason for him to do so. I had always envisioned that he had become corrupted by the amount of power that the dark side would grant him, and that his lust for power would have been his primary motivation. But I also think that Christianson's acting, while okay, didn't really convince me that his fear of losing her was so overwhelming, so that may have something to do with it.

*Speaking of acting, I found it to be pretty good at times, with McGregor's performance easily the best. As I said, Christianson's was alright, but it did feel lacking at times. Portman was good, especially when she confronted Anakin about his turn to the dark side.

*The romance scenes between Anakin and Padme were pretty cheesy, to the point that it was almost unbarable to watch.

*After he dons the suit, Darth Vador's scream is really really weak. I think James Earl Jones could have done much better than that, and that's all I'll say about the matter.

*Even though I could tell what was cgi and what was not, I must say that it did look a lot more smooth and realistic than the last two. Definite improvement in terms of visuals.

*The saber fights were wicked awesome.

*Yoda is a pimp. But you need only to see AotC to witness this.

*R2 is a much bigger pimp than I originally gave him credit for.

Overall, I'd say this movie was on par with ANH. I can agree that ESB may be the best of the original trilogy, but it's really hard for me to actually rank those three because I like them all equally and they're all good in their own ways. But if I had to, ESB, followed by ANH and then RotJ. This movie is about equal to ANH, maybe slightly lower and more on par with RotJ. It's a tough call for me to make, imo. I definitely think it was better than episodes I and II, though.

Oh, and I don't really see the need for the hate from all you haters. This might not have been the greatest movie ever, but it was definitely enjoyable, as well as entertaining. I wouldn't mind watching it again.

[Edited on May 22, 2005 at 1:33 AM. Reason : to all the h8'ers out there]

5/22/2005 1:32:05 AM

Quote :

"i think the actors are fine, the direction and dialog needs improvement"

\

As I said before:

Quote :

"George Lucas: Transforming Good Actors into Bad Actors Since Star Wars Episode I"

The cast is awesome, the dialogue and direction is shit.

5/22/2005 1:43:49 AM

george lucas: good at writing a story, good at doing effects.

He sucks at every other part of story telling.

5/22/2005 1:47:25 AM

5/22/2005 1:55:03 AM

I forgot to mention this, and I don't know if it's already been covered, but one thing still bothers me. Palpatine claimed that his mastery over the dark side granted him the power to resurrect the dead, but he made it sound like this was impossible when he told Vader that Padme had been killed. Did Palpatine like to Anakin, then? Or did I not hear things correctly and that he could only prevent death? If Palpatine could really bring Padme back from the dead, then I'd say Vader didn't really have a whole lot to worry about.

5/22/2005 8:13:18 AM

^ Didn't he tell Anakin at the space opera that his master knew all of the dark force things, but then when Anakin actially asked him about it, he just said that they'd try to figure it out? As though his former master never really told him?

I'm not sure. I just seem to remember Palpatine telling Anakin that they'd have to figure it out, so he didn't really know afterall.

5/22/2005 8:27:18 AM

^^ and ^

Yeah, I keep thinking that the whole "I can help you prolong life" deal was just a lie created by Palpatine. Part of the reason Anakin succumbs to Palpatine so easily is that he WANTS to believe Palpatine--and Palpatine knows this. Palpatine tells him exactly what he wants to hear: "You should be a master", "The Jedi are holding you back because you're so powerful", "The Dark Side can save Padme", etc.

Quote :

"*Anakin really did turn to the dark side a little too easily, and it just seemed to me that his fear of losing Padme wasn't enough of an ample reason for him to do so. I had always envisioned that he had become corrupted by the amount of power that the dark side would grant him, and that his lust for power would have been his primary motivation. But I also think that Christianson's acting, while okay, didn't really convince me that his fear of losing her was so overwhelming, so that may have something to do with it."

I think another part of it (and it really didn't play out as well) is that Anakin is disillusioned with the Jedi, particularly Mace Windu, who even back in Episode I doesn't want Anakin to be trained. He's even more condescending to Anakin in Episode III. I think that's part of the reason that when faced with the choice between Windu or Palpatine (a la Episode VI), he chooses to save Palpatine because Palpatine has always been his buddy throughout the past 10 years.

[Edited on May 22, 2005 at 8:53 AM. Reason : .]

5/22/2005 8:48:59 AM

I dunno. I think Palpatine can legitimately prolong life. Vader was pretty much dead (if not completely) when Palpatine brings him back. Plus he seems to have lived longer than he probably should have himself.


I think with Padme, it was either just too late to do anything or bringing her back didn't serve any purpose to him.




[Edited on May 22, 2005 at 9:06 AM. Reason : ...]

5/22/2005 9:05:54 AM

I thought it was just machines though that keep him alive. He has the stormtroopers bring by a medical unit, and then the machinery of his suit keeps him alive indefinitely.

Obviously with Padme, I agree. It would be very counter-productive to Palpatine's plan to Padme hanging around, because Anakin's kids would definitely be a threat to him.

[Edited on May 22, 2005 at 9:16 AM. Reason : .]

5/22/2005 9:15:04 AM

remember tho, deception is a way of the dark side... so anything Palpy says could theoritcally be a lie. yes it would suck to have him say all that shit and just confuse us more, but hey crazier shit has happened.

5/22/2005 9:20:43 AM

Why did Palpatine tell Anakin that he killed Padme in his anger? Since he found out about Luke eventually, Vader has to know the Emporer lied.

5/22/2005 9:33:22 AM

Well to be fair, he only said that Padme was killed. He never actually said that the baby was also killed.

Then again, Anakin did not "kill" Padme either, rather she just died from a loss of will to live.

5/22/2005 9:34:50 AM

^^

I think that the Jedi let it slip that that's how she died, raher than in childbirth. (And from "a certain point of view", one could easily say that Anakin killed her) That way, if Vader realized that she died in childbirth, he would be searching for Luke and Leia. I guess that also explains why she still has that bulge in her stomach during the funeral. They want to keep up the illusion that the children also died.

[Edited on May 22, 2005 at 10:00 AM. Reason : .]

5/22/2005 10:00:02 AM

Yeah, come to think of it, Padme's parents wouldn't appreciate their grandchildren being taken away from them.

5/22/2005 10:55:03 AM

Quote :

"it talks about how he went to great pains to get unknown actors"

If he's referring to Peter Mayhew, David Prowse, Anthony Daniels, and Kenny Baker (Chewbacca, Darth Vader, C3PO, and R2D2), then yes I'd say he got unknowns--but the rest of the "headline" cast? If they're unknowns, then I'm the friggin' Pope,

5/22/2005 11:27:17 AM

i still say its revisionist history

he couldn't afford anyone big, except for S. Alec Guinness

5/22/2005 11:58:08 AM

was anyone at the 12:01 showing of episode I in wilson back when it came out

dave prowse watched it there

5/22/2005 12:01:15 PM

hey, im just going off of what i heard him say in that documentary

5/22/2005 2:09:27 PM

One question, how does Vader know that Luke is his son? I mean Palpatine didn't tell him. All he said was that Padme dies.

5/22/2005 2:29:53 PM

the emperor tells him in ESB

5/22/2005 2:33:17 PM

Palpatine actually tells him in ESB. (Well, at least in the DVD version, anyway.) Regardless, you would think that Imperial intelligence would figure out who he was and where he was from after he destroyed the Death Star. He would've instantly become Public Enemy #1.

5/22/2005 2:34:44 PM

On the re-release of the DVD it actually explains this a little better (might want to watch it again). Go to the Empire Strikes Back and look at the scene where Vader contacts the Emperor.

I think they edited this scene for two purposes:

1.) They use the same Emperor actor, so it looks the same as the other movies (makes sense. Not a "Greedo shooting first"-type change at all).

2.) In this new scene, The Emperor says "We have a new enemy--the young Rebel who destroyed the Death Star. I have no doubt that this boy is the offspring of Anakin Skywalker". Vader responds, "How is that possible?". Palpatine then says "Search your feelings, you know this to be true".

I think that the Emperor must have learned that someone named Luke Skywalker destroyed the Death Star, found out how old he was, realized that he rescued Princess Leia with the help of Obi-Wan Kenobi, and started putting two and two together.

5/22/2005 2:35:22 PM

Quote :

"was anyone at the 12:01 showing of episode I in wilson back when it came out dave prowse watched it there"

holla

Quote :

"Regardless, you would think that Imperial intelligence would figure out who he was and where he was from after he destroyed the Death Star. He would've instantly become Public Enemy #1. "

nah, they probably just used the attack to invade iraq

5/22/2005 2:36:58 PM

all i know is before i watched ep III i supported the war in iraq. now im sure as hell not going to elect bush again.

[Edited on May 22, 2005 at 3:41 PM. Reason : -]

5/22/2005 3:41:18 PM

Does it matter? Short of the country entering another major war (or perhaps any war in general), Bush isn't allowed to run for office again. Or is it just that you can only serve two consecutive terms, but after the next term you can run again?

5/22/2005 4:03:25 PM

I just watched it a second time and enjoyed it more than the first. The flaws are still there, but I can appreciate the movie's numerous good points over the bad ones.

5/22/2005 4:03:37 PM

^^ you missed the sarcasm

5/22/2005 4:23:15 PM

Quote :

" I disagree. I think it was obvious that Palpatine is Anakin's "father." Palpatine says that Plagarius teachers his apprentice everything he knows about manipulating Midochlorians to create life and then the apprentice kills him. By the start of THE PHANTOM MENACE, Palpatine seems fairly well established as a political figure as well as a Sith Lord. I would guess that he had replaced Plagarius long before then or at least sometime before Shmi Skywalker was impregnated. "

you say its obvious then you go to back up your claim with inferences and speculations. NOt entirely obvious i would say

5/22/2005 4:34:31 PM

Quote :

" I disagree. I think it was obvious that Palpatine is Anakin's "father.""

hmmm I never made that assumption (nor did anyone I know) or even thought of that connection...how could you say it's "obvious"??

5/22/2005 4:36:52 PM

it might be hinted at but it's definitely not obvious.

it's an interesting connection, however--it could explain anakin's virgin birth

5/22/2005 4:38:08 PM

hes just jesus

5/22/2005 4:45:49 PM

I won't say it's obvious that Palpatine is certainly Anakin's father, but it's certainly hinted at that he might be.

I got chills when me mentioned that this Darth Plageus could influence the midichlorians to create life and looked at Anakin with a bit of a smile. But the way he somewhat downplayed it made me think I was just imagining things or possibly that Palpatine was once again lying to Anakin.

5/22/2005 5:30:33 PM

did anyone else notice the millenium falcon at the beginning of the movie when they landed?

5/22/2005 6:39:28 PM

^nope, but when I go see the movie agian I'll have to look for that

5/22/2005 6:50:58 PM

You're not seriously arguing this shit are you

5/22/2005 7:11:38 PM

I also definitely enjoyed it much more the second time around, largely due to the fact that I had better seats and could see everything in the periphery. For instance:

- George Lucas can be seen standing beside the entrance to Palpatine's box seats at the "opera house." (Left side.)
- The Falcon (or at least a YT-1300, anyway) can be clearly seen landing at the Senate building when the shuttle bus carrying Anakin, Obi-Wan, and Palpatine returns from the crash site. (Right side.)
- I could be mistaken, but I think the pilot of the Tantive IV was Jeremy Bulloch, who originally played Boba Fett. (Left side.)

Something I found more interesting this time around was when anakin asks "What have I done?" And Palpatine answers "You're fulfilling your destiny." Doesn't it seem a interesting that Palpatine reveals how Darth Plagueis was capable of influencing midichlorians to create life? I think it stands to reason that Plagueis had the notion to create the ultimate Sith lord, and thus set out to create Anakin. True to form, Palpatine betrayed him and took over, and was able to manipulate everything in such a way that Anakin would eventually fall into his lap. Palpatine's line "We shall be watching your career with great interest" at the end of TPM seems to reinforce this.

Hmmm... maybe.

5/22/2005 8:05:19 PM