Deng plus 29 is pretty awful value for the 2nd overall pick.

If that gets offered, Jordan jumps at it.

6/25/2012 1:39:04 PM

Considering that Charlotte will just go with Barnes, who IMO is a poor man's Deng, it might be a better scenario to just take that deal.

6/25/2012 1:49:42 PM

If it comes down to that shitty scenario, I'd take Barnes at 2 over Deng for 2. Both have good athleticism and can shoot it. Both are high-character guys. But one is 20 and the other is 27



[Edited on June 25, 2012 at 2:09 PM. Reason : Deng is much more versatile though ... much better defensively too]

6/25/2012 2:04:44 PM

Deng's got two more years at 27 mil

No how no way

6/25/2012 2:10:22 PM

keep coming up with funky ass lyrics like

every-single-day!

6/25/2012 2:11:32 PM

Dengs body is breaking down and he's coming off a really down year, we want no part of him for the #2.

Barnes is nothing but a name at this point. Someone will be dumb enough to take him but after two unproductive seasons I sure as hell hope it isn't us. Cho might as well throw that fancy Microsoft program away if that's the case, we can just let Jordan pick someone if we are hell bent on ending up with a bust.


Choosing between Deng and Barnes just makes me shudder when there are guys like beal and Mkg available

6/25/2012 2:13:36 PM

Barnes was unproductive based on expectations, but he wasn't terrible. Averaging 17+ points on a team with lots of offensive options isn't bad. No one should be declared a first team All American before they play a college game.

His biggest problem is that he sucked really, really bad when UNC needed him to be at his best.

6/25/2012 2:18:57 PM

The write up on him that I copy and pasted says it all. The guy is a guaranteed bust in the nba

6/25/2012 2:21:25 PM

What is a bust really? It all depends on expectations. Barnes will never be a superstar, may not even be a star. But I think he has a legit shot to be an 18-20 PPG guy that plays adequate D and rebounds his position. Is that a bust? He's not going to be Marvin Williams.

6/25/2012 2:26:10 PM

Steve Nash 'open to everything'

http://espn.go.com/new-york/nba/story/_/id/8094469/nba-free-agency-steve-nash-says-open-everything


In all seriousness, Black Falcon does not seem to have an iota of mental toughness. You never know, though. At this point its really not a big deal for Charlotte, we just need ability.

6/25/2012 2:31:42 PM

Marvin played great this year, I'd take him in a heartbeat over Barnes.

6/25/2012 3:46:03 PM

Marvin is Barnes

6/25/2012 3:58:52 PM

Except he can play

6/25/2012 4:04:19 PM

you don't think Barnes could average Marvin's All-Star caliber numbers of 10 and 5 a night?

6/25/2012 4:06:53 PM

if the Bobcats draft Barnes I will just lol. and also root for them to never win a game again.

6/25/2012 4:10:52 PM

^^^ Williams got drafted so high because of potential, similarly to how McAdoo would probably go top 8 this year. He only had a limited tape so scouts couldn't dissect and break down his game the same way they could Barnes. The problem with both is they don't have an elite skill. They're average to above average at everything, but in the NBA you typically need to be dominant in one area to succeed, be it shooting, rebounding, defense, etc. Neither of them are really elite at anything.

^^ Williams has probably reached his ceiling at 26. Had he played on a team with a sound management structure and without five other players at his position, he'd probably have improved more at this point. But I don't see him getting markedly better at this point. In fact, his ceiling as a player is probably only slightly above Barnes' floor.

^ I need you to rent a room at the Embassy Suites at South Tryon. You'll get spacious accommodations, a full kitchenette, and free HBO. Approximately 45 minutes after you arrive, three large black men will appear at your door. You'd be wise to open the door; otherwise they'll find their own way in. They'll give you a breakdown of what is going to happen next, but I'll give you a high level overview here so you can prepare yourself. They're going to ask you to remove all of your clothes and lay face down on the bed. Two of them will disrobe as well, with the third staying outside to serve as lookout. They'll open a briefcase, the contents of which you'll be unable to see given your face down position. Shortly thereafter, you'll feel a soft tingling sensation; this is likely CVS brand warming liquid. Consider yourself lucky they take some precautions. Next you'll feel something like metallic clamps that almost resemble salad tongs. These are put in place to keep your asshole as dilated as possible throughout the process.

The first gentleman will take an industrial strength cheese grater and begin to slowly grind away on the actual flesh of your asshole. What I mean by that is he will literally be scraping your asshole off your body. You will no longer have an asshole that can open and close; the opening will simply be the tail end of your rectum. This will take anywhere from 15-30 minutes, depending on how hirsute the area is. I imagine this will be unpleasant for you, but nothing compared for what's to come .

When this process is finished, your asshole, I'm sorry we really can't call it that anymore. Your 'anal flap' will resemble the opening to a well worn coin purse. Not wanting to run the risk of infection, the second gentleman will cauterize the wound with a small blowtorch, which he'll retrieve from the briefcase. The pain will be excruciating. What remains will be two relatively in tact cheeks with a gaping maw in the middle, akin to a Sarlacc minus the teeth. You might want to close your eyes at this point, because it only gets worse from here.

Remember how the two gentlemen took their clothes off earlier? There was a reason for that. Whereas earlier your in tact asshole would have struggled to take one black cock, the festering abyss where your asshole used to be can now comfortably take three. The lookout re-enters the room, putting the "Do not disturb" sign on the outside, and disrobes as well. You won't be able to see this given your position, but rest assured there's well over two feet of cock between the three of them. They talk amongst themselves a bit, trying to determine the best way to all penetrate you at once. Eventually they decide on one of them serving as the anchor and the other two coming from 45 degree angles on the side.

The first gentleman, the one who seared off your asshole like fat on a filet, climbs on top of you so his stomach is pressed into your back. You think he's entering you, but you can't really be sure until he's several inches in, as the nerves near your opening are all either numb or dead. He begins to thrust, slowly as first, but gradually building into a rhythmic tempo. His colleagues take their place on either side and make the plunge as well. Your colon begins to contract, unaccustomed to this buffeting of force and flesh. You scream. They laugh.

This goes on for a good ninety minutes. They take their time, alternating positions, cracking jokes, even live tweeting the experience. Finally, just when you think you can't possibly take another minute, they simultaneously ejaculate deep inside you, so deep that your rectal walls are pierced and the semen goes straight into your bloodstream. They slowly unmount and dress, laughing all the while, while you lay there motionless, barely breathing, hot white nut bubbling out of you like a Yellowstone Geyser. Don't worry though, you'll live. That is, at least until the HIV virus coursing through all three of them gets a hold of you, too. And we'll draft Barnes, and you can lol.

6/25/2012 5:03:39 PM

Marvin played at a high (almost elite) level this year. Comparing him to Barnes is just laughable. Barnes will never approach .20 wp/48 I can assure you.

I agree Marvin has probably reached his ceiling, but his ceiling is a great place to be.

Barnes on the other hand will likely never be above .10. The guy just doesn't do anything well. The guys who don't perform in college almost never do well in the pros, and now that his size advantage is mitigated his athletic limitations will completely expose him in the nba.

As a late first rounder he's worth a flyer, but as a top 5 pick he's a guaranteed bust. Not quite as guaranteed as the three most guaranteed busts (rivers, Teague, and drummond) but close. Taking Barnes top 5 is similar to taking Perry Jones top 20. You know the guy sucks, you're just hoping the media gives you a free pass for taking a big name instead of risking it on a smaller name guy who might be able to play

[Edited on June 25, 2012 at 5:16 PM. Reason : a]

6/25/2012 5:09:11 PM

^^ what was the point of that?

6/25/2012 5:46:59 PM

Another Deng rumor going around is Deng to GS for the 7th pick

6/25/2012 7:48:48 PM

^^^ Agree to disagree. I don't want to sound like I'm endorsing Charlotte picking him, but I can't see him being someone who doesn't contribute. You're basically lumping him in with Adam Morrison and Jonathan Bender. He's going to have a 10 year career in the league. Whether that comes as a scrub or an all star is up for debate. But when I think 'bust' I think of someone who sucks unequivocally. If Barnes turns out to be a JAG, I wouldn't be surprised, but I think his floor is still a rotation guy.

^^ Whats the point of anything anyone posts in this godforsaken corner of the internet?

^ Makes sense. They need a versatile 3 and the draft really drops off after #6, unless the recent Waiters boner is legit.



[Edited on June 25, 2012 at 7:50 PM. Reason : x]

6/25/2012 7:49:27 PM

Waiters will be a stud. Great steal rate.

6/25/2012 9:35:05 PM

Barnes can be a 11-12 ppg 5-6 rebound rotation guy pretty easily at the next level. He's got a good shot, and is athletic enough to play at the next level. Not enough to dominate at the next level, but in the right system he'll be a decent guy for your rotation. The problem with Charlotte getting him is that they need someone that is THE guy. Barnes simply isn't that kind of player at the next level.

The way I see it, you pretty much have like 3 options if you're Charlotte.
1 - Draft Robinson at 2.
2 - Trade with Cleveland so they can get Beal, while you end up with either MKG or Robinson at 4, and someone like Terrance Jones/Fab Melo/Quincy Miller at 24
3 - Find a suitor that is willing to trade an established young player who can be a part of your future. I'd throw in Henderson or Augustin if it gets the right player.

6/26/2012 12:18:07 AM

At least Robinson is showing some moxie shit talking Davis so much.

6/26/2012 12:35:30 AM

Waiters is a guaranteed bust, not even debatable

6/26/2012 12:42:40 AM

Look Barnes is going to be TERRIBLE that I can assure you. He doesn't pass anyone's test. I would be SHOCKED if we took him #2 we've installed computing systems to assist us and they aren't dumb enough to be tricked by Barnes like you guys are.

6/26/2012 2:35:25 AM

If he hasn't passed anyone's test, why is Barnes going to be a top 6 pick whether Charlotte takes him or not? (can't blame it on MJ for being stupid, he's not the only one that wants him)

6/26/2012 8:29:06 AM

He's a 6'8 SF with a great shot, good-to-great athleticism, and high character. I don't want Barnes, but saying he'll never contribute in the NBA is ridiculous.

His biggest problem is that he can't create shots -- or at least good shot -- for himself. That's why Marshall getting hurt in the NCAA tourney made him look so bad. The Bobcats don't have a PG that can get easy shots for others, so taking Barnes at 2 wouldn't be wise.

I'm still thinking Robinson is the pick; the Bobcats desperately need help on the boards and to get tougher overall, and he gives you both. I'm just hoping they get him at 4 and not 2 ... there's a lot less pressure there.

6/26/2012 9:47:24 AM

http://espn.go.com/nba/draft2012/story/_/id/8095532/2012-nba-draft-charlotte-bobcats-considering-trading-no-2-pick

6/26/2012 9:52:57 AM

Barnes to me is like brandon rush to me.

6/26/2012 10:26:13 AM

Quote :

"I would be SHOCKED if we took him #2"

you would be shocked if the worst personnel man in the history of the NBA (jordan) made a bad draft pick?

6/26/2012 12:22:25 PM

Quote :

"His biggest problem is that he can't create shots -- or at least good shot -- for himself."

that's a pretty glaring problem.

6/26/2012 12:39:25 PM

I'd love it if we got brandon rush, he had a pretty nice season. Guy can steal, block, rebound, shoot 3's. All the stuff Barnes can't do

6/26/2012 12:41:28 PM

robinson > barnes. its not close imo robinson is a complete player. if barnes is not hitting his shots his production goes to shit. robinson can play inside, outside, and is a dramatically better defender and shot blocker than barnes

6/26/2012 2:05:57 PM

Despite his length and freaky quickness, Robinson is actually a pretty mediocre shotblocker. No idea why. Much better than Barnes though.

(And for the record, I'm hoping Robinson is the pick)

6/26/2012 2:11:47 PM

I dont know why everybody is so sold on Thomas Robinson being any good. He couldnt get minutes ahead of the Morris brothers at Kansas and they have been pretty shitty in the NBA. I understand he was younger, but if he is being considered for the #2 pick in what is being called a deep draft, he should be good enough to get playing time his freshman and sophomore years.

Quote :

"robinson can play inside, outside, and is a dramatically better defender and shot blocker than barnes"

what the fuck are you talking about, they dont play the same position, Robinson cannot play outside, and Robinson is not a shot blocker at all.

[Edited on June 26, 2012 at 2:18 PM. Reason : ]

6/26/2012 2:15:10 PM

He had 18 points and 17 rebounds in the national championship game against a bunch of other lottery picks

6/26/2012 2:18:37 PM

He is good, I just dont think he is #2 pick good. I see his ceiling being 10-12 pts and 7-8 rebounds a game for his career. I just dont see how if you are the second best NBA prospect in 2012, how you couldnt sniff the court for a college team in 2010-2011.

6/26/2012 2:25:20 PM

Quote :

"what the fuck are you talking about, they dont play the same position, Robinson cannot play outside, and Robinson is not a shot blocker at all."

im just saying hes a much better shot blocker as well as on ball defender in comparison to barnes. he also was the nations second leading rebounder and has a 7'3 wingspan.

its just my opinion that i would rather the bobcats take robinson at 2 over harrison barnes =/

6/26/2012 2:38:51 PM

Quote :

"he should be good enough to get playing time his freshman and sophomore years."

How dare he got better, that bastard.

Markieff Morris averaged 7.4 ppg and 4.4 rpg in his rookie year and he's already a bust.

Tell us less please.

6/26/2012 2:39:01 PM

^^ you are comparing a wing player to a post player. Of course TR will be a "better" shot blocker, but by no means at all is he a good shot blocker. And you cant compare the on ball defending skills. TR will guard the post better and HB will guard the perimeter better. You cant compare the two of them in these ways.

I agree that given a choice between the two, I would take TR, but I think they shouldnt take either of them.

^Yes he can get better, but the point I was making is that he didnt have the skill to get on the court against mediocre NBA talent (Morris brothers and Cole Aldrich) so how all of a sudden is he now the second best NBA prospect in the draft?

Markieff Morris is a terrible defender with decent(at best) offensive skills. He is a decent role player. Are you telling me that TR can do much better than this? The Bobcats dont need a role player at the #2 pick, they need somebody that can make a difference.

6/26/2012 3:17:45 PM

yeah you're right, i shouldnt have made that comparison they do play different positions.

but i dont know about your suggestion that robinson cannot be a #2 prospect due to his lack of PT as an underclassman. the morris brothers were pretty darn productive for KU as starters, the fact that he did not supplant them in the depth chart does not mean robinson didnt have the talent, it just means that Coach Self chose to start the morris twins because they were farther along in their development. pre-2011 draft i dont think robinson was necessarily the best player on that team =/

2010-2011 averages
Marcus Morris 28.3mpg 17.2ppg 7.6rpg .570FG% (.607 points/minute played .269 RPM)
Markieff Morris 24.4mpg 13.6ppg 8.3rpg .589FG% (.557 PPM .340 RPM)
Thomas Robinson 14.6mpg 7.6ppg 6.4rpg .601FG% (.520 PPM .438 RPM)

if you translate this to player efficiency, im sure the statistics are pretty comparable. don't feel that his inability to start as an underclassman automatically drops his potential, this happens throughout college esp with the college basketball powerhouses

6/26/2012 3:41:20 PM

Look Harrison Barnes despite already having an NBA body couldn't do shit in college. He didn't score very efficiently, he couldn't get steals, blocks... and he wasn't that good of a rebounder.

More importantly, he couldn't guard anybody.

We see guys like this every year. Guys who just barely get by as productive players in college because they have an advantage in size/athleticism over Engin Atsur and Scott Wood.

Then they go to the NBA and they get swallowed. He is just going to stand around the 3 point line and brick jumpers. He'll turn it over if he even thinks about putting the ball on the floor. He won't be able to guard anyone but the Matt Carroll's of the world.

Harrison Barnes will start 2-4 years for the shitty 20-28 win team that's unlucky enough to draft him. Then most likely he'll either find a nice cozy spot on someone's bench or he'll continue starting and toiling away on some nothing team that can't figure out he's not any good.

The bottom line is the guy will not be a good NBA player barring some miracle revelation that never happened in two full seasons at UNC while surrounded by elite talent.


Robinson on the other hand is a nice safe pick. No, he's probably not the next Paul Millsap. He's definitely not the next Kevin Garnett. But he's almost certain to be better than Brandon Bass or a player in decline like Elton Brand/Carlos Boozer. He gives us a legitimate NBA starting PF. He averaged like 14 rebounds in the Big 12 and rebounding was our biggest weakness last year. If you put Biyombo/Robinson on the floor at the same time you can keep scrubs like Mullens/Diop off the court and put yourself in position to win a few games.

Sure, we'd ALL rather have Beal, but it's quite a bit easier to find a decent, cheap option at SG than at PF. It's easy to forget we already have Reggie Williams who played at a .096 level over the last 23 games of the season after overcoming an injury. Gerald Henderson played at a .05 level last year despite having nagging injuries all season and playing a grueling condensed schedule.

Mullens and Tyrus both played at -.08 last year, so replacing their minutes with a positive guy like Robinson will go a long way to making us a better team immediately. Diop and Diaw (in Cha) were both negative too last year.

Picking Robinson makes a lot of sense, though if it were up to me I'd go for Beal #1 (with MKG as #2 option) because they both have star potential.

[Edited on June 26, 2012 at 4:20 PM. Reason : a]

6/26/2012 4:12:06 PM

^ agree wholeheartedly with this

do you not feel that robinson has the same level of star potential? (i love MKG for our pick as well, never really watched a lot of beal so i can't say anything there)

i think henderson played very well through the first part of the season before injury, and that he can be a viable starting SG. he was hitting his midrange jumpers, slashing hard with highlight dunks, also getting to the line a fair amount where he is pretty efficient. only reason i personally would take TR at 2 is we probably have a greater need there.

6/26/2012 4:35:06 PM

6/26/2012 5:34:13 PM

Honestly I would take zeller over anyone else from unc.

Especially since flopping is in vogue in the NBA currently.

But seriously, I bet he has the best career of any of them.

6/26/2012 6:30:49 PM

Yeah, 7 footers with coordination are fairly uncommon. Zeller will be a nice 12 and 7 center for a decade or so.

Barnes will probably have a decent career, but will be considered a bust if he goes top 5. Henson has zero offensive skills and will be a nice rotation player for someone.

6/26/2012 6:44:56 PM

^^^^ I think Thomas Robinson will definitely be viewed by casual fans as a bigger "star" than MKG, especially early on (he's 21 and MKG is only 18). He'll have more points and rebounds for sure early on and likely even throughout his career.

However, MKG has potential to be a super efficient SF that's great at creating net possessions (steals + rebounds - turnovers). SF is one of the toughest positions in the NBA to fill and their points and rebound stats are typically lower than the average PF. That's what makes a stud SF like Lebron so valuable (and to a slightly lesser extent the Kevin Durant, Paul Pierce, Andre Iguodala, Josh Smith, and Gerald Wallace types).

Ultimately, I love MKG's potential but I think Robinson is a safe pick with definite upside. I don't think he's the #2 player in the class when it's all said and done, but I'd be really surprised if he wasn't top ~10. He's kinda like the Drew Gooden, Emeka Okafor, or Evan Turner of this draft. A solid player but I wouldn't marry a fat girl in exchange for 10,000 of their rookie cards. Most importantly given Jordan's illustrious track record of draft selections he's not this year's Adam Morrison, Wesley Johnson, or Marcus Fizer.

[Edited on June 26, 2012 at 6:48 PM. Reason : a]

6/26/2012 6:47:55 PM

^^^ Based on the eye test Zeller seems like a solid pick but the list is long and full of 7'0 white centers who have flopped in the NBA.

Their size advantage in college gets nullified immediately in the NBA and if they don't have the athleticism to compete even their elite skillset won't translate that well.

The formula doesn't like Zeller very much. I'm not saying he's the next Rafael Araujo, but he's probably a lot closer to a decent backup big man than an impact player. I'd only take Zeller outside the top 15 and if I had a legitimate need for a big man. Otherwise, I'd rather have a guy with more upside like John Henson.

6/26/2012 6:53:16 PM

What upside? Henson still has no offensive skills. He will get beat up playing defense.

I don't think zeller will be a star, I don't think anybody does. I don't think he should be a top five pick. But once you get around 10 or so, I think teams should consider him. He's a seven footer with a good jump shot, can finishwith either hand and is an able defender.

Barnes looks like an NBA player, but that is about it. I think Marshall could be successful in the right system, but I don't t think he'll ever be even an average scoring pg with that slow releasing set shot.

But anyways, when the hornets draft barnes I will laugh my ass off.

6/26/2012 7:05:35 PM

Good thing the Hornets are in New Orleans and we are discussing Charlotte Bobcats in here.

6/26/2012 7:27:04 PM