You should still pay it in full. You have a very good chance of getting your money back afterwards. Even if you can't live there you should still pay them. But like I said before, if you don't pay it all they can screw you over really badly. They don't care if you were able to "break your lease" legally or not they can still get you and probably will. To avoid this entirely, pay them, yes it's "not fair", but you have to do it. Afterwards you can get your money back pretty easily. ]
6/27/2011 7:05:21 PM
I am saying I refuse to pay them if I am not required by law. There is no point in giving them money if I am told they have to let me leave. I'm not sure if that's what will happen, but that's the reason I am not even going to really make a decision until after tomorrow morning.Jesus, the problem right now is not the question of rent - my rent isn't even flippin due until July 5th. I'm not going to do anything to ruin my credit, but I'm not going to jump the gun and give them all that rent right away when there is no need to as of yet.
6/27/2011 7:19:50 PM
What do the statutes in Alabama say about withholding rent?
6/27/2011 7:28:06 PM
Basically that you can only do it under certain circumstances, and even then it's very risky -- thus the reason why I'm not doing that and have no plans of doing so.I am only saying that I will not pay the rest of my lease if and only if I am told tomorrow (and the landlord is told) that I am able to leave this place. I don't even know what they're going to say to me or the property management company so I'll make whatever decision I need to make tomorrowThe most frustrating thing about all this legal research I've been doing is I can't find anything that discusses what will happened to a landlord if they tell you they fixed something but in reality, did not. I can only find cases where they fixed something and did a poor job of it, therefore it broke again right after or something.[Edited on June 27, 2011 at 7:36 PM. Reason : .]
6/27/2011 7:33:00 PM
Well that would be fraud, but unless you have written correspondence with them it'll just become a game of he said, she said in court. If you do have written documentation of everything you have a very strong case and could probably get a decent settlement out of them.
6/27/2011 7:42:26 PM
also i think the burden of proof would be on you to prove that they didn't in fact fix anything. i think fraud sounds about right but without before & after pics of everything they "fixed" it could be hard to prove.perhaps the bathroom windowsill issue with the mold & how the manager lady reacted would be something? sort of setting the standard?the whole thing sucks but i think your A #1 Golden move was calling the gas guy in, that kind of illustrated how serious all this is. good move on that, vs just calling the leasing office.good luck!
6/27/2011 7:59:13 PM
Well that makes me feel better... cause guess what? I have a witness that the furnace issue in October was "fixed" and everything was "safe" Eric was visiting and working from my apartment, and he was there when the repairman came in. They talked a little bit after the repairs and the guy explained how it was good to go, nothing else needed, etc. So even though I don't have written correspondence for that one (I talked to the management only through the phone for that issue), I have a witness, booyah. As for the proof of him not fixing anything, I don't have before pics BUT I do have pictures that I took of the sheet he filled out (as well as an upclose shot of the date and time), and pictures of the places that needed to be fixed complete with timestamps showing that nothing was done AT ALL. I think I lost my before pics of the apartment when I moved in when my hard drive crashed :\ Eric might have them on his external hard drive, but I'm not sure... but with the window thing, I also have written correspondence between the manager lady and I about he did not fix anything... AND WENT IN MY BEDROOM. She never really addressed that. >_> (The repairs were only needed in the bathroom and living room, which was clearly stated on the sheet... and you can see my bathroom from the living room - you actually have to go out of your way to get to my bedroom if you go from living --> bath). Oh, and I highly doubt their repairman contradicting himself and lying about licensure would really help their case... Oh, and also with the October furnace shiz - the repairman totally flubbed today and contradicted himself on that, too. That detail might have gotten lost ITT, but at first he said they didn't fix it because "they didn't know," then by the end of the convo he said they didn't fix it because "he didn't have the materials."So after thinking it over (now that things have calmed down, at least for today... tomorrow will most likely get ugly), I have decided no matter what I think I have a strong case. Even if I have to pay for July and those 24 days of August at first, I would definitely take their ass to court if need be. I'm also going to talk to the people tomorrow about CO exposure and see if I should go to the doctor to have the blood test done. :\ I really hope that is just a coincidence but after seeing you can't really just let something like that clear up (in your body, that is) I think it's better safe than sorry... [Edited on June 27, 2011 at 10:34 PM. Reason : .]
6/27/2011 10:29:41 PM
Make sure you check into university student legal resources (if any), I'm sure they deal with this garbage all the time.
6/27/2011 10:34:40 PM
This is going to sound terrible, but I don't know if I would trust the university with that stuff. Medical issues? Yes. Legal advice? Ehhhh not so sure.But the attorney I used to work for I believe has other attorney friends in Bama... AND my classmate's dad is a real estate broker so I'm sure he knows some legit real estate attorneys around here if it came to that.If it's one thing I have learned from all of this, sketchy apartments get thrown into a tizzy when those magical words "building inspector" and "fire marshal" are dropped I bet they're thinking twice of trying to intimidate me now. >_>[Edited on June 27, 2011 at 10:38 PM. Reason : .]
6/27/2011 10:37:59 PM
Those bastards are gonna get their asses handed to them.
6/27/2011 11:26:41 PM
6/28/2011 2:03:54 AM
+1,000 for the building inspector, gas inspector, fire marshal, and housing department guyThe hammer was brought down today. Tomorrow they have to have a tech come out to determine if the furnace just needs a ton of repairs OR if it needs to be condemned. The inspector that was the expert on the furnace issue even said it was his gut feeling that it would be condemned. There could be major problems in the chamber, duct work needs to be done, it needs to be closed off from the ceiling, and apparently there is petroleum or something dripping down the pipes which can cause products of combustion. He also mentioned that it could have possibly been forcing all these products of combustion in my apartment. I raised my hand and said "I have a question" (student at heart), and then asked if it could cause CO to get in my apartment. He explained that yes it's a possibility and described the process. I then told them my CO detector has gone off before and they IMMEDIATELY turned around and started drilling the people with questions about how new it is, when it was installed, etc. I also had words with the property management - they are now trying to claim that the gas company came out and approved the furnace around October. BULL. SHIT. I have only seen a gas company employee 3 times - when I had my gas turned on, when they came out on June 4th, and when I called them again because I thought I smelled gas (June 11th). I told them that, and even said how my fiance' stated the only person he saw was the repairman who always comes here, and how he told Eric everything was safe and good to go. The guy from the property management (who I have never seen before) tried saying that they don't try to put their residents' safety at risk. I ended up telling the inspectors afterwards that I don't think they're intentionally trying to put people at risk, but they sure as half-assing it and cutting corners to save money instead of doing things properly. They agreed.One of the inspectors asked when my lease was up and if I would be renewing, and I said "NO" (kinda loudly, whoops) and told them I would be out by the end of the week. I also made sure to say I had no intentions of withholding rent because I didn't want to ruin my credit, but that I would be looking into other options. (PS, a few of the inspectors stifled laughs when I blurted out "no".)So tomorrow there is a tech coming out.I also decided I'm going to the doctor to talk to them about CO poisoning. When I was leaving the building, the property management people were gone but the inspectors were outside chatting so I decided to tell them about the repairman lying and saying he was a licensed contractor. I also talked to them about the CO poisoning - I don't think they're allowed to come and directly say "GO TO THE DOCTOR" because it was almost like they were trying to find a roundabout way to say it. But eventually one of them said, "Those things are there for a reason and it's your health at risk." I made an appointment for today at 4. The inspectors also told me that if no major repairs are made or started within the next 2 days, to call them. They also told me that this should kick their butts into gear, but that they didn't blame me for leaving or trying to get out of my lease.Oh and the extra beautiful part? I'm pretty sure if my furnace is condemned, they will have to look at all the furnaces in the building. BOOMSidebar: I guess my air vents are connected to the apartment next door because my living room is now full of paint fumes.
6/28/2011 12:26:39 PM
yayDon't let them poison you with paint fumes from your neighbor though
6/28/2011 12:32:25 PM
She moved out, I guess they're repainting in there... at least I think it's paint fumesI'm feeling lightheaded now I think I have pissed them off enough for one day though. [Edited on June 28, 2011 at 12:35 PM. Reason : I got the stink eye when I asked about the CO detector]
6/28/2011 12:35:15 PM
lol you should probably leave and go to a coffee shop or something
6/28/2011 12:39:33 PM
I have to pack :\ These people already cost me a day of packing I guess I'll open a window
6/28/2011 12:40:42 PM
Still not at good idea to withhold rent. Make sure you get whatever certificates or papers from the inspectors and such showing why it is unsafe/not up to code etc. Later (preferably after getting your deposit back) you can sue the landlord for quite a bit of the rent you have already paid (including July '11) due to unsafe / uninhabitable /dangerous conditions of the unit. There are cases where a tenant has been flooded out completely or was in super sub-par slum housing but was sued when they tried to "break the lease". The tenant(s) won later in court but that can be months or years later with money still tied up and black marks on the record with regards to credit and such. It blows, but that's the way it is.[Edited on June 28, 2011 at 12:46 PM. Reason : past, tenants got to pay first recoup later.]
6/28/2011 12:41:04 PM
WHERE did I say I am withholding rent??????Can you please get off that point - I have made it very clear I do NOT have plans of doing so.Jesus Christ.
6/28/2011 12:55:40 PM
6/28/2011 1:06:59 PM
6/28/2011 1:10:22 PM
I'm paying through July even though I'm leaving in good effort not to be officially breaking the lease. Even if I have to leave a chair in here and my desk or something stupid like that, and keep my mail coming here... I'll find some way where they can't screw me over.As for the CO effects, I was tested for strep earlier this year due to extreme fatigue, sore throat, headaches, and nausea, but I didn't have a fever and the test came back negative. I have also had problems with my heart randomly beating fast, hallucinations at night, allergy-like symptoms that won't go away, dizziness, lightheadedness, and yeah I guess depression and angry outbursts. The extreme fatigue is a big one though. It has been way worse since winter.
6/28/2011 1:14:58 PM
Moving your stuff out isn't breaking the lease. All they care about is if you paid them. If you paid, you didn't break it.
6/28/2011 1:38:32 PM
Check the lease carefully for that, a new one I'm about to sign states that moving the majority of your stuff (read value here) is the same as abandonment = breaking lease. Your's probably doesn't have that but always best to check. Yeah, you should be able to get most of your rent back for all the months you lived there. I mean the place is worth something with the violations, just not your full monthly rental amount. You aught to be able to recoup the difference.^ That sounds like carbon monoxide poisoning (chronic). You should be able to recoup medical costs for that as well. Make sure you mention all of this to the doctor next time you see him if you haven't already. Good luck![Edited on June 28, 2011 at 5:52 PM. Reason : moar]
6/28/2011 5:51:13 PM
Both my dog and I have symptoms :-( and I mean a lot. The doctor ordered a blood test and tomorrow I have to get an arterial blood gas test done. I asked if she thought they were related and she said she can't say for sure until we have the test- and even then it could gone back w/ an inconclusive diagnosis. But judging by the reaction she and the nurse gave me, I don't think it's going to be good. And I trust this doctor because she has been seeing me for about a year now.But yes, chronic CO poisoning is the main possibility. Even the doctor said I have some type of legal basis so I think she suspects that is the cause and is just waiting til I get the results. If the blood test comes back showing CO poisoning, I'm afraid I'll flip the F out[Edited on June 28, 2011 at 7:40 PM. Reason : is a health hazard issue reason to break it immediately? hmm]
6/28/2011 7:32:52 PM
This might have contributed to why your night terrors and sleeping have been so bad since you've moved down there(Credit to Brandi)From your own thread
6/28/2011 10:30:08 PM
well, I did remember something today... I didn't have hallucinations until this year - guess what? That can be involved. I've also had weird patches of red skin, and my chest/face have been flushing a lot.. Yup, that can be a sign, too. But this picture is what has me worriedI have noticed my hands doing this quite a few times in the last few months, and they are never itchy or seem to be inflamed.. just random red skin...At this point, I would just like an answer for myself.
6/28/2011 11:01:02 PM
When do you get the results and when I should be there for the ass kicking
6/28/2011 11:04:39 PM
I hope I can get the ABG test results back tomorrow if I go early in the morning.. should have the others by sometime tomorrow definitely. But the ABG test is the most important. :\[Edited on June 28, 2011 at 11:08 PM. Reason : this whole thing has taught me to pay a little closer attention to my F'ing body]
6/28/2011 11:08:03 PM
This is a bunch of pansy ass bullshit, I would move out and not pay any more rent.I would keep all documentation that there was half assed work done to the furnace, there was a CO2 alarm going off, the second time they were notified of it they still drug ass fixing it, and eventually building inspectors and fire marshalls got involved and the whole system was condemned due to being a safety hazard. Carbon monoxide kills you by making you pass out/fall asleep and you never wake up....your dead, not just sick. If you can document medical signs of light carbon monoxide poisoning you might have a substantial claim against them for putting you through that. Even if you sued them for that and lost they would spend more on attorneys fees than your last months rent is worth If you were really being a bitch you would have already layered up on a settlement basis and subpoenad all of their maintenance records. People have sued over way stupider shit in this country and gotten money. I would have sent them a registered letter documenting the signs of carbon monoxide poisoning, and that your property had a gas leak, and that it was noted by a fucking sign taped to the unit...instead of fixed. Advise you have all of this documented, and that you will seek legal counsel regarding the torment you have been exposed to should they take any further action against you for moving out early or fail to refund your deposit. Take that money you were gonna pay for the last months rent and get a lawyer if you want..its the principal of it. I would not pay another cent. If they threaten to put shit on your credit call the news channels and invite them out to look at all the pictures and documentation you have and then they can report on how you were in an apartment with a gas leak and they would not let you move out a month early. Gas is nothing to fuck around with, I had an aunt who died in a gas explosion, the houses on both sides of hers burnt, windows were broken across the street, pieces of her mail & photos were found miles away. Someone had been working on a gas wall heater and did a half assed job, the house was over a basement......once that area filled with LP gas and finally ignited it blew the whole house up. The gas company and insurance companies litigated for years over it....at the end of it someone was still dead and the money really did not matter. My uncle lost his mother with no warning over someone being a dead beat ass working on a gas heater.
6/29/2011 12:08:17 AM
No matter what the outcome is, I plan on suing them. I don't think it's ok for them to get away with lying to me and making me sick. I have documented doctor's visits of where I was sick and didn't know why, and tested negative for strep. I hope I get an answer with these blood tests - I just want to know for myself. But either way, I'm taking them to court for something. Fucking ridiculous.I'm sorry to hear about your aunt. Thank you for all the advice (to everyone)
6/29/2011 12:22:12 AM
^^
6/29/2011 1:50:26 AM
Wait, what do you mean not sleep there immediately? At my new place?I looked through my lease and they actually don't make mention of abandonment equaling moving out early. However, it does say that if you move out early and still plan on paying rent, they can accelerate the rent and ask for all of the remaining period up front. I'm also talking to all of my doctors now. I just spoke to the sleep center I have been going to since January, and the nurse practitioner (one of the ladies who is always there during my appointments) is going to talk to the two doctors, then they will call me back. They always wondered why all these meds to keep me awake didn't help a tremendous amount and why I still felt like a zombie. I'm also having the ABG test done today (hopefully - apparently it's a pretty extensive test). Even if that comes back not showing any levels, I have found enough publications talking about the residual effects and have enough of a paper trail of me showing symptoms with no clue as to why they were happening.I guess even if I cant get out of the lease, these people are paying in a major way (whether it be to me or just in repairs itself).
6/29/2011 10:48:48 AM
Oh, only as in, don't sleep at the unit with issues. Treat it like a closet.
6/29/2011 12:52:06 PM
Oh I seeI spoke to a lawyer and he helped me out a lot then I heard back from my sleep doctor and she told me to go to the ER since I'm still having symptoms. [Edited on June 29, 2011 at 1:30 PM. Reason : and again, thank you everyone for the advice! it has been very helpful]
6/29/2011 1:28:40 PM
This makes me so mad for you! I'm glad you're finding out what's been giving you these symptoms, and hopefully the docs can fix it. I somewhat agree with Str8BacardiL but also with Arab13 that you shouldn't fly off the handle and go sue-crazy. But this is definitely some BULLSHIT that has happened to you, and probably a lot of others in your complex. Glad you're documenting everything and that you talked to a lawyer!I wish I had more advice to give, but you've got a lot of people on your side!!! I'd go to the vet, too, and see if there are any tests they can do on your pup.[Edited on June 29, 2011 at 1:40 PM. Reason : r]
6/29/2011 1:40:23 PM
The ABG test was negative (which I knew was a possibility) but I talked to the doctor afterwards and asked him if I could have been exposed and these are residual effects/they were effects (earlier) from being exposed.. he said yes. So even though I didn't get a definitive diagnosis, based on his answer and whether or not I get better in the future, at least I'll have a "very likely" diagnosis. (If that makes sense)I will be pulling out the big guns tomorrow with a special letter for them. Lawyer dude answered a lot of questions I had, especially concerning my credit.[Edited on June 29, 2011 at 7:58 PM. Reason : ^ and thanks ]
6/29/2011 7:58:27 PM
I think I pissed them off as much as humanly possible today Going off what my attorney said, I gave a 14 day notice to vacate due to inhabitable conditions and the apartment being a danger to my health. Even though they're fixing the furnace, I was still able to turn that in because of the health factor and because I have a paper trail of where I have been sick with no explanation. Before going to the office I put a copy in the mail (certified, with a return receipt) and then hand delivered a copy. The lady didn't even read it all at first, just saw 14 days and started saying how "unfortunately" she couldn't accept that and she would have to abide by the 60 day notice put in on June 24th. I told her that's too bad, seeing as I had never signed that form OR confirmed it. (Plus, sidebar: she claimed she couldn't use what I said in April because I didn't sign the form and turn it in - I didn't sign that June 24th one or turn it in, she just went ahead and did it.. so why couldn't she do the same for the April email convo we had??)Then I told her it wasn't just about the furnace, it was due to my health being in danger as well. She got an attitude and said "Oh, really?? Because I haven't heard anything about medical issues until now." (Sidebar again: why the F would she have heard about it if I had no idea what was going on with the furnace?!?!?!) I told her I had been seen by multiple doctors for months without any explanation as to why I was getting sick. I also informed her that she should choose her words carefully because I will be speaking to someone about it. She got an attitude again and said there was no need to threaten her (which I don't understand seeing as I was offering a helpful suggestion, not a damn threat) and asked if I had documentation. I said yup, I do, and I had it with me - then she wanted to see my medical records so she could show them to her attorney. She got pretty pissed when I told her N to the izz-O and that she could go through her attorney if she wanted that info. Then I said, "well, now you have it" and peaced out.PS? One of the mechanics today (not with the property management company, with a private HVAC company) told me he could still smell gas and other fumes coming out even when everything was off and nothing was connected... i.e., something is coming up from the floors below me. He said all the furnaces in that building need to be checked, especially the ones below me. I called the inspectors today and gave them this info. [Edited on June 30, 2011 at 6:05 PM. Reason : I'm feeling pretty powerful today!]
6/30/2011 6:05:04 PM
Good for you!! Best of wishes.[Edited on June 30, 2011 at 6:13 PM. Reason : .]
6/30/2011 6:12:36 PM
yea i'm sure everyone else in that building should be notified... you mightnot be the only one with an issue.
6/30/2011 6:30:14 PM
I'm sorry you're having to go through such an ordeal but glad you're taking charge of the situation and are determined to force them to improve everyone else's situation who lives there. It sounds like things easily could have been much worse for your health; I hope getting out of there will cause some quick improvements in all of your symptoms!
6/30/2011 6:36:47 PM
6/30/2011 7:20:29 PM
Thanks guys ^ inorite... It's funny, because those women told me if I just handed over my medical documentation to show to their attorney, I could save everyone a lot of money and time.Eric put it the best: "Well, if they had let you out and just fixed it when you were gone they would have saved themselves a lot of money."But honestly, I'm glad I went this route now. Even if I have to go through lawyers and all of that, they are being forced to make sure their residents are ok and that's what really matters.
6/30/2011 7:22:58 PM
6/30/2011 8:00:20 PM
Oh, I am going in next week to sign the contracts for the lawyer. He doesn't get paid unless I do but I think he's angered by this just from hearing about it to the point of wanting to stick it to 'em if they try anything
6/30/2011 8:31:25 PM
Hooray!Apparently that office lady has never heard of HIPAA...
6/30/2011 8:39:49 PM
I have found that 8 times out of 10 the people that work as management in apartment complexes are complete morons.
6/30/2011 8:51:24 PM
Epic Read, Sam!
6/30/2011 9:42:12 PM
wow, I often wonder to myself how I would handle a situation like that, which for some reason I feel to my bones will happen at some point in my life. I keep thinking to myself that keeping or not keeping up with some part of the paper trail would make or break the situation.It's difficult b/c you can't believe what anyone says in that situation and the only real guidance is the legal process, and that's something that few people know. Good job, and thanks for the thread.
6/30/2011 10:17:53 PM
This is a lot less glamorous than my People's Court suggestion, but I'm glad you're really taking it to them.
6/30/2011 10:26:23 PM
You guys are seriously keeping me strong through this. I know that sounds a little ~, but seeing this thread not get flamed really confirms that I am not crazy and these people need to go down. ^ I really considered it... and I LOL'd the other day because one of my friends said, "So... How do you feel about Judge Judy?" I have also had multiple people tell me I should look into those local news segments they do on shady businesses, apartments, etc. I thought about it, but I'm going to wait and see what they say. The ball's in their court now.I will seriously LOL if they try sending me intimidating letters and whatnot, though.
6/30/2011 11:26:08 PM