outback is not a premier steakhouse. i can cook better steaks at home out back than at outback anyday.

ruths chris
sullivans
mortons
charleys
ben benson's

real steak

9/20/2007 1:12:56 AM

Quote :

"Vivace has gone downhill a lot in recent times, and their quality control sucks. I worked there when it first opened, and it was great at first, but after i quit, i kept going back every 3 months ro so to eat and each time was worse than the last."

Well that sucks! I went there twice in a month not long after it opened and it was outstanding.

Where are you at now?

Quote :

"Not to mention, most homes dont have as hot of a grill or broiler as most steak houses, which is whats responsible for that nice caramely sear on beef tha gives it that awesome "grill" flavor."

Yeah, most home ovens only get up to 550-600 at the most. Most steakhouse go for 1000+... guess you could always overclock your oven.

Quote :

"if you say you can cook a better steak at home than a top end steak house, you're just lying to yourself. "

So true.

Oh, and I've also noticed that a lot of people don't like high-end steakhouses because they don't like the richness of dry-aged beef. I think most people are simply suckers for copious amounts of season salt.

9/20/2007 1:18:29 AM

Quote :

"if you say you can cook a better steak at home than a top end steak house, you're just lying to yourself."

MetalRed

Fair enough. From what I've read on T-Dub, I'll stipulate that you are much more of an authority on preparing food than I am. I'm just a consumer--but I know what I like.

And if you're referring to me, I probably shouldn't have claimed that my steak cooked at home is better than one cooked at a high-end steak house. But I swear this to you: Within the last year or so, I have eaten a rib-eye at Ruth's Chris Steak House in Cary and it was not much better than the rib-eyes I cook on my Weber grill with Kingsford charcoal. Maybe I caught them on an off night (don't remember the day of the week) but that's the truth.

And it's not that my steaks are so great. I was just not blown away by Ruth's Chris' steak like I thought I was going to be.

In any event, what is your position on freshly grated cheeses for salads and pizzas (cheddar, mozzarella, parmesan, and so on)? I say it's a must for the best taste.

9/20/2007 1:40:09 AM

Heh, thats entirely personal taste, and for me, it depends on the salad.

9/20/2007 1:55:17 AM

if you knew anything about steak, you'd know it's called

"ribeye"

not

"rib-eye"

9/20/2007 3:51:23 AM

Question:
The boyfriend's birthday is coming up at the end of September and I want to take him out for dinner. I could cook for him, but I cook for him everyday, since we live together, and it might be nice to have a break from the kitchen.

Can you recommend a really great restaurant that isn't way too $$$$?? He has very high expectations when it comes to his food-- carrrabas wont cut it for this type of dinner. Normal places around here we've been to before-- angus barn, prime only, etc., and it can't be a place that smells whatsoever of any seafood- even better if they dont serve much seafood too. Someone mentioned Ruth Chris, but isn't that chain? is it awesome? the max. I want to spend is $150... (lol, ok maybe that will change)

Thanks!

9/20/2007 6:53:46 AM

Quote :

"But you're right about the beef. Prime grade constitutes about 3% of all beef produced, and is pretty much reserved for food service only. Its moer or less impossible to find in a grocery store, even high end ones, and extremely rare to find in specialty butcher shops (which there arent any around here anyway). Not to mention, most homes dont have as hot of a grill or broiler as most steak houses, which is whats responsible for that nice caramely sear on beef tha gives it that awesome "grill" flavor. if you say you can cook a better steak at home than a top end steak house, you're just lying to yourself. "

so are you saying that when cooking a steak at home, you want to get the grill/grate stupid hot to sear one side of the steak, then lower the coals and cook at a more normal temerature? Then just flip it once to finish? Or do you want to sear the shit out of the second side too?

9/20/2007 8:38:51 AM

you want to sear the shit out of both sides and leave the middle mooing

9/20/2007 11:13:30 AM

^^^^ Fuck you, joe_shithead. Go troll somebody else, you fucking loser.

If you knew anything about the English language, which you don't, you would know that "rib-eye" modifies "steak." The term at issue is accepted in several forms and "rib-eye" is one of them.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/rib-eye

Eat shit and die, motherfucker.

9/20/2007 11:23:56 AM

Quote :

"you want to sear the shit out of both sides and leave the middle mooing"

infrared grill ftw, got my dad one for christmas..

9/20/2007 11:29:32 AM

Quote :

"so are you saying that when cooking a steak at home, you want to get the grill/grate stupid hot to sear one side of the steak, then lower the coals and cook at a more normal temerature? Then just flip it once to finish? Or do you want to sear the shit out of the second side too? "

You want to sear the shit out of both sides(but not burn), then finish at a more moderate temperature

Quote :

"Can you recommend a really great restaurant that isn't way too $$$$?? He has very high expectations when it comes to his food-- carrrabas wont cut it for this type of dinner. Normal places around here we've been to before-- angus barn, prime only, etc., and it can't be a place that smells whatsoever of any seafood- even better if they dont serve much seafood too. Someone mentioned Ruth Chris, but isn't that chain? is it awesome? the max. I want to spend is $150... (lol, ok maybe that will change) "

You're in Durham, right?

go here:
http://www.magnoliagrill.net/
You wont be disappointed

9/20/2007 12:09:08 PM

Quote :

"You want to sear the shit out of both sides(but not burn), then finish at a more moderate temperature"

so my pops always taught me to only flip a steak once...and not that i mind breaking that rule, just want to make sure i have the procedure down right. (i have a charcoal grill w/adjustable coal height).

1) Get the grate pretty damn hot,
2) Sear one side of the steak..leave it there for 20 seconds? or so
3) Flip it and sear the other side of the steak.
4) Drop the coals down lower to lower the temperature
5) Let the steak cook for a while, then flip it again to moderately cook the other side (the side I seared first).

Also, my pops taught me to only use salt+pepper on quality steaks...but sometimes I break that too and use some onion powder and/or garilc powder. What do you put on decent quality steaks before grilling?

Thanks for the info!

9/20/2007 1:23:53 PM

Quote :

"if you say you can cook a better steak at home than a top end steak house, you're just lying to yourself. "

if you think top end steak houses are actually selling USDA prime when they refer to a steak as "prime", then you are mistaken. most USDA prime beef is being exported nowadays. the steaks they serve at top end steakhouses aren't any different than what you can buy at Fresh Market or Whole Foods. the only difference is the equipment it's being cooked on. A person with a nice grill can cook just as good of a steak at home.

[Edited on September 20, 2007 at 1:38 PM. Reason : or you could be lying to yourself]

9/20/2007 1:37:29 PM

hey look, it's IKE!

9/20/2007 2:09:12 PM

hey, hooksaw

9/20/2007 4:36:51 PM

Quote :

"if you think top end steak houses are actually selling USDA prime when they refer to a steak as "prime", then you are mistaken. most USDA prime beef is being exported nowadays. the steaks they serve at top end steakhouses aren't any different than what you can buy at Fresh Market or Whole Foods. the only difference is the equipment it's being cooked on. A person with a nice grill can cook just as good of a steak at home. "

If a restaurant is serving "Prime Rib", "Prime choice cuts of meat", etc. then of course its probably just USDA Choice (like what you get at Fresh Market and Whole Foods) or even Select. However, a restaurant cannot legally put "USDA Prime" on the menu (accompanied by the fancy little USDA shield) without actually serving meat of that grade. USDA Prime beef is absolutely still served at the major steakhouses and hotels in this country.

Quote :

"Also, my pops taught me to only use salt+pepper on quality steaks...but sometimes I break that too and use some onion powder and/or garilc powder. What do you put on decent quality steaks before grilling?"

Onion powder and garlic power will pretty much just get scorched and leave a bad taste on the meat. If you want a different flavor then you are either going to want to do a flavored salt rub ahead of time, a compound butter topping, or prepare a simple sauce.
Here is a site that explains the salt rub:
http://steamykitchen.com/blog/2007/08/28/how-to-turn-cheap-choice-steaks-into-gucci-prime-steaks/

I think its easier to do a steak inside...
- Preheat oven to 500+, let cast iron skillet heat up in the oven.
- Apply a thin coat of oil (canola, regular olive oil, or something else with a decent smokepoint) to room temperature steaks.
- Season liberally with cracked black pepper and kosher salt.
- Place the iron skillet on a stove burner over high heat. Add the steaks to the skillet and sear for 30 seconds. Flip the steak and sear the other side for 30 seconds.
- Move the skillet to the oven and cook for 3-4 minutes. Flip the steak and return to the oven for another 3-4 minutes. (these times are going to vary depending upon thickness of steak and doneness you want)
- Place the steak on a rack and rest for 5 minutes.

A grill is harder because you don't have as much ability to quickly change the cooking environment like gong fro stove to oven. You could always sear on a burner and then finish in your grill if you want the flavor. You can also slow roast first, then sear the crap out of it when the doneness is achieved. The notion of "searing in juices" is completely flawed. You actually get a larger pink portion if you slow roast first, according to the tests Alton Brown did.

9/21/2007 2:58:49 PM

Quote :

"If a restaurant is serving "Prime Rib", "Prime choice cuts of meat", etc. then of course its probably just USDA Choice (like what you get at Fresh Market and Whole Foods) or even Select. However, a restaurant cannot legally put "USDA Prime" on the menu (accompanied by the fancy little USDA shield) without actually serving meat of that grade. USDA Prime beef is absolutely still served at the major steakhouses and hotels in this country. "

who's there to catch them? Over 80% of USDA Prime beef is being exported, and the recent skyrockets in corn fed beef are causing a reduction in the amount of beef that actually meets USDA prime criteria. Most upscale steakhouses like Ruth Chris and Angus Barn are no longer serving USDA Prime because they either can't get it or can't afford it.

9/21/2007 3:35:37 PM

Quote :

"who's there to catch them? Over 80% of USDA Prime beef is being exported, and the recent skyrockets in corn fed beef are causing a reduction in the amount of beef that actually meets USDA prime criteria. Most upscale steakhouses like Ruth Chris and Angus Barn are no longer serving USDA Prime because they either can't get it or can't afford it."

The USDA is one of the most stringent government agencies when it comes to enforcing regulations. Fraud would put a steakhouse out of business in a heartbeat. The increase in exported USDA Prime stems from the change in health perception in this country (American's hate seeing fat, even when it means a better tasting steak) and the willingness for other cultures to pay a premium for top-notch quality over quantity or health. However, this in no way has limited the availability of beef to high-end steakhouses. You can right now order USDA Prime beef in pretty much any cut from Lobel's. Morton's Ruth's Chris, Palm, etc. all still serve nothing but USDA Prime. Yes, the E85 craze has cut into cattle production but that will work itself out. Sullivan's has switched to Certified Angus Beef, which is the highest level USDA Choice, but undergoes a different set of criteria for judging quality (similar to what marks USDA Prime+).

9/21/2007 4:18:38 PM

way to go on spewing forth a bunch of bullshit. we're not exporting our highest qualify beef because we want lean meat, regardless of what you might think. We're exporting beef because the Japanese are willing to pay upwards of $100 a pound for it, and our market can't compete with what they are willing to pay. Also, the mad cow crisis in Europe has driven up demand for American beef to be exported to Europe.

E85 is not driving the demand for feeding cows a high corn diet; it's actually doing the opposite. Farmers like to feed their cattle corn because it makes them fat and they get a lot of feed to the acre off of it. unfortunately, high-corn diets don't make the fat marble into the muscle tissue like grazing does. What we end up with is a surplus of lean meat with spotty fat tissue surrounding the outside of the meat.

[Edited on September 21, 2007 at 4:28 PM. Reason : a ton of steakhouses have been busted for selling incorrectly graded meat. it doesn't stop them]

9/21/2007 4:27:57 PM

Quote :

"way to go on spewing forth a bunch of bullshit. we're not exporting our highest qualify beef because we want lean meat, regardless of what you might think. We're exporting beef because the Japanese are willing to pay upwards of $100 a pound for it, and our market can't compete with what they are willing to pay. Also, the mad cow crisis in Europe has driven up demand for American beef to be exported to Europe."

Yes, lean meat is a big shift in the US market. Its why retailers are picking up grassfed beef and buffalo. Japan pays $100 a pound for it because they have the economy to pay for it but not the means for producing enough of it themselves. As I said, USDA Prime is still readily available in this country. You can order some right now and have it on your doorstep tomorrow. Mad Cow scares have caused Japan to institute multiple bans on US Beef in recent years. That effect is gong to ebb and flow as incidents happen in different countries.

Quote :

"E85 is not driving the demand for feeding cows a high corn diet; it's actually doing the opposite. Farmers like to feed their cattle corn because it makes them fat and they get a lot of feed to the acre off of it. unfortunately, high-corn diets don't make the fat marble into the muscle tissue like grazing does. What we end up with is a surplus of lean meat with spotty fat tissue surrounding the outside of the meat."

You are completely wrong here. E85 has cut into cattle production because petroleum companies pay more for corn than cattle producers can pay for it as feed. Corn is used for the fattening process just before going to market. Corn is EXACTLY what makes beef have better marbling. Grass-fed beef is leaner and all-around healthier beef but it also makes it tougher and less desirable from a high-end perspective. It has a higher price point because free range is expensive and its a hot market with animal welfare and health-conscious trends.

Quote :

"a ton of steakhouses have been busted for selling incorrectly graded meat. it doesn't stop them"

ORLY?

[Edited on September 21, 2007 at 5:00 PM. Reason : In case you need some: http://www.lobels.com/store/main/item.asp?item=5]

9/21/2007 4:56:49 PM

msb2ncsu - 3
I.K.E. - 0

9/21/2007 5:29:43 PM

^no one cares about your opinion, sandnigger. just because you'd rather believe his opinion vs. what has been reported over and over again by the Cattlemen's Association and the Wall Street Journal doesn't make him right.

9/21/2007 5:43:40 PM

the e85 debate is pointless. even if every field was designated for corn, there's not enough farmland in the whole country to support any large scale production. not to mention it's not really any cleaner, requires more energy to produce, etc. it is nice cheap alternative high octane fuel for the performance/racing world though.

i don't see it having any lasting or long term effect on anything. i predict the stuff is gone in a few years.

[Edited on September 21, 2007 at 5:53 PM. Reason : .]

9/21/2007 5:49:24 PM

awww, how cute, I got you worked up enough to start throwing out the racial epithets now. It's fitting that you don't even know what "sandnigger" refers to.

9/21/2007 5:50:05 PM

so are you not middle eastern?

9/21/2007 5:55:40 PM

Quote :

"^no one cares about your opinion, sandnigger. just because you'd rather believe his opinion vs. what has been reported over and over again by the Cattlemen's Association and the Wall Street Journal doesn't make him right."

Well, it would probably help if you actually read any of that information. You are completely backwards on corn-fed vs. grass-fed impact on beef production. You also don't seem to understand that E85 took away corn feed which is necessary for the best marbling and subsequently the better steak. And yet again, you seem to not understand basic market principles and trends. I promise, do a quick google search on "corn fed grass fed beef", "e85 beef corn", etc. and you ill quickly see that your knowledge is flawed.

Don't forget to place your order for the nonexistant USDA Prime beef at Lobel's... MyButcher.com is also highly recommended.

9/21/2007 6:05:47 PM

Quote :

"so are you not middle eastern?"

haha

you get the idiot of the day award.

congrats.

9/21/2007 6:23:22 PM

well, that was a good fight.

I thought IKE was going to run away with it, but then he got KO'd in the second round.

9/21/2007 8:04:51 PM

^^^you apparently don't understand the difference between information and propaganda. I've been raising beef cattle all my life, and I know why cattle are fed corn immediately before slaughter. It has nothing to do with marbling and everything to do with getting them to retain weight while they are put on rail cars before shipping. It's similar to how there is so much propaganda about how Angus beef has a superior taste to it. Angus is only popular because the cows gain weight so quickly, not because of the marbling of the meat. Advertising is what has enforced the belief that Angus is somehow a superior tasting breed of cattle.

I never claimed that USDA prime was nonexistant. If you had any reading comprehension you would realize that. Saying that 80% of USDA prime is exported implies that 20% of it is still inside the country. However, when you list prices for USDA prime steaks selling for $35 a pound, then you should be able to deduce from logic that a steakhouse selling a $50 steak isn't selling USDA prime for that price. If they are, then it was sold to them mislabeled (which happens quite often).

9/21/2007 8:49:36 PM

Quote :

"You also don't seem to understand that E85 took away corn feed which is necessary for the best marbling and subsequently the better steak"

I don't see how you can think that the E85 craze is what's causing a beef trend that's been occurring for the last 30-40 years. besides, there are other grains you can feed beside corn.

If you want to see what has really changed the marbling of American beef in the last few decades, then look at trends in the use of estrodiol and zeranol in conjuction with trenbolone and testosterone.

9/21/2007 9:18:00 PM

it seems the initial call of KO has been overturned.

the challenger is back on his feet!

bring out the Round 3 girls.

9/21/2007 9:43:47 PM

Ding ding ding

9/21/2007 9:52:27 PM

rabble

9/21/2007 10:44:18 PM

9/22/2007 2:38:38 AM

Quote :

"^^^you apparently don't understand the difference between information and propaganda. I've been raising beef cattle all my life, and I know why cattle are fed corn immediately before slaughter. It has nothing to do with marbling and everything to do with getting them to retain weight while they are put on rail cars before shipping. It's similar to how there is so much propaganda about how Angus beef has a superior taste to it. Angus is only popular because the cows gain weight so quickly, not because of the marbling of the meat. Advertising is what has enforced the belief that Angus is somehow a superior tasting breed of cattle."

Corn most definitely has to do with marbling. Even though its not a natural or good food source for a cow (my wife is a vet who did her undergrad in animal nutrition and it bothers her) the corn makes the beef taste better (80% chose corn-fed over grass fed in a Colorado State University study in 2003). Its exactly the same principle applied to foie gras production... stuff as much corn product down the animals throat to fatten it up as much as possible to make taste buds happy. The biggest marketing push of grass-fed beef is its improved health quality. Its lower in saturated fats and lower in fat in general... why? because the fat is more likely to develop around muscle rather than marble throughout. Yes, it is possible to get marbling with grass-fed but its not easy and its expensive. The Angus beef push is a joke but there have been some branded grades that are of high quality.

Quote :

"I never claimed that USDA prime was nonexistant. If you had any reading comprehension you would realize that. Saying that 80% of USDA prime is exported implies that 20% of it is still inside the country. However, when you list prices for USDA prime steaks selling for $35 a pound, then you should be able to deduce from logic that a steakhouse selling a $50 steak isn't selling USDA prime for that price. If they are, then it was sold to them mislabeled (which happens quite often)."

You said that USDA Prime was so rare in this country that most high end steakhouses weren't even selling it and that is complete bullshit. Lobel's sells to the consumer USDA Prime filet at $65 per pound and Ruth's Chris offers the 8oz filet at a reasonable $30. This slim margin might seem outrageous to you but you forget that Ruth's Chris buys thousands of pounds of beef at a time and they aren't getting at the supermarket or mail order. They are not paying a consumer price for their beef, not even close. Its no different than what you pay for a single bottle of soda at Harris Teeter compared to what the McDonald's down the street pays for their soda. Besides, top end steakhouses aren't making their profit on steaks, its mainly wine (400-500% markup, easily) with a bit of help from appetizers, desserts, and sides ($8 for mashed potatoes?)

Quote :

"I don't see how you can think that the E85 craze is what's causing a beef trend that's been occurring for the last 30-40 years. besides, there are other grains you can feed beside corn."

How hard is it to understand what I wrote. I did not say that E85 was causing a trend in beef. I said the E85 trend has consumed more corn, therefore driving up corn prices, which has reduced the amount available for feed. This has resulted in a reduced fattening/marbling, and therefore lower USDA Prime gradings. Its not like I'm saying anything complex here, pretty basic principle of supply and demand.

9/22/2007 4:05:20 AM

how can you claim that a place like Ruth Chris operates on almost no profit at all on steaks and depends primarily on the sale of other items to run their business? That's a huge assumption on your part.

beef can marble out just fine on plenty of other grains or grass just fine. it's simply a matter of how much you feed them. corn has been king because of how cheap it has been up until the last decade, but just because corn price is going up does not mean that feedlots are going to stop fattening the calves up prior to slaughter. They can get the exact same effect with wheat, barley, molasses, and oats. Corn isn't some miracle feed; it has simply been a historically cheap feed for the amount of calories it contains.

If your wife is a vet, then maybe you should get her to explain to you how growth implants have reduced the USDA grade and quality scores of beef for the sake of higher slaughter weight. Unfortunately, no one wants to talk about this harsh reality of the beef market other than the scientific literature surrounding these products. Since the farmer gets paid primarily by the pound and the color markings of the cow, they don't care about how they might be affecting the beef score after slaughter. Farmers will happily add several pounds to a cow knowing that the lower score will be the slaughterhouse's problem and not theirs.

http://money.cnn.com/magazines/fsb/fsb_archive/2003/11/01/358318/index.htm

there's an article from CNN claiming the shortage of beef is based on the atkins craze and the impact of mad cow disease. They even quote an industry expert who claims that restaurants are lying about the USDA scores of the beef they serve.

9/22/2007 11:49:04 AM

get a room

9/22/2007 1:52:53 PM

once again, eleusis thinks he is an instant expert in something. this time it is the cattle industry.

9/22/2007 7:22:52 PM

I've raised cattle all my life. What makes you think I wouldn't know about the cattle industry? I wasn't the one that came in here spewing off bullshit about E85 and an overabundance of USDA Prime.

9/22/2007 9:33:01 PM

man where the hell did this thread go? all this over some steak (with sauce foyot)?

9/22/2007 10:58:25 PM

Quote :

"how can you claim that a place like Ruth Chris operates on almost no profit at all on steaks and depends primarily on the sale of other items to run their business? That's a huge assumption on your part."

Can you not fucking read? The price per pound that you, as a consumer, pay for beef is NOT what Ruth's Chris pays for beef. Not even remotely fucking close. Why is this so hard to understand? And yes, relying on something other than your prime focus for profits is common in certain markets. For example, most video game consoles are sold at a loss to the manufacturer and profits are made up with the sales of games and accessories. Ruth's Chris is still making a substantial profit on their steaks, but their cash cow is wine sales (like most higher end restaurants). For example, the last business dinner I was at was at a nice steakhouse in San Juan. The wine that was served was La Crema Pinot Noir. You can buy this wine locally for $17 a bottle (which is still more than a restaurant pays for it). The cost on the bill for this same bottle of wine was $100 per bottle. Our dinner lasted awhile since people were "talking shop" and we ended up consuming an average 1 bottle per person so that is at least $85 profit without any food taken into consideration.

Quote :

"beef can marble out just fine on plenty of other grains or grass just fine. it's simply a matter of how much you feed them. corn has been king because of how cheap it has been up until the last decade, but just because corn price is going up does not mean that feedlots are going to stop fattening the calves up prior to slaughter. They can get the exact same effect with wheat, barley, molasses, and oats. Corn isn't some miracle feed; it has simply been a historically cheap feed for the amount of calories it contains."

Yes, it can marble just fine on other grains and grass, but corn is cheaper, easier, and does the job as well as anything. Corn price going up is going to increase costs because they simply cannot achieve the same results as in the past at the same previous cost. Corn is an unhealthy diet for cow. That is bad for its nutrition but good for the desired results of Prime beef. Its the exact same principle in foie gras production. Corn results in much higher amounts of saturated fat and meat marbling (in comparison to grass-fed). Yes, you can do it with other grains but corn is still cheaper and easier.

Quote :

"If your wife is a vet, then maybe you should get her to explain to you how growth implants have reduced the USDA grade and quality scores of beef for the sake of higher slaughter weight. Unfortunately, no one wants to talk about this harsh reality of the beef market other than the scientific literature surrounding these products. Since the farmer gets paid primarily by the pound and the color markings of the cow, they don't care about how they might be affecting the beef score after slaughter. Farmers will happily add several pounds to a cow knowing that the lower score will be the slaughterhouse's problem and not theirs."

Yes, the farmer only cares about weight, but when his distributor keeps getting short changed because the meat is lower grade he will find a new supplier... it is a free market. A butcher cannot cover his ass with Select meat only. If he keeps getting screwed by a supplier he's going to look elsewhere.

Quote :

"there's an article from CNN claiming the shortage of beef is based on the atkins craze and the impact of mad cow disease. They even quote an industry expert who claims that restaurants are lying about the USDA scores of the beef they serve."

That article was relevant 4-5 years ago. That was also back when Japan was not importing a single pound of USDA Prime because of bans on US and even Canadian beef. You are misunderstanding the intent of the comment on restaurants lying about scores of beef. The use of "prime" when talking about beef has always been abused. Its only a problem when people use the label "USDA Prime" and/or the USDA logo. An example of this can be seen at ANY restaurant with "Prime Rib." The intent of that dish was to signify a rib roast of USDA Prime beef. However, restaurants were legally able to say "Prime Rib" but use Choice or Select beef because they aren't saying "USDA Prime"... its all just marketing (much like issues being seen with "organic" and "free-range." There are plenty of places that say the offer "prime cuts of top quality beef" that are simply using a legal loophole for better marketing. That will never stop.

If you want something a tad more relevant to today then here is the first article I could find.
http://www.nysun.com/article/60032?page_no=1
It poitns out that today's USDA Prime shortage is related to... *drumroll* E85 production increasing fattening feed costs and availability and the mass market desire for leaner beef... SHOCKER!11
http://www.nysun.com/article/60032?page_no=1

Quote :

"I've raised cattle all my life. What makes you think I wouldn't know about the cattle industry? I wasn't the one that came in here spewing off bullshit about E85 and an overabundance of USDA Prime."

Raising cattle doesn't make you an authority. My wife is a vet and she would be glad to point out the hundreds of people who are professional dog breeders that *think* they know it all too. Yes, you have an intimate knowledge of one aspect but you seem to lack a general perception of the overall market (not to mention some reading comprehension). I don't recall anyone saying there was an abundance of USDA Prime. We were merely pointing out that it wasn't unavailable. yes, prices are up and the supply was reduced this year, but shit like that happens (E85, market changes, export issues, etc). The meat is still readily available, just at a higher premium than normal. This is always going to fluctuate.

Here is a crop report from the USDA showing predicted corn usage as feed and it clearly indicates a significant drop in corn usage as feed and a dramatic increase in corn usage for ethanol (a market that pays farmers much better because of its end value).
http://www.vanahnco.com/commodities/cropreport/Crop.pdf
Oh, and here is one more article the comments on the significant impact of ethanol production on the meat market.
http://www.theregister.com/2007/03/12/usa_corn_diet/



[Edited on September 22, 2007 at 11:39 PM. Reason : articles]

9/22/2007 11:31:59 PM

9/22/2007 11:37:54 PM

Cut me Mick... Cut me.

9/22/2007 11:42:02 PM

Quote :

"Yes, the farmer only cares about weight, but when his distributor keeps getting short changed because the meat is lower grade he will find a new supplier... it is a free market. A butcher cannot cover his ass with Select meat only. If he keeps getting screwed by a supplier he's going to look elsewhere. "

you obviously have such a skewed perception of how beef is sold that this discussion is going nowhere. do some reading on how beef is actually sold before you keep responding with stupid shit like this.

[Edited on September 23, 2007 at 10:57 AM. Reason : your links did nothing to back up your claims about a drop in beef grade.]

9/23/2007 10:51:59 AM

haha this just proves that people will argue about anything...just for the sake of arguing.

9/23/2007 11:09:06 AM

You both should start posting links to prove your points..otherwise it's just randomly spewing contradicting shit.

9/23/2007 1:08:11 PM

http://jas.fass.org/cgi/reprint/79/E-Suppl/E296.pdf

there's an research study at Texas A&M University that was published in the Journal of Animal Science. It states in no uncertain terms that the use of implants has reduced the quality of beef in the US. They site numerous other research studies that state the same findings.

Implants started gaining popularity about 30 years ago, and 20 years ago the use of trenbolone was approved. Trenbolone in conjunction with estrodiol or similar estrogenic compounds results in the largest size gains, but you can see from the literature that it is believed to cause the largest reductions in beef quality.

[Edited on September 23, 2007 at 5:32 PM. Reason : link]

9/23/2007 5:31:58 PM