Stats don't tell stories. Fact.

11/2/2006 9:21:02 PM

then why the hell are u guys tryin to say Vick's STATS the past 2 games make him awesome????

11/2/2006 9:25:06 PM

haha Earl=pwned as usual

11/2/2006 9:29:43 PM

Vick's stats only MATTER when they're good stats.

When they're bad stats, we can just look at the W-L column, and when THAT doesn't shake in his favor, that's when you start blaming everyone else.

I've come to realize that fanaVicks will tirelessly seek out every excuse available to them as to either why Vick is a top quarterback (his good games' stats, W-L record that isn't his to begin with) or why he can't be one yet (his WRs suck, his OL sucks, the Falcons' D sucks, the coaching/FO sucks, the PA guy sucks, the Cracker Jack man on the lower level sucks, the guy who radioed in a burglarized vehicle in the Georgia Dome lot to the Atlanta PD sucks, Aaron Brooks had a shitty day on Thursday and it affected Vick on Sunday, etc).

11/2/2006 9:31:55 PM

Quote :

"thats kind of like a whos hot now list."

No it isn't....McNabb is on that list.

11/2/2006 10:19:15 PM

^^ Either that or Ill just grab the QB rankings list from Scouts Inc.

The one where he's listed as the #3 QB in the NFL behind accepted great QB's Manning and Brady.

He's one of the best QB's in the league anyway you look at it.

11/3/2006 4:18:58 PM

so is Rex Grossman

right now

and his team is undefeated

so Grossman must be a better QB than Vick

even though only a retard would think so

11/3/2006 4:27:54 PM

I bash Vick because I think he is over hyped and not a very good QB. That being said I have to be impressed with how he is playing right now. Maybe he is turning the corner and realizing he needs to be a quarterback and not a running back who touches the ball every down.

11/3/2006 6:02:29 PM

He's playing some of the best football of his career. Very reminiscent of Kordell Stewart's best year at Pittsburgh. If he's lucky, maybe he can put together a season as good as Stewart had that one year.

11/3/2006 9:50:02 PM

^^^^ I wonder why he's listed so high now if he's been this amazing QB all this time...


...oh wait, I remember, it's those useless stats. You know, the ones that measure his quarterbacking skills.


Must've been throwing those passes to himself.

11/3/2006 9:59:14 PM

Sorry to break this to you but, stats don't measure skills at all. Stats are just raw measurments that can be interpreted any way you want them to. If you actually sit down and watch the game winning plays this guy makes for his team, you would never argue against him. He can do everything those Qbs' can do during the coarse of a game. They, however, will never be able to do what Vick does.

Quote :

"then why the hell are u guys tryin to say Vick's STATS the past 2 games make him awesome????"

I never said this. But something I will say is this, Vicks GAMEPLAY his entire career makes him awesome.

Other than 76' and 77', Walter Payton wasn't at the top of every stat category during his carrer. That diddn't mean he was the best Rb during his time. So you can't use stats to say that a person is better than the other. Fact.


[Edited on November 4, 2006 at 12:57 AM. Reason : .]

11/4/2006 12:48:24 AM

I admire how noone refuted this. I guess I victor.

11/5/2006 3:50:18 PM

after 3 quarters today against the mighty lions he has a pick, a fumble, a TD, and 100 passing yards, 45% passing, 9/20. sounds about like the real Mike Vick.



[Edited on November 5, 2006 at 3:53 PM. Reason : hfsd]

11/5/2006 3:53:03 PM

So noone is allowed to have a "bad day" in the NFL. Your logic is soooo sound.

11/5/2006 3:54:43 PM

SO WHEN HE HAS 2 GOOD GAMES, HE'S A GOLDEN GOD, BUT WHENEVER HE PLAYS BAD IT'S ALLLLLLLL GOOD.

10/22 now

[Edited on November 5, 2006 at 3:56 PM. Reason : gfd]

11/5/2006 3:55:25 PM

Quote :

"So noone is allowed to have a "bad day" in the NFL."

He has more "mediocre-to-bad" days then he has "good-to-great" days. Therefore...he is a mediocre-to-above average QB.

11/5/2006 3:56:12 PM

Quote :

"SO WHEN HE HAS 2 GOOD GAMES, HE'S A GOLDEN GOD, BUT WHENEVER HE PLAYS BAD IT'S ALLLLLLLL GOOD EVERYONE ELSE'S FAULT."

wait for it.

11/5/2006 3:57:38 PM

^,^^,^^^NFL Qbs' arn't allowed to have bad days ever. They have to be perfect everyday of the season.

Once again, your neanderthal logic lets you down. Your wisdom is surpassed by your idiocracy. Fact.

[Edited on November 5, 2006 at 4:00 PM. Reason : .]

11/5/2006 3:57:42 PM

you're being hypocritical as fuck, whenever he plays well he is the second coming, but whenever he plays bad, it's ok, free pass, you're still a golden God vick, who cares if you stunk up the joint against a 1-WIN TEAM???

[Edited on November 5, 2006 at 4:00 PM. Reason : gjd]

11/5/2006 4:00:07 PM

Don't curse at me dude.

You peeps just look for anything to tear him apart on. Nothings ever said when Peyton "the choke" Manning chokes up every year he goes to the playoffs!!!

[Edited on November 5, 2006 at 4:02 PM. Reason : .]

11/5/2006 4:01:11 PM

Quote :

"NFL Qbs' arn't allowed to have bad days ever"

He's a 50% passer for the year you dumbfuck. That's not a couple bad days. It's bad days, below average days, average days, then a couple good days. Your logic is retarded. Fact.

11/5/2006 4:02:24 PM

Quote :

"Don't curse at me dude."

bitch, i'll do what i want.

Quote :

"Nothings ever said when Peyton "the choke" Manning chokes up every year he goes to the playoffs!!!"

that's a straight-up lie, have you even been on this board long enough to see how it reacts to peyton choking in the playoffs?

no?

THEN SHUT THE FUCK UP, YOU HAVE NO BASIS OF ARGUMENT

[Edited on November 5, 2006 at 4:04 PM. Reason : fsda]

11/5/2006 4:03:12 PM

Your diety, your God, you savior, Peyton will do swell in the reg season. Post season....Joke. Fact. Even last year when he had the best chance ever to win the SB. What did he do? He lost, and openly blamed his o-line like a coward. Fact.

I've victored for today. I'm gone.

[Edited on November 5, 2006 at 4:05 PM. Reason : .]

11/5/2006 4:04:41 PM

we know that peyton is a choke artist, you are not telling us anything new. no one ever said he wasn't.

but vick still could not hold his jock strap.

yeah, run away like a little pussy after talking in circles

[Edited on November 5, 2006 at 4:06 PM. Reason : hfd]

11/5/2006 4:05:59 PM

now vick will get a chance to pad his stats here in the final 2:30 as they are down by 16 to the lions.

11/5/2006 4:13:00 PM

Yeah, pretty much everyone here gives Peyton the business after blowing playoff games. We give Delhomme shit when he plays like it, and whichever NCSU quarterback is in gets shit on his bad days. I gave Aaron Brooks shit for his bad days, and will give Brees shit for his bad days. Ernie gives Favre shit for his bad days. NyM410 gives Pennington shit for his bad days. 9one9 gives Eli shit for his bad days. My brother, a huge Buffalo Bills and Tulane fan, gives JP Losman shit for his bad days.


Michael Vick fanatics don't give Michael Vick shit for his bad days. It's like he's immune to it.

11/5/2006 4:14:45 PM

Wait a minute.... Vick didnt have a bad day today what are yall talking about.

His numbers are pretty solid. The Atlanta defense is who got torched. When you give up over 450 yards to the Detroit Lions, thats awful.

You realize he's got a shot to rush for 1,000 yards from the QB position right? Amazing season he's putting together.

[Edited on November 5, 2006 at 4:16 PM. Reason : a]

11/5/2006 4:15:36 PM

230 yards and 2 turnovers is not solid

edit:make that 3 turnovers.

a bad defense is no excuse for scoring 14 points on a 1-6 team

[Edited on November 5, 2006 at 4:19 PM. Reason : fdhs]

11/5/2006 4:18:23 PM

ehehe...pads his stats with another INT

11/5/2006 4:19:46 PM

^^^ knew your ass was gonna come here with that weak shit.

[Edited on November 5, 2006 at 4:20 PM. Reason : WAAAAAAAH, DEFENSE'S FAULT VICK COULDN'T PLAY OFFENSE PROPERLY]

[Edited on November 5, 2006 at 4:21 PM. Reason : Let's blame the popcorn for not being salty enough, too]

11/5/2006 4:20:29 PM

haha you're right Sleik. A shitty defense has nothing to do with whether the Falcons win/lose every week.

You guys can spin it however you want but everyone knows Vick wasn't that bad today.

Look it up, most of their drives stalled on penalties.

Its not an excuse, its a reason.


Vick was ranked the #3 QB in the NFL prior to this week. Cant spin that...

11/5/2006 4:25:09 PM

I certainly don't know that. He wasn't the worse QB that played today, but he certaily wasn't a "Golden God", in fact... I would say today was pretty much average for him. Compare it to his season, and his career... pretty average

11/5/2006 4:30:04 PM

he giftwrapped the ball for the other team 3 times. his team scored 14 points against one of the bottom 3 teams in the league. stop trying to sugarcoat it, he had a bad game.

"Cant spin that" even though you are desperately trying.



[Edited on November 5, 2006 at 4:43 PM. Reason : fs]

11/5/2006 4:41:21 PM

Dude.

Coming out of halftime, with the game still in reach... the Falcons went 3 and out.

1-10-ATL14 (14:54) M.Vick pass incomplete short right to A.Lelie.
2-10-ATL14 (14:49) W.Dunn left end to ATL 14 for no gain (K.Kennedy, M.Bell).
3-10-ATL14 (14:11) (Shotgun) M.Vick right end to ATL 19 for 5 yards (K.Smith).

The defense stopped the Lions 3 times on goal to go situations, leading to a FG. Game still in reach...

1-10-ATL44 (8:18) (Shotgun) M.Vick pass incomplete short left to R.White.
2-10-ATL44 (8:14) W.Dunn to ATL 45 for 1 yard (J.DeVries).
3-9-ATL45 (7:42) (Shotgun) M.Vick pass incomplete to A.Crumpler.

Despite the punt, Falcons force a turnover on D, giving Vick the ball back.

1-10-ATL34 (1:15) (Shotgun) M.Vick pass short right to A.Crumpler to ATL 39 for 5 yards (J.DeVries; D.Bly).
2-5-ATL39 (:33) W.Dunn left end to ATL 48 for 9 yards (E.Sims; D.Bullocks).
1-10-ATL48 (15:00) M.Vick pass incomplete short right to M.Jenkins (D.Bly).
2-10-ATL48 (14:54) M.Vick up the middle to 50 for 2 yards (K.Edwards).
3-8-50 (14:04) (Shotgun) PENALTY on ATL-P.Alexander, False Start, 5 yards, enforced at 50 - No Play.
3-13-ATL45 (14:04) (Shotgun) M.Vick scrambles left end to ATL 46 for 1 yard. M.Vick pass incomplete short left to M.Jenkins.
PENALTY on ATL-M.Vick, Illegal Forward Pass, 5 yards, enforced at ATL 46.

He was horrid in the second half with the game still in reach. He scrounged up a respectable final desperation drive with the game out of reach, and even ended that with an INT - a sign of the day for QB #7. If the defense was responsible for giving up so many yards, I wonder how much of it was due to the fact that the offense was very ineffective today, giving the Lions several opportunities TO move the ball upfield.

[Edited on November 5, 2006 at 4:54 PM. Reason : ~]

[Edited on November 5, 2006 at 4:58 PM. Reason : I SOPcasted in and out of this game, and saw Vick revert back to his no-touch passing. har har.]

11/5/2006 4:53:59 PM

okay you pulled out three drives where the run game got stuffed and the offense committed a false start.


3rd and long doesn't get converted often in the NFL.

The reason Vick is a great QB is because he makes BIG plays and he has a knack for converting 3rd and short because the defense doesnt know how to defend him.

No QB is gonna look good on 3rd and 10.

And Im pretty sure the defense looked bad because they were busy giving up long TDs and getting their faces bashed in.

11/5/2006 4:59:02 PM

Quote :

" Detroit turned Vick's two first-half turnovers into touchdowns"

Vick's turnovers

11/5/2006 5:00:48 PM

Quote :

"No QB is gonna look good on 3rd and 10."

Great QBs do...that's what makes them great quarterbacks.

11/5/2006 5:01:17 PM

this thread gets more and more ridiculous by the day

vicks donkey dong is buried so far up rally's ass, that nonsense is spilling out of his mouth

11/5/2006 5:02:12 PM

Yeah from now on whenever Vick turns the ball over they should just award the other team 7 points because it would be completely ridiculous for anyone to expect the defense to hold the other team occasionally.

He didnt play great today. It was a road game, their defense sucked, and their run game couldnt get on track until too late. What do you want from him? He's not Peyton Manning or Tom Brady... he's just better than the rest of the QB's in the league.

11/5/2006 5:05:01 PM

Quote :

"he reason Vick is a great QB is because he makes BIG plays and he has a knack for converting 3rd and short "

Name me some QBs that can't convert 3rd and short...

good fucking lord, dude. I'm tempted to try out this new TWW block user feature on you. And that sucks, because you usually know your shit. I seriously don't know what's inspiring this much apologetic behavior toward Vick. It's like you have a wheel in your bedroom next to your Vick shrine; whenever the Falcons lose, you spin the wheel and whoever it lands on gets the blame for the loss.

Vick is nowhere on this wheel.

11/5/2006 5:05:59 PM

Quote :

"He's not Peyton Manning or Tom Brady... he's just better than the rest of the QB's in the league."

You honestly think he's the 3rd best QB in the league??? Wow.

11/5/2006 5:11:34 PM

He didnt have a great game. He's not the reason they lost. He didnt play well enough to overcome the Falcons deficiencies.

For the Falcons to win football games Vick has to play very well.

For the Bears to win football games Grossman doesnt have to play well.

You cant just look at win/loss records or they will mislead you.

You cant just look at statistics because they often don't tell the story and are easy to manipulate.


You have to look at who PLAYS well and does their job. Most of the time, Vick does that. He didn't play that well today. Even when he doesnt play up to his full potential he's still a pretty decent QB.

That's why he's ranked as the 3rd best QB in the NFL by Scouts, Inc.

Do you not see how irrational it is to call someone "average" when they clearly are one of the elite players in the league??? You can dislike Vick if you want... you can even say he's overrated and say something like "I really think Hasslebeck and McNabb are better than Vick". That's fine.

But when you start calling Vick an average QB and lumping him in with truly average QB's like Jake Delhomme it just makes me wonder why you have so much bias against him. Some of the people even think he "sucks" or is below average.

Its like if I called Kobe Bryant or Kevin Garnett average basketball players. If i said that Derek Jeter "sucks" Id be labelled an idiot. Of course he's not a better player than David Ortiz and of course its silly to give him the MVP over Ortiz. And if i expressed that by saying "wow its a joke Jeter is getting MVP over Ortiz" most educated fans would agree with me. But if i came out saying "Wow Derek Jeter is just an average baseball player why is he getting the MVP" I dont think anyone would put up with that nonsense...

11/5/2006 5:18:54 PM

Quote :

"Do you not see how irrational it is to call someone "average" when they clearly are one of the elite players athletes in the league??? "

There aren't that many elite players in the NFL....you have to at least argue Vick is an elite quarterback before you call him one of the elite players. Because when you say "player", you're bringing in LT, Harrison, Holt, Peppers, Bailey, etc.

And I usually say that Vick is average to above-average. If I had to really decide, I'd say that he's an abover average QB. Which COULD put him in the top 10 on his good days, top 15 on his normal days. When he has games like he did the past two weeks, he's a top 5 QB...but he just doesn't do that often enough. He's way too inconsistent of a passer to be put as a great QB.

11/5/2006 5:28:17 PM

Alright, I think it's pretty obvious rallydurham is just trolling at this point. I don't see how 53% passing, 243 total yards, 3 TOs, and only 1 TD could ever be considered "solid" numbers.

And yes, Derek Jeter actually IS a better player than Ortiz. There's a reason Big Papi DHs most of the time. Sure, Ortiz has the advantage hitting for power but Jeter is equally adept at hitting for average and exponentially better when it comes to fielding, throwing accuracy and strength, and base running ability. Just for the record, I HATE Jeter and the Yankees.

11/5/2006 5:30:17 PM

Vick was rated the 12th best QB in the league in the weeks prior to his 2 great games. That list was one websites OPINION of Vick's performance, and the list was not meant to be the "3 best QB's in the league" it was a list of the the "3 hottest QB's in the league" and given Vick's performance the past 2 weeks, he deserved to be on that list... you aren't going to find a list anywhere though that claims Vick is the 3rd best QB in the NFL though... after his performance this week he will even drop back down several spots on the list you keep citing

11/5/2006 5:32:04 PM

Quote :

"Vick was rated the 12th best QB in the league in the weeks prior to his 2 great games. That list was one websites OPINION of Vick's performance, and the list was not meant to be the "3 best QB's in the league" it was a list of the the "3 hottest QB's in the league" and given Vick's performance the past 2 weeks, he deserved to be on that list... you aren't going to find a list anywhere though that claims Vick is the 3rd best QB in the NFL though... after his performance this week he will even drop back down several spots on the list you keep citing"

BURN

11/5/2006 5:35:56 PM

^ In no way is that a burn. You cant just make stuff up and have it be right. Coming into todays game Vick was rated the #3 QB in the NFL based on this seasons production. He isnt gonna fall more than 1-2 spots after today i doubt. One game is not gonna alter his entire seasons performance that much particularly when he wasnt that ineffective. I hate to tell you but its not just "some website". This isnt a blog by a casual fan, its rankings by Scouts Inc. the official expert analysis. You know how i learned so much about sports? By reading/listening to people who know more than me. I dont just make arbitrary assumptions and then try to pass them off as wisdom. Vick is one of the elite QB's in the NFL and thats not up for discussion.

Tell you what, im going to make a deal. This thread is just tiresome because you guys either dont understand the NFL or you just hate Vick. Either way we've established the fact that its one of the two.

So, if you guys stop spazzing out after Vicks occasional "off" game then ill stop rubbing your nose in it after every game he takes over.

At the end of the season when he gets voted into the Pro Bowl ill come back and post this image.




[Edited on November 5, 2006 at 5:51 PM. Reason : a]

11/5/2006 5:42:41 PM

i don't think anybody in this thread has tried to deny he is great in some games, and when he plays great we give him credit. You, however, refuse to admit he is at fault when he plays poorly, which so happens to be half of the time... you blame it on every possible thing BUT Vick

11/5/2006 5:44:50 PM

Quote :

"Vicks occasional "off" game"

These are not "off" games when they occur 75% of the time.

[Edited on November 5, 2006 at 5:52 PM. Reason : ]

11/5/2006 5:46:13 PM

^^^ go ahead and start writing your Vick pro bowl voting program

[Edited on November 5, 2006 at 5:47 PM. Reason : ;]

11/5/2006 5:47:28 PM