http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/ticket/obama-warns-u-must-iran-152753460--election.html


....after Moumoud says on national TV that he has no clue what he is going to do with 1 nuclear weapon against the United States has 5600 trained on him. He is not even attempting to build a nuclear weapon.

http://www.cbsnews.com/video/watch/?id=7422940n


Ahmadinejad: “You see, we did shut down all of the nuclear installations once. But not only the wishes and limitations [of the U.S.] did not decrease, but they were multiplied. Despite all of this we’re still holding a dialogue and we have set forth all of this very sound proposals to the 5 plus 1…..”

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/post-partisan/post/an-interview-with-irans-president-mahmoud-ahmadinejad/2012/09/23/2a645816-05d3-11e2-afff-d6c7f20a83bf_blog.html



When will you believe me that the United States is running on a script that is going to lead up to war regardless of the truth?

9/25/2012 2:30:47 PM

http://www.veteranstoday.com/2012/09/20/1992-breaking-news-netanyahu-says-iran-close-to-nuclear-weapon/



1992: Israeli member of parliament Binyamin Netanyahu predicts that Iran was “3 to 5 years” from having a nuclear weapon.

1992: Israeli Foreign Minister Shimon Peres predicts an Iranian nuclear warhead by 1999 to French TV.

1995: The New York Times quotes US and Israeli officials saying that Iran would have the bomb by 2000.

1998: Donald Rumsfeld tells Congress that Iran could have an intercontinental ballistic missile that could hit the US by 2003.

9/25/2012 2:35:22 PM

How long do we have to not be at war with Iran for this to be a failed prediction?

9/25/2012 2:36:47 PM

However long it takes for Ron Paul to become President!

9/25/2012 3:09:45 PM

http://edition.cnn.com/2012/09/24/world/meast/iran-ahmadinejad-interview/index.html

Clarification of the oft repeated "Israel must be wiped from the earth" line by U.S. war propagandists:

Quote :

"So when we say 'to be wiped,' we say for occupation to be wiped off from this world. For war-seeking to (be) wiped off and eradicated, the killing of women and children to be eradicated. And we propose the way. We propose the path. The path is to recognize the right of the Palestinians to self-governance."

On the possibility of Iran developing weapons:

Quote :

"But my question is this: Why should the world be managed in such a way that an individual can allow himself to threaten a rich and deeply rooted historical, ancient country such as Iran? A great country, such as Iran, based on an excuse of his own fabrication. ... Another country can say, 'I am guessing that country B is doing activity X, therefore I will attack that country' ... can this be ... a successful formula for the management of the world?"

On the anti-Islam film:

Quote :

"Likewise, we condemn any type of extremism. Of course, what took place was ugly. Offending the Holy Prophet is quite ugly. This has very little or nothing to do with freedom and freedom of speech. This is the weakness of and the abuse of freedom, and in many places it is a crime. It shouldn't take place, and I do hope the day will come in which politicians will not seek to offend those whom others hold holy," Ahmadinejad said. We also believe that this must also be resolved in a humane atmosphere, in a participatory environment, and we do not like anyone losing their lives or being killed for any reason, anywhere in the world."

9/25/2012 3:10:22 PM

Quote :

"Clarification of the oft repeated "Israel must be wiped from the earth" line by U.S. war propagandists: Quote : "So when we say 'to be wiped,' we say for occupation to be wiped off from this world. For war-seeking to (be) wiped off and eradicated, the killing of women and children to be eradicated. And we propose the way. We propose the path. The path is to recognize the right of the Palestinians to self-governance." "

I appreciate what your'e trying to do, but you're trading one propaganda for another.


^^^

Iran is now actively refining nuclear material. Of course they are trying to get a bomb, they'd be dumb NOT to. We aren't expending all these diplomatic resources to stop them for nothing...

The question just boils down to what to do about it. They are a sovereign country, and they are using their own brains to figure stuff out, how much of a stop can you put to this? Is it ethical to tell scientists and engineers not to do science and engineering?

[Edited on September 25, 2012 at 3:27 PM. Reason : ]

9/25/2012 3:25:27 PM

Quote :

"I appreciate what your'e trying to do, but you're trading one propaganda for another."

No, I'm really not. Do your homework and learn what the man actually said.

9/25/2012 3:37:04 PM

It seems to me they'd be pretty dumb TO build a bomb, seeing as how they've signed the NPT and they stand to lose a lot if we get actionable intelligence to suggest they actually are creating nuclear weapons instead of peaceful nuclear technology. They only need to look next door to see what happened to a guy who wasn't actually doing it but the world thought/was duped into thinking that he was.

Of course, that's assuming they are rational actors, and not a doomsday cult that thinks a mushroom cloud over Jerusalem is some fulfillment of prophesy.

I'm just wondering why anyone thinks his "clarification" of the "wiped off the world" comment is better. They openly want to eradicate Israel, who is currently for better or worse one of our allies. I don't care for Israel, how it was created, or our current political relationship with them, but his comments are still pretty clear.

[Edited on September 25, 2012 at 3:43 PM. Reason : .]

9/25/2012 3:37:20 PM

Quote :

"No, I'm really not. Do your homework and learn what the man actually said."

and there's no way he's politicking, right? everything he says is truth.

9/25/2012 3:38:45 PM

No, he's a politician, so he's scum like the rest.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahmoud_Ahmadinejad_and_Israel#Translation_controversy

Read. Let the knowledge sink in. Yeah, I know you all get your jollies from shouting down the libertarians, but fucking learn something for god damn once.

Quote :

"It seems to me they'd be pretty dumb TO build a bomb, seeing as how they've signed the NPT and they stand to lose a lot if we get actionable intelligence to suggest they actually are creating nuclear weapons instead of peaceful nuclear technology. They only need to look next door to see what happened to a guy who wasn't actually doing it but the world thought/was duped into thinking that he was."

Notice how the United States doesn't mess with countries that have nuclear bombs. The trick is to develop one without the U.S. intervening first, because once you actually have one, you're relatively safe.

[Edited on September 25, 2012 at 3:47 PM. Reason : ]

9/25/2012 3:44:16 PM

I've seen this before, yes, perhaps he was misinterpreted.

M point is why do you trust what his words anymore than the us propaganda?

9/25/2012 3:47:52 PM

I don't trust his words. I think he would have to be incredibly stupid to initiate war against any country, especially the U.S. or Israel, but I don't think he is necessarily being any more truthful than other politicians.

My point is that the U.S. media distorts his words. It's an easy thing to do since he doesn't speak English and most Americans are too lazy to do anything remotely resembling research, even though "research" takes 15 seconds of googling.

9/25/2012 3:49:50 PM

How is "must vanish from the page of time" or "must be eliminated from the pages of history" any different than "be wiped from the Earth?"

They seem like idiomatic approximates to me. <shrug>

9/25/2012 3:52:24 PM

and his discussion about the anti-islam film doesn't make him look any better.

9/25/2012 3:53:15 PM

^^Why are you omitting a critical part of the sentence? What should be wiped from the earth? Jews? Israel?

No, he was saying that the regime (that is, the individuals currently running the government of Israel) should be removed from power. It's not much different than saying Obama/Romney should not be President.

[Edited on September 25, 2012 at 3:58 PM. Reason : ]

9/25/2012 3:55:56 PM

^^^ exactly.

I've red tons of articles about the "mistranslation" but the gist was that Ahmedinjad would have been happy with Israel not existing. It's not too different than our president putting them in the Axis of Evil, or the countless other people in our country that have said we should nuke Iran, but there's no rationalizing that Ahmedinijad's sentiment wasn't much different than saying they wanted to destroy Israel.

[Edited on September 25, 2012 at 3:57 PM. Reason : ]

[Edited on September 25, 2012 at 3:57 PM. Reason : ]

9/25/2012 3:57:35 PM

I mean, that's not what this thread is really about, but colloquially speaking when someone says "Amadinnerjacket said he wants to wipe Israel off the face of the Earth", are they really insinuating that he wants to kill every jew on the planet? We all know he thinks Israel is an occupying regime (not saying I totally disagree with him there) and that's what he's referring to.

That's my point. I don't think his clarification changed anything, but maybe I'm listening to different people talking about it.

And functionally speaking the dissolution of the Israeli government would quickly be the destruction of the Jewish people in Israel so it isn't really isn't that different.

[Edited on September 25, 2012 at 4:04 PM. Reason : .]

9/25/2012 3:59:00 PM

I'll take Ahmadinejad seriously once he starts doing something about victims of rape and domestic violence getting stoned and thrown in jail.

9/25/2012 4:24:49 PM

I don't see how Ahmedinjad's rhetoric is any worse than Netanyahu's bellicose rhetoric about acting unilaterally to prevent Iran from attaining nuclear weapons. It's a ridiculous double standard that the US and Israel put on the rest of the world. We have people who are high ranking US officials saying they want to "bomb, bomb, bomb, bomb bomb Iran" and people running for the presidency who say they would support Israel unconditionally. Apparently we're allowed to flex nuts, but our adversaries are not. Stupid.

MEK has been de-listed from the US terrorist list, by the way:

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/americas/2012/09/201292285758789844.html
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2012/sep/23/iran-usa

9/25/2012 4:27:53 PM

Look, they signed the NPT. They're on board with the "no more nukes for anyone" plan. Surely they should be held to it.

Israel, however, can eat a bag of dicks as far as I'm concerned for not signing it.

9/25/2012 4:31:37 PM

the only way Iran will ever convince Israel to eat a bag of dicks would be to get a nuclear weapon.

9/25/2012 4:35:52 PM

Quote :

" My point is why do you trust what his words anymore than the us propaganda?"

Why do so many users in here and on this site put so much trust in the United States government?
It's so bad, that they don't even question American news or politicians.

They don't even try to look at the evidence and use logic.

This is evidence that the United State CENSORS our news. This happened today in Madrid Spain.
I don't see shit about it on the news.





BREAKING NEWS - September 25 2012, Madrid, Spain - Citizens have surrounded the Congress building in Madrid and are demanding immediate resignation of the Government


THIS IS WHAT WE SHOULD BE DOING FOLKS. THIS IS HOW CORRUPT THE UNITED STATES GOVERNMENT IS.

9/25/2012 5:59:30 PM

the spain thing is going on right now... live stream http://thegic.org/

9/25/2012 6:01:03 PM

Quote :

"Why do so many users in here and on this site put so much trust in the United States government?"

Jeez man, you really think in absolutes. I asked the dude why why he trusts what amendidjacket says in an interview. That doesn't mean i put "so much trust" in the U.S government. Do you understand that?

9/25/2012 6:06:24 PM

Quote :

"This is evidence that the United State CENSORS our news. This happened today in Madrid Spain. I don't see shit about it on the news."

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/09/25/us-spain-budget-idUSBRE88O0PU20120925

(i found a story about it on reuters)


[Edited on September 25, 2012 at 6:16 PM. Reason : ]

9/25/2012 6:08:26 PM

Quote :

"Jeez man, you really think in absolutes. I asked the dude why why he trusts what amendidjacket says in an interview. That doesn't mean i put "so much trust" in the U.S government. Do you understand that?"

Maybe it's because feel surrounded by apathy and it's already common knowledge that we are doomed if people don't wake up even when all this shit is going on around them.

At this point....Trust no one.

Look at the events going on.
Look at history.
This is a game of chess.

Who's honest?
Who Flip Flops?
Whose actions can't be justified?
Who didn't fulfill their promises?
Who has?
Who doesn't talk about the Constitution?
Who does?
Who can we trust?
Who can't we?
Who controls who?
Who changes what?


If you can't answer these questions, then you're not doing your homework.
We are standing in the future.... of our past.
How did we get to this point?
Who made accurate predictions?
How did they know?
Did they have access to the information?
Who made inaccurate predictions?
Why did they screw up?
Did they have access to the information?
Did they lie?
How do we know?






This is real life. People are DYING. Massacred.
The people in our government do. not. care.
They will not care about you when you are killed either.
They don't care if you're American.
They don't care if you didn't do anything wrong.

The fact that you exist is enough reason to kill you.

9/25/2012 6:28:08 PM

I think what Geniusboy is getting at is that we should exterminate all the Jews before their plan for complete and total world domination is complete.

9/25/2012 6:56:25 PM

He's just a loon. And he derails more threads in TSB than I can count.

I listened to 15 minutes of NPR at lunch today and they mentioned the Spanish austerity discussion and potential for protest in Madrid. It's not some censored story like he wants people to believe.

For fuck's sake, it was a lead story when I was working on the Bloomberg today.

For posterity here is the bloomberg article (updated 6:01PM):
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-09-25/catalan-leader-calls-early-elections-in-challenge-to-rajoy.html


[Edited on September 25, 2012 at 9:35 PM. Reason : x]

9/25/2012 9:12:50 PM

Quote :

"This happened today in Madrid Spain. I don't see shit about it on the news."

hahaha, damn. As two people have already pointed out, that shit was definitely in the news today - Choose a fucking real news source and you may actually see things being covered.

9/25/2012 9:34:26 PM

You guys are so fucking narrow minded it makes me physically want to throw up.

"I don't see shit about it on the news." should not be taken literally. it should be taken relative to the shit you see about a fucking film about islam.


Have a nice day dumbshits.

9/25/2012 10:41:29 PM

From the Reuters story

Quote :

"With this year's budget deficit target looking untenable, the conservative government is now looking at such things as cuts in inflation-linked pensions, taxes on stock transactions, "green taxes" on emissions or eliminating tax breaks."

what do you think of that?

9/25/2012 10:57:01 PM

Quote :

"This is evidence that the United State CENSORS our news. This happened today in Madrid Spain."

I guess that's why I saw a bunch of shit about it on CNBC today.



ooooooooooh, we're not supposed to take your words literally now... what are you, the Bible?

9/26/2012 12:24:43 AM

The new world order accuses Ahmadinejad of pushing a new world order....

The theater of the absurd!!

http://news.yahoo.com/ap-interview-ahmadinejad-pushes-world-order-235145610.html

[Edited on September 26, 2012 at 1:13 AM. Reason : .]

9/26/2012 1:12:20 AM

Outrageous. He's saying what we all (should) know to be true. Empire building should cease. There should be no one super power that shits on whomever they please. Even so-called "liberals" support this policy of imperialism.

9/26/2012 11:34:01 AM

http://news.yahoo.com/greek-government-faces-first-big-anti-austerity-strike-074143311--business.html



[Edited on September 26, 2012 at 12:52 PM. Reason : .]

9/26/2012 12:49:46 PM

Ahmadinejad's full speech transcript:

http://gadebate.un.org/sites/default/files/gastatements/67/IR_en.pdf

There's some pretty wise stuff in there. This is the kind of talk that makes him a high priority enemy of the U.S. government. Of course, when the rabid U.S. media gets a hold of it, the only thing that will be mentioned is "The New World Order". There will be no discussion on the meat of the speech - the (correct) assertion that Western powers (primarily, the U.S.) have allowed moral decay and consumerism to take root.

9/26/2012 2:46:50 PM

So is this just the link posting thread?

9/26/2012 2:50:36 PM

Wait, it's the governments job to prevent consumerism and select the morals for the people?

9/26/2012 6:13:34 PM

You aren't dumb enough to believe that I was making that assertion.

The fact that morality in the U.S. has declined or disappeared is made clear by the peoples' tolerance for policies that destroy lives. We live in a country where the future of unborn children is sacrificed so we can kill and destroy in other countries for the benefit of a select few. It doesn't get much worse than that.

The people not only support these policies, but they celebrate and are proud of them in many cases.

9/26/2012 7:19:43 PM

Americans are no more or less moral than any other people.

Anyone who's spent time in another country/culture must surely realize this...

The only reason poor countries aren't consumerist are because they're poor. If/when they become more developed, they'll be just as consumerist as we are.

If I had to choose between societal decadence, or a muslim/christian theocracy, i'll take the former.

Although I can see why the latter is appealing to some.

[Edited on September 26, 2012 at 7:33 PM. Reason : ]

9/26/2012 7:32:08 PM

It's a fact our morality has declined? Please support with evidence.

9/26/2012 7:33:50 PM

Quote :

"We live in a country where the future of unborn children is sacrificed so we can kill and destroy in other countries for the benefit of a select few. It doesn't get much worse than that."

There it is. You skim over this part because it requires you to face the incredibly dark truth, but it's right there.

We borrow money at low interest rates. This money will have to be paid back by future generations.

Using borrowed money, we lock up or kill innocent people in other countries. We spend billions and trillions on weapons of destruction.

I cannot think of anything more evil than stealing from the unborn and killing the innocent. The United States government does both every single day.

9/26/2012 7:36:48 PM

Quote :

" http://news.yahoo.com/greek-government-faces-first-big-anti-austerity-strike-074143311--business.html"

that must be part of the gov't censorship, which is why we can't see that story, right?

9/26/2012 7:43:42 PM

How is it a fact that our morality has decreased? By what metric?

9/26/2012 7:46:32 PM

^
I agree. We've been a sociopathic nation since the beginning. Nothing has changed except technology and the groups of people we take advantage of.

[Edited on September 26, 2012 at 7:55 PM. Reason : .]

9/26/2012 7:54:55 PM

That's a fair point. I think the point I was trying to convey is that the United States is a thoroughly immoral nation. Whether it was any better in the past is largely immaterial; currently policies reflect a culture that has experienced a severe degree of moral decay.

9/26/2012 8:04:41 PM

I guess the Constitution that was written was secretly a ploy to enslave all people and to start endless wars.

9/26/2012 8:56:40 PM

I can never tell if geniusxboy is being sarcastic or not

9/26/2012 10:03:46 PM

Quote :

" currently policies reflect a culture that has experienced a severe degree of moral decay. "

Based on what??

Our equal rights for blacks and women? Support for poor people, new mothers, families, and old people? A secular government that allows for religious tolerance? Labors laws that stopped the robber-barons from exploiting people? Not carpet bombing entire cities in wars?

Some things have gotten worse, but in general, we've gotten better as a country.

9/26/2012 10:42:48 PM

Quote :

"I guess the Constitution that was written was secretly a ploy to enslave all people and to start endless wars."

No secret to it. It pretty blatantly allowed for slavery.

9/26/2012 10:51:55 PM