Good Morning TWW,

In regards to euthanasia, I've been hearing it's all about the quality of life. But how do you define this in your mind? Or do you just let nature take its course?

Also, if you've had personal experience with this,
1. Was it due to age or some other reason?
2. Did the vet come to you to do it?
3. What do you do with the physical body? Burial, cremation, or other?

I'm specifically concerned for a 13+ year old dog, but opinions on any type of pet is appreciated.

Thanks

6/1/2011 8:45:50 AM

Back when I was growing up, if a dog was real bad sick or really bad injured we'd take it to one of the fields, shhot it then bury it. Growing up we were too poor for really expensive vet treatments. But then again, all of our dogs were hound dogs.

6/1/2011 8:50:40 AM

Our dog got some sort of cancer. Lost most of his fur, couldn't go up steps without help, couldn't control his bladder. When he started howling in pain throughout the night, we all agreed it was time. We had a mobile vet come to our house and put our dog down there. At least he was surrounded by his loved ones in his bed and not left alone on some cold metal vet table to die. We buried him in our backyard.





[Edited on June 1, 2011 at 8:58 AM. Reason : sad]

6/1/2011 8:57:58 AM

Is the animal suffering? Can the animal's suffering be alleviated at a reasonable cost that will not significantly burden human members of your family? If not, then it's time to put it down. You owe it to your pets not to let them suffer and you owe it to your kids not to drain their college fund on an animal that's probably not going to last much longer anyway.

6/1/2011 9:26:54 AM

i've been thinking about this more and more as my oldest dog has started to get closer to that time

i'm not a violent person, and i'm not sure why i feel so strongly about it - but i feel as though it's my job to do the duty when the time comes - she's my dog, my good friend, and limiting any pain and suffering as she goes is very important to me. i honestly dont trust the purple death juice - and i feel like it's just not right to let someone else besides me put her down.

6/1/2011 9:53:09 AM

Had to deal with this about 3 months ago. My dog who was about 10 was acting funny when I went to work. Didn't think much of it at the time, but when my wife got up she was acting very strange. Shaking, whining, etc. She dropped her off at the vets about 20 minutes away before she went to work. I didn't know. The vet called me and said her stomach had flipped. Was cutting off circulation, gas was building up, her temp was down to like 85 and the only places that could do the procedure were an hour + away, would cost minimum $1500 and at this stage is was 50/50 that she would live. I hated to have to put her down, but she was really suffering. Really sucked that nobody was even there to be with her when they put her down. I hated that, but it was for the best.

6/1/2011 9:56:41 AM

^^I would do some research on it. Talk to your vet. Most will let you be in the room when they put her to sleep. I think that veterinarian supervised euthanasia will be a lot more peaceful than anything you could do to her yourself. Plus you can be in there petting her and talking to her as she passes.

I should not be thinking about this stuff when I'm at work. :'(

[Edited on June 1, 2011 at 10:58 AM. Reason : room]

6/1/2011 10:57:56 AM

Yeah, I think I'd let a professional do it if only for the chance that I'd mess it up and cause undue suffering.

6/1/2011 11:08:11 AM

My cat got a growth on her head that turned out to be cancer. It was going at an exponential rate and soon was twice as big as her head. We could have sent her to NCSU for cancer treatment, so Mom asked if I wanted go to NCSU or if I wanted my cat to go instead. Poor Kitty.

6/1/2011 11:10:57 AM

Quote :

"i honestly dont trust the purple death juice - and i feel like it's just not right to let someone else besides me put her down."

you're entitled to your opinion, but i personally do not want the last thing my pet sees/experiences is me killing them. no thank you sir

6/1/2011 1:26:31 PM

because, well, its going to remember it when its dead and everything

6/1/2011 1:29:57 PM

no it won't, but i will.

6/1/2011 1:31:09 PM

If you're asking to define "quality of life" then you are already questioning your pet's quality of life which should be a red flag right there.
Your animal isn't going to tell you when it's in pain unless it starts to yelp, meow, howl, etc and by that time they are in considerable pain. Animals do not want to draw attention to themselves when they are ill so if they are showing it, something is VERY wrong.

With my cat for instance I put as much money as I could afford into it, which was my personal decision because she was my cat and my responsibility. She went downhill extremely suddenly. I woke up one morning and she couldn't lift her head from the bed. I drove with one hand to the vet's office and her wrapped in a towel in my other hand and she started going into agonal breathing, I knew it was too late. I pulled over and she died in my arms about 3 miles from the vet's office before I could put her down. I cried and cried and cried and never felt so badly in my fucking life.

I implore you, if you think it's bad, do your animal a favor and euthanize them if they are suffering.

I chose to bury my cat.

Quote :

"i honestly dont trust the purple death juice"

The "purple death juice" is Fatal Plus. It is dyed blue for easy identification and contains pentobarbital sodium. It is quick and it is humane. What exactly don't you trust about it? I would rather a professional take care of my animal than risk causing it more harm and a horrible death by trying to do something you are not qualified to do.

6/1/2011 1:37:56 PM

Our family dog was 14. One day my mom looked outside, saw her hobbling around in pain, and bleeding from her anus. Took her in; she had a tumor the size of a softball on her colon, and it was spreading. There were no other signs b4 that she was sick. Vet said she prolly wouldn't survive surgery nor live long after if she did. She was 14; it was an easy decision although heartbreaking.

Due to neighborhood ordinances, we couldn't bury her in our yard. So we had her cremated.

RIP Molly

6/1/2011 2:04:16 PM

Dilemmas I don't want to think about ITT

6/1/2011 3:02:26 PM

Quote :

"It is quick and it is humane"

- i mean i would hope so but what the animal really feels is up for debate - amiright? i know companies and vets wouldnt knowingly produce/use something that would be painful or prolong the experience - but still - shit's up for debate as you can't do an exit survey.

Quote :

"but i personally do not want the last thing my pet sees/experiences is me killing them."

not to be rude but how would they know what is going on? i would still be there by their side petting with kind words -

i doubt i would ever have the balls to do it, mainly because of many of the arguments brought up *(risk of more harm or a horrible death etc) but i still feel like it's my duty for some reason - hopefully i'll feel different with time as i have never killed something and would prefer for the first time to NOT be my best friend.

6/1/2011 3:06:50 PM

jesus this thread is depressing.

6/1/2011 3:07:33 PM

Quote :

"not to be rude but how would they know what is going on? i would still be there by their side petting with kind words"

when this has been discussed here before, most of the people who say they would want to put their animal down themselves mean they want to take it out back & shoot it. one of my dogs knows what a gun is & that it can hurt (neighbor shoots a pellet rifle & the dog is TERRIFIED when he comes outside w/ it). and it's not that most animals are going to sit there & be like omg is mom about to shoot me, it's me humanizing the animal & making myself feel bad.

6/1/2011 3:26:05 PM

My mom put down her dog last year. He was 16, deaf, blind, and could barely walk. She had to carry him outside to shit and piss.

If it were me, he would have been put down way before it got to that point.

I doubt that helps. But in my opinion, once he/she stops being able to take care of itself or is in extreme pain, it's the right thing to do to end it.

6/1/2011 3:38:42 PM

Quote :

"i mean i would hope so but what the animal really feels is up for debate - amiright? i know companies and vets wouldnt knowingly produce/use something that would be painful or prolong the experience - but still - shit's up for debate as you can't do an exit survey."

I see what you're saying and I understand, but there ARE ways to determine pain and distress in animals like measuring cortisol levels. And those things ARE taken into consideration when those drugs are made and during the testing phases. Euthanasia literally means "good death" so it's up to us as pet owners or researchers or whatever to give them the best life that they can have, even if it means taking it away so that they can be free from pain and suffering.

Try not to think of it as depressing, you've given your pet the best life you were able and your pet has brought happiness to you in return.

6/1/2011 3:39:05 PM

^They've used that stuff on people before too. The effects should be tacked down fairly well.

6/1/2011 3:42:58 PM

pentobarbitol is used in humans as well for the induction and maintenance of a medical coma.

it shuts down brain wave activity. it shuts brain activity down to the point where the person or animal stops breathing. no brain activity means no perception or recollection of pain.

it is a good medication to use for pet euthanasia.

also it is the black market drug of choice for folks with terminal illnesses wishing to end their own suffering. folks buy it in mexico from animal health supply stores.

6/2/2011 2:01:20 AM

Quote :

"Dilemmas I don't want to think about ITT"

Memento mori, bro.

6/2/2011 9:45:14 AM

We had to put a dog down a few years ago due to age and medical issues. She couldn't get up and down on her own without being in constant pain, loss of appetite, ect... So I took her to the animal shelter helped get her on the table and watched as they gave her the shot. It took 15 to 30 seconds and it really looked like she was going to sleep. I left her with the shelter. They were going to cremate her. The dog was a mastiff mix with severe hip dysplasia. It was sad, but we couldn't afford hip surgery and the dog was 9+ years old (not sure on exact age since we rescued her from the pound). The animal shelter was really nice, much cheaper then the vet and wasn't as bad of an option that I thought it was going to be.

RIP Cleo


I love animals, we've got five dogs now. I'm dreading the day that we'll have to put our next one down. She's moving a lot more slowly and has a few other little medical things that are starting to add up at her age.

6/2/2011 10:11:59 AM

Quote :

"one of my dogs knows what a gun is & that it can hurt (neighbor shoots a pellet rifle & the dog is TERRIFIED when he comes outside w/ it)."

your neighbor probably shot your dog with it while you weren't around.

6/2/2011 12:18:08 PM

This...this is a terrible thread

6/2/2011 12:29:05 PM

^^REALLY?! YOU THINK?!

6/2/2011 12:56:39 PM

^you post that as if it is the only reason a dog can fear abrupt, loud noises

6/2/2011 1:02:38 PM

Quote :

"Or do you just let nature take its course? "

Just remember by bringing an animal into your house, you are already interfering with nature. You give it free shelter, food, medicine, and love, which is far different from nature. You are, in a sense, playing God. If this dog was truly out in the wild and it was in the condition you describe, it would probably survive less than a week.

I'm not trying to be a dick here, I just hate the old "let nature take its course" riff. My dad and step-mom are crazy poodle people. I think they owned 9 toy poodles total, the most at any one time being 7. They are fairly well off, and would let them live forever basically until things just got ridiculous. They spent a lot of money on them on various medications, etc, but many of them needed to be put to sleep probably years before they were. One was 99% blind, had seizures, and had to wear a diaper, but they used the excuse that they wanted to let nature take its course. The fact is, they were just being selfish. Wanting to let something terminally ill live is not helping it, it is simply helping the people around it avoid dealing with the inevitable.

6/2/2011 1:18:18 PM

^^his pellet gun is not a loud noise... You can barely hear it actually. the dog gets freaked out when she SEES him with it, not just hears him

6/2/2011 1:50:55 PM

Dogs are scared of random shit. My dog is terrified of my bong and my spatula and I've never used either to harm him.

6/2/2011 1:58:19 PM

^^Not to mention the sound of real firearms doesn't bother her much
She's a smart dog.

6/2/2011 2:04:03 PM

Back home two dogs have been hit by cars and left miserable enough that they had to be put down quickly. Survival wasn't going to happen. Firearms were involved. It was not pleasant but it had to beat the misery they were going through, if the noises were anything to go by.

Both of them were buried on the premises.

6/2/2011 2:07:45 PM

Everyone thinks their dog is smart. But very few are.

6/2/2011 2:08:21 PM

she's a border collie. she is very smart (knows names of different toys, people, places, etc). there's no real point in going into this though, especially in this thread.

6/2/2011 2:23:55 PM

^^ My dog is a chihuahua, and is a dumbass. But he'll also probably live for at maybe another decade, so he's got that going for him. (he's 7 now)

6/2/2011 2:49:28 PM

^^i always wanted a border collie - a guy i knew trained his to fetch tools - he'd bring him on job sites - also knew how *(supposedly) to get beers out of the fridge -

6/2/2011 2:54:50 PM

It's actually not hard to teach a dog to do that. They just have to be strong enough to open the fridge door. A teacup poodle would make a poor beer wench

6/2/2011 3:08:45 PM

^you havent met one of my dogs - we tried for 2years to teach him how to shake - no luck

with my shep - 5 min to roll-over

2 days to say i love you - or howl something that could be received as such

6/2/2011 3:13:35 PM

I am a zookeeper so we have to deal with this all the time. Its never easy, it can be hard losing even something like a toad. We grow real close to our animals even ones that people dont think have personalities.
At work when this comes up we have a sheet we go by. This is the quality of life discussion. We mostly go over things like is the animal eating? can the animal take care of itself as far as grooming or is it basically resting in its own waste without a person helping it? What is the treatment like if there is one, how much stress would this animal be going through? There is a difference in a prey animal versus something like a dog.
Basically in your heart of hearts you will know when its right. If there is any doubt in your mind that you are keeping the animal alive for your OWN reasons such as you will miss it or something like that then its probably time to put it down as well. You have to take yourself out of the equation as far as your emotions

6/2/2011 7:47:32 PM

I'm glad so far all of my pets have died on their own accord before they started shitting themselves or yowling in pain. Something tells me I won't remain that lucky forever

6/2/2011 7:57:21 PM

We have a dog, a Gold Retriever, that is 13.5 years old. He has bad hips, cancer in his mouth and cataracts.

Last weekend when I was home, he didn't look so well. The dog already was very resistant to getting up to do anything without bribing him. Usually he would do ANYTHING my mother tells him to do, they are very close. But even she had to bribe him just to get up sometimes. To make matters worse, they have hard wood floors all downstairs. His legs are VERY VERY shaky, he has immense problems going up 3 of the steps on our porch. He will get up to eat, and he is eating "fine." The tumor in his mouth makes it very difficult for him to eat and drink.

The worst part was in the morning on Friday, he would "yelp." I have never heard him do that before. It wasn't anywhere near a bark. My father went down once or twice and he would stop for a few minutes, but would start again. I had to take a shit and was in the bathroom. It wasn't until my mother came downstairs that he got up and tried to go into the bathroom where I was in (I was just finishing my shit). I let him in and he drank some water. It was just sad.

To make matters worse, my mother now works full time so nobody is there to take care of him.

He is old, he has cancer, his hips are shot and he is in pain. He has been a great dog for the past 13.5 years, but he needs to be put down. My father agrees with me, my brother probably agrees, but my mother simply does not want to let go. The dog has been at her side since we first got him. He follows her everywhere.

The last time I tried confronting her about it, she spazzed out and just said "He's eating, he can still walk and he can go to the bathroom." If that's the qualification of a good quality of life, then I guess I have some news to break to some terminal cancer patients who are in the final stages...

And even now, he can barely go to the bathroom. He's just pissing in the front yard because he can't make it to the back.

I don't know what to do. It's his time, and if we just let him go naturally or if my mother waits until he is in absolute pain to the point he cries continuously, I will snap on my mother and call her a selfish bitch who fucked up. I will probably do everything in my power to make her feel like shit, since she just wants to turn a blind eye to all of his problems.

6/2/2011 8:47:23 PM

^

Sounds like you should make an appointment with the vet when your mom's at work and then just say the dog died and leave it at that.

6/2/2011 8:55:59 PM

I assure you the "purple death juice" is the way to go if you are letting a professional handle it. The amount is calculated, and is different for each animal. Plus, since you can administer it through the vein it is very, very fast and causes no pain.


I completely agree with it being all about the quality of life. I think it's important to note that a quality of life being impacted doesn't have to be for physical reasons alone... Our german shepherd had to be put down a few years ago because he literally lost his mind. The vet (ALkatraz's dad, aka an amazing vet) talked about it with my mom and confirmed he was slowly going insane. He began ripping wood off the side of the house and would go into this super crazy mode, even after trying calming medications. His pupils would get very dilated and his whole demeanor changed... He would never attack or anything like that, but he was completely destructive to the point of hurting himself. :\

6/2/2011 9:46:15 PM

^^ My mom isn't stupid and I don't live at their house any more. I like 3.5 hours away. It's more of my father needs to man up and tell her how it's going to be.

6/2/2011 10:10:56 PM

merbig:

When I was much younger, we had a 15+ yr old chocolate lab with very similar problems. A large tumor in her mouth made it very difficult to eat, and when she did try to eat it would usually cause the tumor to start bleeding. She became more and more lethargic, until it got to the point where she wouldn't get up to go outside before she had to pee/poop

I think we waited longer than we should have before we took her to be euthanized. Thinking about it now makes me feel terrible, but nothing I can do now will change what we did. I can only give advice to people in similar situations

You know what needs to be done.

god damn this is a sad thread

[Edited on June 2, 2011 at 11:03 PM. Reason : .]

6/2/2011 11:02:42 PM

Well after reading some of the replies, my dog is still pretty healthy and self sufficient. She is partially deaf, slightly wobbly in one hind leg, has trouble climbing more than 3 steps, seldomly pees on her bed, drinks a lot lot of water, takes longer than before to recover from a walk, and has tumors on her underside. She ocassionally barks but it seems to be because she doesn't want to be alone in the house.

On the flipside, she still barks to go out and can consistently walk a mile every other day.

My limit is probably when she can't go to the bathroom by herself OR if she starts vocalizing her pain OR if she stops eating.

6/3/2011 12:44:22 AM

I am also struggling with accepting that I have done my best in providing her shelter, food, and love. And that she has done her best to provide companionship.

Obvious human nature is obvious, huh?

6/3/2011 12:48:33 AM

Uhh drinking a ton of water can be a sign of diabetes

[Edited on June 3, 2011 at 1:12 PM. Reason : .]

6/3/2011 1:11:12 PM

my mom took our dog (yellow lab) to get put down about a year ago... she didn't tell me until 2 days after the deed was done... kind of pissed me off. i know saying goodbye one last time wouldn't have made a huge difference, but i still would have liked to.

6/3/2011 1:33:09 PM