6/24/2009 5:54:05 PM

I think you confused "program" with "next year's team"

6/24/2009 5:56:05 PM

If that's the Duke program, what's the NC State program look like

6/24/2009 5:56:57 PM

look inside the commode for NC State's basketball program

6/24/2009 5:59:16 PM

no, i meant the decline of their program.

they cant get a big man (since 04 and that was mcroberts...)

they cant keep players (i know williams situtation is "different")

They miss on top recruits year after year. (patterson, boynton-sp, wall, other pg that commited to CAL

The image of their team is tarnished

etc.

to say there hasnt been a steep dropoff would be wrong IMO


im not sure how i feel about this one

[Edited on June 24, 2009 at 6:00 PM. Reason : .]

6/24/2009 5:59:18 PM

K will probably hang himself if he misses on Harrison Barnes.

6/24/2009 6:03:00 PM

And yet this coming season we will lose to Duke each time we meet.

Quote :

"The image of their team is tarnished"

What is our image then Mr. Grace Superfan Optimist?

6/24/2009 6:04:57 PM

so why are you defending dude?

perhaps we have just discovered why you are so anti-state

6/24/2009 6:08:16 PM

Anti-State haha that's a good one.

I fucking hate Duke and Coach K. I'm one of the few with NyM410 that pulls for UNC to beat them.

6/24/2009 6:09:12 PM

you're clearly on the fence as a state fan.

true state fans NEVER pull for unc

6/24/2009 6:12:17 PM

Quote :

"TRUE STATE FANS"

6/24/2009 6:15:53 PM

^^ to hell with that. i'm with them, duke is the worst. much higher concentration of arrogant pricks within their student body than unc.

back to the topic - yeah, duke is down since the first half of this decade, but honestly, the level of success they had then is impossible to maintain for more than 5-6 years. but here's hoping they don't make it back to the final 4 for a LOOOONG time...

[Edited on June 24, 2009 at 6:24 PM. Reason : .]

6/24/2009 6:24:12 PM

Quote :

"And yet this coming season we will lose to Duke each time we meet."

I thought we play them only once this season and at home?

6/24/2009 6:24:19 PM

the 2010 recruiting class is basically K's last hope. it could turn out to be really good though. Andre Dawkins + Josh Hairston + Tyler Thornton + Seth Curry + Harrison Barnes (obviously not a lock, but I'd say Duke is pretty high on his list) + a pg + another PF/C... a lot of potential there

I think this year will be better than 2007, but not by much

6/24/2009 6:37:13 PM

we will beat duke this year.

hell we almost beat them last year at their house.

halo rule=18384 less possessions for them

6/24/2009 6:41:28 PM

Quote :

"hell we almost beat them last year at their house. "

Quote :

"1/20/2009 NCSU 56, Duke 73"

6/24/2009 6:49:29 PM

we were up for 35 minutes of that game, singler fouled out but they didnt call an extremly obvious 5th. javi lost it, wheels fell off

6/24/2009 6:54:26 PM

Quote :

"you're clearly on the fence as a state fan."

I get flamed for saying it so much but I attend every football and basketball home game and usual several road ones especially the NC ones. STFU about my fanhood already. Just because I can admit Duke's program is still light year's ahead of us because I'm objective doesn't make me on the fence or whatever bullshit you call it. We all don't live in a fantasy world like you do.

6/24/2009 7:19:43 PM

^It's not what you can admit, but how you present yourself.

6/24/2009 7:57:38 PM

im not comparing us to duke

i am comparing duke from years past to duke today.

i figured that was obvious based on my referencing events taking place at duke 5 years ago until the present

6/24/2009 8:53:40 PM

they have fallen off in recent years, there is no question

but the fact of the matter is, in the last decade they have been to 2 final fours and won a national championship. they won more games in the 2000s than any other team. a "down year" is still close to 30 wins a season. so I wouldn't exactly say the program is in the shitter.

6/24/2009 8:59:58 PM

They are basically on a downward slide. K is not recruiting the black athlete, anymore. He needs to jump to the lakers before he leaves in shame. Elite kids want to play in more free-wheeling systems so that they can showcase themselves for the NBA. It's time for him to admit that NBA-level underclassmen are better than college-level upperclassmen.

6/24/2009 9:50:20 PM

if LA offers the job to Coach K again, he'd be a fool not to take it

6/24/2009 9:58:54 PM

Quote :

"you're clearly on the fence as a state fan."

Being constantly critical of NC State athletics does not mean you're not a State fan. If that were true then NC State wouldn't HAVE a fanbase at all.

Quote :

"They are basically on a downward slide. K is not recruiting the black athlete, anymore. He needs to jump to the lakers before he leaves in shame. Elite kids want to play in more free-wheeling systems so that they can showcase themselves for the NBA. It's time for him to admit that NBA-level underclassmen are better than college-level upperclassmen."

I agree Duke is on a downward slide, and that top-tier recruits want to play at schools where they can improve their NBA stock. Indeed,

I disagree with the notion that K isn't "recruiting the black athlete." For pete sake his 2001 championship team had ONE white guy (Dunleavy). The truth is that Coach K hasalways recruited to a certain profile - that being well rounded, mature kids from stable homes that were genuinely interested in pursuing academics at Duke. Pretty much all the black players on Duke's teams have fit this profile to one degree or another.

To me, the problems that Duke has experienced recently stem from the following:

1A) The pool of players fitting Coach K's profile has been shrinking. More players are coming to college with both eyes fixed on the NBA. The top tier of players are leaving school sooner and sooner, which means fewer and fewer care about the academic prestige of the school that they're attending. Even if players care about academics, they may still end up leaving after just a year (like Luol Deng).

1B) Another reason for shrinking pool of Duke-type players has been the rise of AAU coaches and "under-the-table" agents. Bad influences are everywhere, and Coach K has thus far elected not to deal with them. That means Duke isn't getting any of the top-tier recruits, and it's tough to be an elite-level school without elite-level talent.

2) The profile of the successful college bball coach has shifted in favor of the workaholic recruiter. This is why Roy Williams, despite a similar distaste for AAU coaches and shady agents and an emphasis on being student-athlete, has kept UNC near the top of the heap for the last few years. The guy recruits as hard or harder than any other coach in the country. Coach K on the other hand has spent a lot of time running the US Olympic squad in addition to other business ventures and charitable causes. IMO he's spreading himself too thin (which btw is exactly what happened to Valvano after winning the 1983 championship at State), and in college bball today it takes an extraordinary effort recruiting-wise to keep pace with everyone else.

6/25/2009 6:43:38 PM

jesus h...

6/25/2009 6:45:42 PM

he wants to be a sports reporter SOOOOOOO bad....

6/25/2009 7:00:04 PM

Quote :

"DUKE BASKETBALL DISSERTATION"

[Edited on June 25, 2009 at 7:01 PM. Reason : corey maggette pretty much is the only retort needed here]

6/25/2009 7:00:18 PM

so is Phil Jack gonna retire and is K gonna jump ship for sunny Los Angelas?

6/25/2009 7:04:59 PM

Quote :

"corey maggette pretty much is the only retort needed here"

exception proves the rule? he's pretty much the only guy i can think of that fits that as well..

6/26/2009 12:28:02 PM

Quote :

"they won more games in the 2000s than any other team."

Not only that, they won more games in the 2000s than any program has won in any decade.

6/26/2009 12:39:38 PM

Quote :

"he wants to be a sports reporter SOOOOOOO bad...."

Oh most definitely, but not in this economy. Thanks for the vote of confidence tho.

Quote :

"jesus h..."

It's amusing to see how many different ways you can express your distaste for reading more than three sentences at a time.

Just outa curiosity, how long have you two been this scared of complete thoughts?

[Edited on June 26, 2009 at 12:52 PM. Reason : ]

6/26/2009 12:50:32 PM

i know you think you're being clever, but you're not. the goal here isn't for me to read paragraphs and paragraphs of shit i already know, the goal is to have a casual conversation about sports.

if your books were appropriate i'd read them, but they're not.

6/26/2009 1:08:11 PM

we were up until the 11minute mark when Sid thought it was a great idea to pull all our starters for 5 minutes and blow the game.

and oh yea, we didnt score a FG in the final 7 minutes or so

6/26/2009 1:50:41 PM

i will be taking over at Duke soon

6/26/2009 3:44:14 PM

^doubtful, Duke is tired of losing on the first weekend of the tourney

6/26/2009 3:52:45 PM

Quote :

"i know you think you're being clever, but you're not."

First off, if I was really clever I wouldn't bother having this stupid argument point with you... again...

Quote :

" the goal here isn't for me to read paragraphs and paragraphs of shit i already know"

You seem to take my posts rather personally, as if I was insulting you. Please explain.

Quote :

" the goal is to have a casual conversation about sports."

I have no problem with that. I'm expressing a complete thought, and sometimes that takes 2 words and other times it doesn't.

Quote :

"if your books were appropriate i'd read them, but they're not"

Please define "appropriate." All I know is you don't like anything that's "long" and "is shit you already know." Too much room for interpretation.

More importantly, my post ran long b/c it had to. You have to take a more in-depth look at this particular issue if you want to avoid letting silly explanations like "Coach K doesn't recruit black guys anymore." In a 5 min conversation I won't bring this stuff up, but this a forum for pete sake. We all the time in the world to kick this topic around. So why not discuss it more thoroughly?

If I'm in the minority, speak up now. If no one wants to have a more intelligent coversation then just tell me. I don't feel the need to waste anyone's time.

6/26/2009 4:49:07 PM

shut up

6/26/2009 4:52:13 PM

Christ man, no one reads that shit

6/26/2009 4:54:43 PM

Quote :

"Not only that, they won more games in the 2000s than any program has won in any decade."

It's because teams play more games now than they did in the 60s. You're seriously think Dook in 2000s is better than UCLA in the 60s?

6/26/2009 10:19:14 PM