if I wanted to build an AR-15 with sub-MOA accuracy, about how much would I be looking at spending, and what advice/recommendations do you have in terms of components?

3/20/2007 8:44:23 AM

Is there a particular reason for an AR build versus picking up a boltgun?

3/20/2007 9:50:17 AM

Should I warn the vice president that you're coming?

3/20/2007 10:18:02 AM

^^ i already have a Remington 700 in 7mm REM.

I want a very accurate centerfire .22 (more economical and less punishing to the shooter), and would also like to have an AR. i could have a bolt action rifle worked to that kind of accuracy pretty easily, then just get a more basic AR, but it would surely be cheaper to just build a very accurate AR-15.

3/20/2007 10:23:04 AM

Check out Midway USA for parts. I mean, building an AR is like working on a 93 Mustang, the options are close to endless.

For what its worth, if you're familiar with the HK 416, there is a company in Virginia that makes (or will convert) rifles from direct gas injection to a piston driven design: http://www.lwrifles.com/ Worth checking out.

3/20/2007 12:01:57 PM

I'm not sure a sub MOA AR is going to fulfill your AR wants, because after all is said and done, it's pretty much un AR like. Bull barrel, free floating, Magpul PRS would be the first things off the top of my head... I'll ask around, I've never had the bug to build one in that direction, so I don't really know.

3/20/2007 4:30:24 PM

^^ thats badass

too bad that the upper is $1600

3/20/2007 4:42:15 PM

im just reading, but for my general knowledge what does sub-MOA mean

3/20/2007 4:56:21 PM

MOA- 1 inch grouping of at least 3 rounds at 100 yards. sub moa would be consistantly smaller than 1 inch.

each 100 yards after that you add an inch, ie 2 inch group at 200 yards 3 inches at 300 yards.

3/20/2007 5:10:18 PM

how accurate is a normal AR

3/20/2007 5:17:46 PM

^^ well, that's an approximation--not the definition...but in practice, it's close enough.

MOA stands for "minute of angle".

3/20/2007 5:28:41 PM

ok that makes sense

3/20/2007 5:29:01 PM

I think it could be done fairly cheap


I'm actually going to build 2 more ARs

I want to build a 24" benchrest rifle and an M4

I need to build those and an AK74 and I'll be about done with mil stuff like that

I also want to find myself a .17 bolt gun and hop it up a little bit

[Edited on March 20, 2007 at 5:52 PM. Reason : ...]

3/20/2007 5:47:11 PM

My advice would be to not start with this rifle from Shrapnel's gallery



[Edited on March 20, 2007 at 5:59 PM. Reason : .]

3/20/2007 5:58:34 PM

now there's a happy camper

3/20/2007 6:04:05 PM

lol, you're not supposed to drive over your rifle

3/20/2007 6:04:21 PM

fortunatly that wasnt me.


thats what happens when the bradley driver leaves his rifle propped up against the HET trailer they are lowering down to drive the bradley on

[Edited on March 20, 2007 at 6:13 PM. Reason : x]

3/20/2007 6:12:00 PM

that one probably shoots a bit high

3/20/2007 6:15:13 PM

Quote :

"Basically spec a non-chrome lined barrel from a reputable manufacturer and a free float fore-end and you'd be in pretty good shape from an accuracy standpoint."

Quote :

"my 16" coyote rifle shot sub moa. You can get a varmint model from just about every manufacturere now and under a grand"

Quote :

"About 900-1000 for a Bushmaster Varmint Special. I've seen 'em new for 879 "

Quote :

"i could shoot sub MOA groups with my RRA 24" varminter"

These are the replies I garnered..

3/20/2007 8:10:18 PM

Bushmaster makes a nice new one called the "Predator" if you're looking a complete rifle.

Or you could build a gun from a 20 or 24" non-chrome lined barrel, free float handguards, etc.

A friend of mine is probably going to be selling a nice 24 inch upper soon, LMK if you're interested.

3/21/2007 12:45:07 PM

A firend of mine bought an upper from Model 1 Sales.
20" stainless bull barrel and free float forend.
Add a bolt/carrier and you're looking at $450-500 for the upper.

Upper+stripped lower+plus parts kit= $700-800+
Thats without optics of course.
When he put it together he had problems with the bolt release lever sticking. That's no big deal, just needs a little filing for clearance. I don't remember who manufactured his parts kit.

His gun shoots 1MOA consistantly with bulk 55 gr Remington FMJ.
I'm sure it would be consistantly sub-MOA with handloads...or something like Federal Gold Metal or Black Hills Match.

Advice?...
-Get good glass
-Get a two stage trigger or higher quality single stage.
-Consider getting NM components.
-Pick a barrel 20" or longer, that helps with stability and at really far ranges you may retain more accuracy due to higher velocities.
-1 in 9" twist
-Don't get a flash hider or muzzle brake.
-Paying for fluting doesn't buy you accuracy...but it does change the balance if that matters to you.
-Make sure the pin holes in the upper and lower recievers are the same size.
-Smaller companies can turn out equal quality components compared to the more well known (and more expensive) manufacturers, so do some internet searching before you buy.

[Edited on March 21, 2007 at 7:02 PM. Reason : Ohh yeah, get it chambered in 223Rem, not 5.56 NATO]

3/21/2007 7:01:12 PM

look, TA has a TWW account!!

3/21/2007 7:07:52 PM

STFU

3/21/2007 7:12:05 PM

stay away from the bushmasters, the QC can be spotty and there is something funny about the bolts.

http://www.del-ton.com is some fellows in SE NC, nice folks.

3/21/2007 9:46:41 PM

Quote :

"Ohh yeah, get it chambered in 223Rem, not 5.56 NATO"

i thought they were synonymous

3/22/2007 5:26:21 AM

they are not, there is a one way interchange, I cant remember what it is though. Look into a 6.8SPC rifle as well, same platform, different upper.

3/22/2007 7:02:01 AM

Quote :

"NCSUStinger Very Excited 46328 Posts user info edit post look, TA has a TWW account!! 3/21/2007 7:07:52 PM Fumbler All American 2857 Posts user info edit post STFU "

hahah.GG Stinger

3/22/2007 8:09:11 AM

Quote :

"i thought they were synonymous"

Interchangeable, not synonymous. FWIW, the 5.56 NATO chamber is usually spec'd to looser military tolerances for reliability. .223 chamber should be a little tighter and more accurate. It's probably not going to have much effect either way.

The main difference between 5.56 and .223 cartridges is (I think) the fact that the 5.56 case is a little thicker in places and loaded to slightly higher pressures in some cases.

I would reccomend a 1:7 twist for 62 grain and heavier match grade loads which I'll assume you'll be shooting more of than 55grain milspec/bulk blasting fodder. If you want to shoot all weights of bullets, then the 1:9 would be your choice. The faster 1:7 twist does do better with the heavy match bullets though.

Good glass comes from Burris, Leupold, or Nikon. You can't go wrong with any of those three.

As far as lowers, I'd feel comfortable with anything from Bushmaster, Doublestar, Rock River, Colt, Stag Arms, or DPMS. They're all pretty good.

There's really no end to what you can do with these rifles, other than your desire and budget.

3/22/2007 9:52:00 AM

^Good post.

3/22/2007 3:12:31 PM