They just did the ground breaking for the new RBC headquarters being built downtown on Fayetteville Street. They have a site up on the condos that will be on the 23rd-33rd floors. They are fuckin sweet!!

http://www.rbcplazacondos.com

9/26/2006 6:07:38 PM

Starting at 200K, B.

9/26/2006 6:12:01 PM

these sound more reasonably priced than the ones at the corner of morgan/dawson

9/26/2006 6:19:19 PM

how long til we see a thread where amsterdam### is thinking about buying one?

9/26/2006 6:20:21 PM

those look really nice, and seem much cheaper than the rest of raleigh condos around

9/26/2006 6:50:19 PM

i bet when they say starting at 200s, thats $299k for the 889 sq foot place. Id expect a reasonable 2 bedroom to go for $500k+

The amenities such as the pool 20 floors up is awesome

But I can only imagine that place has absolutely NO visitor parking, and the worst traffic in all of raleigh everytime you left to walk to your car down 25 floors and down the street.....

I dont know, would you pay $250k for one?

9/26/2006 7:15:50 PM

That unit 12 looks really awkward

9/26/2006 8:08:54 PM

probably would be a good investment

9/26/2006 8:22:35 PM

might have been a good investment 2 years ago.

9/26/2006 9:27:37 PM

i would in a huge city. not raleigh. i'll take 3k sq ft for 300k please

9/26/2006 9:31:56 PM

^

Please to move to a larger city.

Thanks,

Citizens of Raleigh.

9/26/2006 9:38:17 PM

i mean itd be an awesome place, but nobody could come over with parking issues

9/26/2006 10:13:44 PM

^^dont get me wrong i love raleigh but paying 500/sqft in a 100/sqft market is just not logical.

9/26/2006 10:27:33 PM

unless you will be working at the building and making a shit load of money and you just don't care

9/26/2006 10:32:30 PM

Quote :

"i would in a huge city. not raleigh. i'll take 3k sq ft for 300k please"

My parents are looking for a condo to have for football games and I just went to look at a 3000 sq foot condo downtown (near west st.) the other day with them, asking $750,000.......so good luck with that $300K, a 3000 sq footer will be $1 - $1.2 mil in 2-3 years, bet on it, downtown is about to explode

9/27/2006 3:51:56 AM

I don't think he is talking about a condo downtown for 300k. He is talking about a house, somewhere in Willow Springs.

9/27/2006 8:46:17 AM

downtown is not about to explode. Have you seen how many of those places are going up? There aren't that many people in raleigh that are going to pay that kind of money to live in a downtown with really not all that much around them. They're goign to saturate the market and then the bubble is going to burst. 300k for a 900 sq ft apt in raleigh is just ridiculous. They'll be giving these places away in a couple years when they figure out that it wasn't such a great idea to put up ten different high rise apartment buildings in two years that are all basically the same.

9/27/2006 9:17:04 AM

9/27/2006 9:20:43 AM

Quote :

"downtown is not about to explode. Have you seen how many of those places are going up? There aren't that many people in raleigh that are going to pay that kind of money to live in a downtown with really not all that much around them. They're goign to saturate the market and then the bubble is going to burst. 300k for a 900 sq ft apt in raleigh is just ridiculous. They'll be giving these places away in a couple years when they figure out that it wasn't such a great idea to put up ten different high rise apartment buildings in two years that are all basically the same."

This is my impression too. I think the RTP area is behind the bubble trend that everyone else is experiencing. They didn't think the area could handle the condos until they looked around everywhere else in the country and saw they were building them, then decided (too late) that Raleigh could, and now they are going up all over the place.

9/27/2006 9:46:51 AM

Quote :

"My parents are looking for a condo to have for football games"

That's a biiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiig condo.

The price tag I saw was $189,000 for 889 sq. ft.

9/27/2006 9:48:13 AM

They are only asking in the 230/sqft range and that is actually decent for Raleigh, given the premium location and view. The decent areas of Raleigh have homes going for $200-$250/sqft already so its not like this is exorbitant.

Quote :

"Have you seen how many of those places are going up? "

This isn't your run of the mill condo development. THis is going to be the tallest building in Raleigh by a good clip. The Reynolds Tower and Soleil center are the only developments that rival the RBC Tower, and they are still in the final planning stages.

9/27/2006 9:54:43 AM

It's not worth it to live in those condos...not for at least another 15 years. By that point Raleigh will have the necessary density to make downtown living desireable enough for most people. Until then it will be people who live down there for the image it gives them, not any functional reason.

9/27/2006 9:55:33 AM

^exactly.

and like I said, it'd be different if there were only a couple of these places going up. But there's literally like ten different downtown "luxury" condos going up within three three miles of each other. I can't imagine there are that many people in raleigh looking to live on glenwood for that price. I mean, glenwood is okay and all, but Raleigh is still lightyears away from being a real downtown.

9/27/2006 10:04:39 AM

I wonder when the prices on these things will go down. I expect they will be high to start, then bottom out in like 5 years, then in 10 years be back up again. So....wait 5 years then buy for an investment?

9/27/2006 10:18:36 AM

i dont see the prices going too far down. especially since some people are buying them now, they don't want their condos to lose value.

9/27/2006 10:23:12 AM

There aren't that many people jobs in downtown raleigh that are going to pay that kind of money so workers can afford to live in a downtown with really not all that much around them.

9/27/2006 10:24:43 AM

Yeah but with all the condos going up...supply and demand come into play. There will be too much supply in 5 years...demand will take another 10 to catch up, I expect.

9/27/2006 10:24:56 AM

^^^ nobody wants their home to lose value, but real estate bubbles burst sometimes


[Edited on September 27, 2006 at 10:27 AM. Reason : ]

9/27/2006 10:25:58 AM

you guys have to realize though there are people with money sitting around looking for something to invest in and places like this are probably pretty attractive to these people

[Edited on September 27, 2006 at 10:33 AM. Reason : ]

9/27/2006 10:29:40 AM

You guys are obviously not Real Estate gurus.

There is a reason these are being built...its called demand. Developers don't build stuff b/c its cool. They will make $$$ on these as well as others. I agree there will be a slower start but I doubt these will fall in value over the next 5 years.

I'd say they will jump in price after the last unit is filled...the prices may go down some until then but after every unit is filled I'd expect them to increase a small percentage every year.

Also if (and I do mean IF) the Regional Rail catches on these would be popular for singles who work in RTP. That would be a huge selling point...no traffic and can still live downtown and work in RTP.

9/27/2006 10:30:49 AM

^

That would be about the only way I would live downtown.. Right now I live out in the sticks and a rail system wouldn't be convenient to me and I rarely go downtown Raleigh anyways.

9/27/2006 10:34:50 AM

Quote :

"It's not worth it to live in those condos...not for at least another 15 years. By that point Raleigh will have the necessary density to make downtown living desireable enough for most people. Until then it will be people who live down there for the image it gives them, not any functional reason."

Premium condos and "worth it" never go together. People in the market for living in the luxury condos at the top of the tallest building in Raleigh are not looking for value.

Quote :

"and like I said, it'd be different if there were only a couple of these places going up. But there's literally like ten different downtown "luxury" condos going up within three three miles of each other. I can't imagine there are that many people in raleigh looking to live on glenwood for that price. I mean, glenwood is okay and all, but Raleigh is still lightyears away from being a real downtown."

Again, these condos cannot be lumpedinto the same generic "luxury condo" endeavor downtown. This is the tallest building in Raleigh. Only two other projects rival it: neither has started and one is at Crabtree. So you can't compare this to everything else. If there was a luxury condo venture that made sense it would be these. OH and you might think Glenwood is just "ok" but there is good reason why it was highlighted in the NY Times "Travel" section as destination-worthy.

Pretty much all of downtown Raleigh is being re-built. Take a look here to see some of the plans that are in the works.
http://www.raleighmsa.com/newProjects-downtown.html

Quote :

"There aren't that many people jobs in downtown raleigh that are going to pay that kind of money so workers can afford to live in a downtown with really not all that much around them."

Apparently you don't understand that buildings like the RBC Tower are not condos only. Its going to be the home of numerous businesses, not to mention the U.S. headquarters for RBC Bank... it brings jobs to the area.


[Edited on September 27, 2006 at 10:38 AM. Reason : .]

9/27/2006 10:35:23 AM

nobody on tww is a real estate guru

the builders will make money even if the condo prices drop in half so it makes sense for the sellers

[Edited on September 27, 2006 at 10:38 AM. Reason : You must enter a reason for editing this message. You must enter a reason for editing this message. ]

9/27/2006 10:35:47 AM

Quote :

"There aren't that many people jobs in downtown raleigh that are going to pay that kind of money so workers can afford to live in a downtown with really not all that much around them."

since when do people have to live exactly where they work? how many people live in RTP? living in cities in general is hot again, and a lot of yuppies are moving there, as well as a lot of older people once they retire. there is plenty of money in raleigh, and the cost of living is still incredibly cheap compared to most places.

9/27/2006 10:40:13 AM

I was joking about someone commuting to NYC from RBC condos but nm.



[Edited on September 27, 2006 at 10:48 AM. Reason : ]

9/27/2006 10:44:42 AM

commuting in NYC is a far cry from communiting to RTP from downtown raleigh.

9/27/2006 10:47:08 AM

i'd consider buying one if i were in the market when they were completed

9/27/2006 10:47:12 AM

Quote :

"There aren't that many people jobs in downtown raleigh that are going to pay that kind of money so workers can afford to live in a downtown with really not all that much around them."

Half of downtown residents work in RTP. You people are forgetting about all of the young, mobile creatives that want to live in a vibrant downtown environment. You see, when people graduate from college and move into the real world, they often choose to buy a residence rather than live in Lake Park for their whole life.

You also have to take into account all of the empty nesters who are tired of the upkeep on their home. Baby boomers are another driver of the national trend toward downtown living.



[Edited on September 27, 2006 at 11:07 AM. Reason : .]

9/27/2006 11:01:28 AM

I'd probably live in one of these places if I didn't really enjoy making a lot of noise (playing drums, loud music, etc.) The idea of not having to do any external maintenance is really appealing to me and it would be nice to just walk to the places I'm going to drink or eat.

9/27/2006 11:03:49 AM

the builders will make their money. it's the people that buy these condos thinking they're going to make money off off of em that are dreaming.

and while these might be the nicest condos of the bunch, I'm talking about that dowtown market in general. We dont' have an pro sports teams downtown, markets, ect. It's big city prices without big city attractions.

9/27/2006 11:11:37 AM

Quote :

"But I can only imagine that place has absolutely NO visitor parking, and the worst traffic in all of raleigh everytime you left to walk to your car down 25 floors and down the street..... I dont know, would you pay $250k for one?"

[no]

the bottom of the real estate market is gonna fall out pretty hard in the near future (not land, but housing and condos and shit)

I'd expect rent and such to decline too...

[Edited on September 27, 2006 at 11:37 AM. Reason : s]

9/27/2006 11:36:17 AM

Quote :

"But I can only imagine that place has absolutely NO visitor parking, and the worst traffic in all of raleigh everytime you left to walk to your car down 25 floors and down the street..... I dont know, would you pay $250k for one?""

um, welcome to most cities?

9/27/2006 11:39:47 AM

WOW those look awesome

9/27/2006 11:44:47 AM

It's funny, the only people who seem to be interested in these condos downtown are investors. Investors are selling to investors. Completed buildings are devoid of occupants. If that isn't a sure sign of a bubble, I don't know what is. Most of these condos will end up leased as apartments. When the high vacancy cycle comes back, you'll be able to rent them cheaper than buying them.

Of course, long term I think these condos are legitimate investments. If you rent them out for 15-30 years, you'll own it outright and it will have appreciated enough to counteract whatever corrections may occur. But I think a significant portion (if not the majority) of the investors (many of which overextend themselves) are hoping to flip rather than hold them.

9/27/2006 11:58:51 AM

personally i like the downtown developement, i think its cool. i have waited a long time for this to happen

9/27/2006 12:06:03 PM

Patman - great point....If I was interested, I would probably buy one and rent it out to pay the mortgage before id actually live in it. Its just too impractical....lugging groceries from God knows where down the block and up 25 floors to your place.

Regardless of the "bubble", you know these things are going to appreciate like crazy. Hell, everything in Raleigh, Apex, Cary has appreciated like crazy. 3 story townhomes and "high turnover" apartments like those condos have appreciated 30-50% in the past few years.

One thing we're fogetting is all the incredible ammenities, like a POOL 25 floors up!

9/27/2006 12:12:23 PM

^but you have to remember that there's a whole bunch of these things all going in at the same time. Are there really that many people looking to live on glenwood for that price that could drive the price of these places up? I just don't think the demand is there. I can see paying 500k for a house near glenwood, but not a 900 sq ft condo. I just don't think downtown has enough to offer at this point. They're nice, though, I'll give em that.

9/27/2006 12:30:33 PM

http://raleigh.craigslist.org/rfs/212565512.html

here's a glenwood south condo. i've seen this on craigslist for over 2 months. i think most of these are overpriced.

9/27/2006 12:34:43 PM

My fiance's house is on Glenwood South...in "Brooklyn"...honestly...they are overpriced...considering our utility bill is out of the ASS because of a lot of zoning ordinances regarding windows, doors, etc.

[Edited on September 27, 2006 at 12:44 PM. Reason : ^^ the demand is there, because its trendy...]

9/27/2006 12:44:13 PM

Quote :

"the bottom of the real estate market is gonna fall out pretty hard in the near future (not land, but housing and condos and shit) I'd expect rent and such to decline too..."

It is around the rest of the country but not in the Triangle. We are one of the few markets in the country that are still growing even in the decline.

Quote :

"It's funny, the only people who seem to be interested in these condos downtown are investors. Investors are selling to investors. Completed buildings are devoid of occupants. If that isn't a sure sign of a bubble, I don't know what is. Most of these condos will end up leased as apartments. When the high vacancy cycle comes back, you'll be able to rent them cheaper than buying them. Of course, long term I think these condos are legitimate investments. If you rent them out for 15-30 years, you'll own it outright and it will have appreciated enough to counteract whatever corrections may occur. But I think a significant portion (if not the majority) of the investors (many of which overextend themselves) are hoping to flip rather than hold them."

If I am not mistaken, RBC Towers is one of the developments that is preventing investment/lease ownership. They actually are incorporating clauses into purchase contracts that allow ownership to be stripped from individuals who are not using the condos for residence.

Quote :

"but you have to remember that there's a whole bunch of these things all going in at the same time. Are there really that many people looking to live on glenwood for that price that could drive the price of these places up? I just don't think the demand is there. I can see paying 500k for a house near glenwood, but not a 900 sq ft condo. I just don't think downtown has enough to offer at this point. They're nice, though, I'll give em that."

For the third fucking time, this is not your average luxury condo development. This is about as big as it gets. And yes, people do want to live around Glenwood that much. Heck, people were paying $400,000 for condos on Glenwood 5 years ago. Raleigh is one of the absolute best places in this country, especially for the young professional and the single. In the college world microcosm it probably doesn't seem like it but its happening before your eyes. Raleigh is not small-time.

9/27/2006 12:46:48 PM